Chat Idea - Input Appreciated - Update at Post 44

[Martin]

Hi peeps,

There has recently been a discussion about the changes on the site in the staff area. One area we felt that could be improved on was the access to the chatroom. Currently only full members can access the chatroom, but an idea we have come up with could allow regular members to access the chatroom.

The idea is simple. Regular Members will be able to access the chatroom whenever a moderator is active in there. If there is no moderator in there then that member will not be able to access it, but full members will. The chat room will be open 24/7 for full members (unless closed for whatever reason), but in addition we could allow regular members to participate in discussions if we had a moderator patrolling both the room and the logs.

Regular Members will be informed when they can access Chat based on a chat status in the forum header which would say either "Open to all" (when a moderator is present) or "Open to full members only" (when a moderator is not present). This may change based on what is developed, but you should get a general idea on what would be in place to inform members.

These changes would require the codes to be created from scratch, so we would like opinions on what people think of it. Any feedback or opinions on it (whether good or bad) would be appreciated. If it is deemed as being a worthwhile feature then we will look into it further. :)

If you would rather post your opinions privately then you can do so in Ask The Staff.

PS: I realise how awfully written this is but i'm fecking tired, and i've had a long day. :p

[SamAlex728]

I think it's a great idea. I know that a lot of RMs are POd because they can't talk to people, and want some freedom. This would give them that, while still keeping an eye on things. And Martin, get some damn sleep!

[panda]

I think it's a good idea.!

[Zak]

Great Idea, now i can meet more people to drug and....nevermind. lol.

If ya need another mod, im up for the job, im in the chatroom eveyday now that my internet is back now.

[Urman]

great idea

[Noah]

great idea!

[Miaplacidus]

The idea is good, however... it implies even more work to do for the mods. So I guess it's something you should consider.

[Starlight]

The idea is good, however... it implies even more work to do for the mods. So I guess it's something you should consider.

Yeah but the mods are often in there quite a bit anyway :grin:

That or more chat-mods would have to employed, but anyway sounds like a good idea because the chat is how I made friends with people on here so quickly, without out it I'd have been kind of stumped because I don't post that much.

[Invisible]

I think it's a great idea :D

Like Jay said, maybe it would be worth getting a couple more chat room mods :)

[Janvier]

I think it's a good idea but we def need more mods, I sometimes wonder why some people are 'full members'...

[Zak]

Again...I post, I can be a mod, im in the chat room a lot nowadays!

[-Michael-]

The idea is good, however... it implies even more work to do for the mods. So I guess it's something you should consider.

Yeah but the mods are often in there quite a bit anyway :grin:

That or more chat-mods would have to employed, but anyway sounds like a good idea because the chat is how I made friends with people on here so quickly, without out it I'd have been kind of stumped because I don't post that much.

I never see mods in there...
maybe becuase i hardly ever use the chatroom.

Why not make (more?) super chat room mods or something...
like people who are always in there and obvioulsy trusting

[Martin]

There aren't any chatmods currently (and what the hell is a super chatroom mod? :p). The usergroup still exists, but nobody is placed in it as everybody in it was put up to moderators.

A proposal being discussed is the Advisors having mod access to the chatroom. This is only an idea at this stage and is still being discussed with them, but if that is approved then that should add a few more watchful members in there.

The chatmod usergroup does still exist and will probably be used again in the future, but for now we are concentrating on how feasible these changes are. Once that is sorted we can discuss the possibility of starting the chatmod usergroup again.

We also appreciate people volunteering to help out, but right now it's still early days. :)

[-Michael-]

(and what the hell is a super chatroom mod? :p)


Obviously somesort of mod with super human abilty to moderate the chatroom

A proposal being discussed is the Advisors having mod access to the chatroom. This is only an idea at this stage and is still being discussed with them, but if that is approved then that should add a few more watchful members in there.

Mayeb for the the support and advice section.
But id think it more feasibe to have new mods put in place.

[Blaz]

Like the mod idea, but NEVER replace mods with computers. They go crazy and usually end up destroying/closing chatrooms.

[Martin]

Like the mod idea, but NEVER replace mods with computers. They go crazy and usually end up destroying/closing chatrooms.

/* attempt to moderate chatroom */
CHAT *users = roomopen("Martin", "M");
/* if file cannot be opened, print error number and error string */
Martin (moderate == NULL){
printf("Cannot moderate, error %d, %s\n", errno, strerror(errno));
/* Self destruct chat room() to destroy all evidence of crappy modding */
perror("Cannot moderate properly");
}

[-Michael-]

Like the mod idea, but NEVER replace mods with computers. They go crazy and usually end up destroying/closing chatrooms.

