Transgender on a form to identify sex!

I saw it on a counseling intake form yesterday. Here on campus, most "What is your gender" questions leave a blank line or box.

 

Yes, filling out some uni info online, I forgot to check the "male" box and now it says "other" on my papers and I'll have to change that. -.-

 

Yeah, I've seen other or unspecified on a lot of college forms I've been filling out lately.

 

I see "Other" or something along those lines on pretty much EVERY form these days, and I personally feel like "transgender" is a step backward, as it implies that this identity is mutually exclusive from male or female, or that transpeople don't somehow fit into their identified gender.

Just my take..

 

Yeah, me too. If a transgender status must be noted on, it should be a second part on the form. Or we do what Gaytheist's school does and have a fill in the blank thing

 

I feel like the "fill in the blank" deal is the most understanding/respectful, given the broad spectrum of gender identities and expressions out there. Male, Female, Transgender is like an attempt to step forward, but one that comes from a lack of understanding, and is really just a big step backward.

 

Actually it is a step forward. It's reminding people that transgender people actually do exist, and it's actually a legitimate thing.

 

Well, yeah. It's definitely a nice thought that we're being included. Personally, I'd actually like seeing something like this:

Legal Gender/Sex

Male _

Female _

Other _

Identified Gender
________

 

While I mostly agree, I'd suppose it's more of a step sideways. Like you said, it is incorrect by considering transgenders as different from male or female. However, it does acknowledge them as a legitimate group of people, which is more than most forms will suggest.

Perhaps it would be better to leave gender blank? Otherwise they would have to put boxes for male/female/intersex, with modifier boxes for transgenders and possibly noting pre-op or post-op. And that's a lot of boxes.

 

Hmm, maybe, but our difference in opinion on this would be marginal, to say the least. Regardless, the use of transgender as an identity separate from male and female can't be seen as any type of progress as it implies mutual exclusivity.

I see it is evidence of a fundamental lack of understanding of trans* issues, plain and simple, and so, to me, this naturally makes it a step backward, as it indicates that transpeople are gaining recognition from a perspective of ignorance, which poses a large danger to the trans* image should this type of thinking go mainstream as an "accepting" attitude. I guess, in my opinon, it's better to wait for acceptance than to be nominally accepted, but totally misunderstood.

But then again, according to some, just because I am a gay male, this really isn't relevant to me, anymore.

EDIT:

Also, if you read above, I already agreed that a "fill in the blank" option would be the best, all around

 

Seth, I see what you're saying here: That looking at the term "transgender" and using it as a gender itself separate from "male" or "female" goes a step backwards because it's not treating trans* people simply as people. However, I still see it as a step forward, not a big step forward, but a step forward nonetheless for the following reasons:

1. There are people who are completely clueless to the idea of transgender people.

This is a big one for so many reasons. Society has basically placed a mentality that everyone is either a guy or a girl depending on their genitals, which we know is a complete fallacy that falls apart at its own foundation. It's even placed a toll on this forum itself in certain threads as well as the fact that Martin didn't know about it until a time much later than when the site began. Still, there are jokes about guys being girls or guys having purses, getting their nails done, being "too pretty" for comfort, etc. because it's not a masculine thing. Similarly, there are women who've had the "You get pretty pink dolls and dresses, not Star Wars" treatment. Both you and I know that the foundation of this is simply the mentality that the general population has on gender: That it's the same exact thing as sex. So the fact that there are people simply don't know about trans* people is a very real fact.

2. It opens people's minds a bit more.

What I mean here is once number 1 is undone in someone's mind, they can then look at someone and be open to the idea that they might actually be a guy, despite the fact that they have a pink purse and are wearing a dress with flowers on it, or they might actually be a girl despite their Metallica Tshirt and shredded jeans exposing some of the hairiest legs you've ever seen.

3. The term itself is an umbrella term.

As you've illustrated and as almost everyone else in this thread has also illustrated, there are more genders than you can possibly imagine. There are probably genders I have never heard of. The concept of gender isn't a binary, nor is it a spectrum. It's more like a galaxy. "Male" and "Female" can be likened to planets where those apply to lots of people, and the other genders can be likened to stars, moons and comets, and there are days where you could be closer to one than the other, or you could stay on one your whole life. There could be days where you're leaping from one to the other. My point here is that there are so many genders, that to list one that nobody's heard and then have to possibly explain it to someone else could end up confusing them more than necessary. So putting in the term "Transgender" would cover those not in the majority, while at the same time not confusing people.

What this is really doing is basically like untangling cords so that you can put each of them in their correct spot and locate them easily. What I mean is that before we get to the idea of transgender people being in the population simply as people, the general population has to get used to the idea of

A. there actually being transgender people
B. them simply being people, not "people who are different than me"

It's like playing a video game, and although you might know the ending, you actually have to play through the game in order to get there.

I'm not saying "don't fight for it". Of course, do that. But things like this are exactly what that is. It's still fighting for Trans* rights, but it still has to be a step.

 

That would puzzle the computers...

It´s not a questionaire about what your body looks like or something.
It is just to know how to address you on letters and documents.
So someone who is transitioning doesn´t get the mrs when he wants mr. For instance.
And so that you don´t walk about with a card that says mr when you look like a woman in real life.

I think that is very positive. It´s just so you are not misgendered or looked strangly at. That you won´t get situations that you have to show papers or cards and it says mr when they see a mrs or vice versa...

If you are transitioned and legally changed your gender, you will fill in male or female.

 

I absolutely hate this. I wouldn't mind if it were a separate section asking about trans status, but this is just offensive. Its kind of saying "Nope, you're not a man/woman, you're a genderless freak, and we're going to make sure we remember it by entering it in our records". Now, an 'other' option is different, and better than not having one, as its recognition for non-binary genders.

 

It shouldn't be separate. The only reasons that the sex and gender need to be identified so clearly are with medical forms. Otherwise, they should only have a suitable form of address to be filled out. Mr, Ms, Mrs, Dr. Lt. etc.

Most documents don't actually require any form of sex, only a preferred form of address. I can't think of another purpose, unless one's sex is absolutely relevant.

 

@Hexagon
Computers and printers don´t think or judge.
People who get to see the forms and cards etc will only think "okay not legally man or woman yet."

Judgements are made on what they see in front of them and that won´t be " a freak" but a person.

It seems that just about any issue about gender you will bring up "freak". I´ve never heard in my life someone call someone a freak related to genderissues. Only related to people that look or act freaky.

Yes, it´s shitty for people who refuse to be called or can´t be either man or woman but sometimes you have to work with what you get.

We don´t live in a world where those are a big deal yet. If the population of people grow that don´t identify as man or woman, forms will take them in consideration.
Just like you can het some forms also in spanish in some parts of the country. That didn´t happen from day one.

One step at the time.
Don´t get angry cause it´s not the best step you think it can be. A first step is better than no progress.

 

If I get a form like this, I'm damn well ticking the "female" box. Transgender is an adjective, not an identity.

 

You can.
But how about those people that switch between man and woman all the time or don´t want to be identified as man or woman?
Don´t they deserve a third choice?

 

Never said they don't. I just feel that the idea of a transgender option insinuates that trans* men and trans* women are seperate from cis men and cis women. I believe there should, at least at this point, be an effort to include "Other" and we can move onto the specifics once society gets its ass in gear and manages to grasp the greater concept of gender.