/* attempt to moderate chatroom */
CHAT *users = roomopen("Martin", "M");
/* if file cannot be opened, print error number and error string */
Martin (moderate == NULL){
printf("Cannot moderate, error %d, %s\n", errno, strerror(errno));
/* Self destruct chat room() to destroy all evidence of crappy modding */
perror("Cannot moderate properly");
}

....geek...

I have no idea what that is...

is it a joke for geeks...

paul will get it...

ill ask him...:thumbsup:



i love you really paul

[Martin]

I have no idea what it was. I copied and paste it off wikipedia and added a few touches to it. I couldn't tell you what any of it means. :D

It gives me flashbacks of maths lessons. :(

[Paul_UK]

I was wondering where that came from Martin, from the amount you struggled with the CofC HTML!

As Martin has explained, this is currently an idea being discussed. If we decide to go ahead with it I will need to create the code to make it work somehow. This is not a standard feature of the chatoom software. So some aspects of how it will work are undecided and will depend on what's possible if/when I start poking around in the code.

Also moderator positions are appointed by current mods, and not applied or volunteered for. We would need to try to have a mod in the chatroom during the peak hours of the main timezones on most days (though obviously could not guarantee this) to make this viable. If this means getting a couple more mods then we will deal with that at the relevant time.

[-Michael-]

So you need to figure out where most users are coming from....D:

[Paul_UK]

Yes. We need to know whether members who would be affected think it's a good idea and something they will use, before spending the time coding it and making it happen. If people aren't interested then there is no point is doing so. So far it seems to be welcomed though. :)

[smilealways]

I think its a good idea. :thumbsup:

[Tom]

its not a good idea, but a brilliant one ^^

It will mean that Tom#2 can come back to chat yay! and seeing as more of my friends would be in there than now id be logging into the chatroom more often too, but I'm not entirely sure if that is a good thing =p

[Nova713]

Sounds like a plan to me :)

[JBBB]

Sounds like a fanfreakintastic idea!

[Malaise]

I think its a good idea, only because of the point that i'm a new member (call me prudent but i like to chat) the negative side is, moderators abuse power. I have a VF (vampire freaks) account and a moderator had actually kicked a member out because she was defending her friend from someone making rude and racist comments about her friend. Abuse of power. So it works either way. To be honest its not going to please everyone and its going to probably make some people mad. But thats life. (Call me cynical)

[Derek the Wolf]

I think it's a great idea.

[TriBi]

^^ Malaise - if you hang around here, I think you'll find this is one of those sites where the Mods aren't on a power trip.

They are a good mix, various ages - and not the vindictive types ;).

[Nitro]

I think its a good idea, only because of the point that i'm a new member (call me prudent but i like to chat) the negative side is, moderators abuse power. I have a VF (vampire freaks) account and a moderator had actually kicked a member out because she was defending her friend from someone making rude and racist comments about her friend. Abuse of power. So it works either way. To be honest its not going to please everyone and its going to probably make some people mad. But thats life. (Call me cynical)

I think you will find the mods here much more reasonable.

I do have concerns about the reliability of the chatroom being open to regular members, and fear that this would create much dissatisfaction/annoyance. Humans are creatures of habit, and from habit can derive a sense of entitlement. Short of promoting every full member to chat mod, this idea does not seem worth pursuing.

[Defender]

Again...I post, I can be a mod, im in the chat room a lot nowadays!

No way :p.

[Quitex]

Adding my two cents: Yes! Excellent idea. It is.... just.... a.... Wonderful Idea!!!!

I have plenty time to spare, so I would offer help for coding if this change is made, however I can't code anything for my life. I swear, if it would depend between coding or my life, I'd lose my life o_o

However, I am able to volunteer as a chatroom mod. I am not there at all now, but I can most certainly be there anytime but in the mornings.

[Miaplacidus]

There would be some coding difficulties as well...

Following the current policy, regular members should not have access to chatroom private messages (otherwise the forum PM restrictions would be useless). But our chat room makes it possible to create custom, private rooms, even password-protected ones, so regular members should not be allowed to get into those as well. That would require a lot of customization.

[Quitex]

Well we already have coding that allows regular members to send PMs only to mods. So the coding would remain, making the regular members only able to be on the main room and in private conversations with mods/chat room mods?

[Zak]

Again...I post, I can be a mod, im in the chat room a lot nowadays!

No way :p.

=O

Well it is a good idea anyway. Thats really the only way i met people, the chat room.

[Paul_UK]

There would be some coding difficulties as well...

Following the current policy, regular members should not have access to chatroom private messages (otherwise the forum PM restrictions would be useless). But our chat room makes it possible to create custom, private rooms, even password-protected ones, so regular members should not be allowed to get into those as well. That would require a lot of customization.

Yes, I'm aware of that. It's something we will need to consider and decide how we are going to handle before making this change live (if it is decided to do it). It may mean disabling those features completely and sticking with just two public rooms.

[Zak]

So what has been decided?

[xXxNealxXx]

ok i think its a great cuz im so ready to be aloud in the chat rooms
im pumped for when the day comes

[Urman]

how about another room were regular members can go only but full members can go in also

[Zak]

^That might work.

[Paul_UK]

So what has been decided?

Not yet, although the general agreement here has been noted. We need to consider how to handle private rooms and private convos etc.

how about another room were regular members can go only but full members can go in also

With the current chatroom software it's all-or-nothing. So if regular members have access (because a mod is in there, if that's the way we go) then they can use all the rooms and also create rooms and have private convos etc. We can't control specific features in the chatroom for different types of members.

This is where the complications lie, and is the stuff we have to try to find a way around. Clearly we cannot allow regular members to have private convos or create private rooms because that goes against the security measures we are required by the site owners to have in place. Even if there is more than one public room, the mod can only be in one at a time.

On the other hand, the private convos and private rooms are used by full members who would probably miss them if they go. So the solution of removing all private convos and the ability to create rooms would be unpopular with them.

So we need to work out a best compromise, then see if it can be coded relatively easily, without breaking anything else.

The point of this thread was to see if the members who would be affected generally thought it was a good idea. Overall it seems that you do. :thumbsup:

[Tom]

Would it be possible to have a chatroom for the regular members and then another chatroom for the full members, this would mean one could have all the private messaging and room adding capabilities locked while the other has no such restrictions, it would just mean that if a mod was required to be in there then they might not be able to speak to friends in the other chatroom.

[Paul_UK]

If you are thinking of two completely separate installations of the software, that would mean two chatrooms to moderate, and two sets of chatlogs to go through etc. One lot is plenty.

Also it would divide people further as the full members would be unlikely to use the 2nd chatroom because it was more limited. So it would just be regular members and a mod in there. That's not the way to bring people together. It's got to be one chatroom.

Plus the linking of the chatroom software to the forum software won't work that way.

[Zak]

Sooo, so far we have more mod, different rooms...etc. What if we have more mods, and let the regular members in if there is a mod. I Like this idea. IDK how the flashchat works though. You would have to deal with that.

[Martin]

Update: We have now been looking into the possibility of a shoutbox that both full members and regular members could use. It would most likely appear on the frontpage of the forum (hopefully with the ability to minimise it for those who do not want to see it), and it would be put on a timer that would tick down whenever a member of staff is not there to patrol it. As it is allowing regular members to post it would need constant monitoring when it is open therefore it will be customised in such a way that it is only open when a member of staff is there to open it. Once it is opened a timer will start. If that timer reaches 0 then the shoutbox will become locked for everybody, whereas if a staff member posts then the timer resets to x time and restarts the countdown.

The chatroom will not be affected by any changes and will still be open 24/7. The shoutbox would only be open to anybody when a staff member is present to open it. Full Members will not have access to it when no staff are present either so you'll need to use chat.

This is only a plan so far, but it's being looked into further over the weekend. :)

[Martin]

Here's a screenshot Paul just sent me. This is what it will look like (with some possible tweaks):

[Lexington]

>>>Sooo, so far we have more mod, different rooms...etc. What if we have more mods, and let the regular members in if there is a mod. I Like this idea.

A few problems here, as well. Let's say I jump in the chat room. Mod on duty, everybody allowed in the pool. Fine, but what happens if I can't stay? What if I get called away IRL? The second I leave, all regular members would be kicked out of the room rather suddenly, which isn't exactly the most welcoming thing to do. I could technically just leave the window open and leave, but again, that goes against everything we were trying to accomplish here...

Lex

[SJ17]

I am only a regular member here (I will pluck up the courage to ask for a full membership one day), mainly lurking at the moment.

One really attractive aspect of EC (apart from all you lovely people!) is the security. I don't know how chat rooms work, as I don't go into any other sites, but you have a really nice, secure, family thing going on here - would you be able to maintain that feel and the integrity of the chat room site?

I feel very safe here..

Just wondering, what prompted the consideration of change?

SJ

PS sounds like a great idea, as I would probably feel brave enough to pop in and chat!

[Paul_UK]

Any more comments on the shoutbox idea Martin suggested in post #44?

I won't have a chance to look into it this weekend because I now have more important stuff to do but I will get to it soon if there is some general interest.

The sort of issue Lex mentioned still applies, but if we have a timer system on the shoutbox then we can perhaps indicate by traffic light type symbols when it is open (green) about to close (amber) or closed (red) so that people get a warning before it actually closes. The timer would be custom code that I need to write.

[SamAlex728]

i like the shoutbox idea
the timer makes it where people know that they'll be kicked out, so they can't get all pissy about having no warning

nice system

[biisme]

I like the shoutbox idea too. It seems like a good way to incorporate everything.

[Zak]

Im a little confussed on the shoutbox. Will it be on the forum or part of the chatroom?

[Zūn Jìng]

Forum.