This is what I have against religion...

[Negasta]

I'm fine if people practice their faith and keep it to themselves and only themselves and damage nobody, but shit like in the link below just makes my blood boil.

French Muslims rapped for refusing male doctor at childbirth

The man refused to allow medical aid for his wife and child because one of the rules of his moronic bronze age religion says that only a husband can see his wife without a veil or burqa. As a result of his egregious medieval stupidity, his son is severely mentally and physically disabled. And the worst part is that there are probably a lot of Western liberals that actually think he was right because he was expressing his faith.

Then he had the gall to fucking sue the hospital for causing his son's condition, when he was the one who was physically barring male doctors and orderlies from entering his wife's room in order to "protect HIS/his wife's honor". The man should have been sent to bloody prison for what he did and he should have been ordered to pay far more than $1500. The boy should also be removed from the care of of his parents because the parents clearly aren't fit to raise children.

This is just like the recent case in Wisconsin where an 11 year old girl slipped into a diabetic coma and died after her parents decided that instead giving her insulin as anybody not deranged by faith would have done, they would pray to Jeebus to cure her.

Girl Dies After Parents Pray for Healing Instead of Seeking Medical Help

The symptom described in the report must have been excruciating for that poor girl, yet her parents sat by mumbling to their imaginary sky daddy instead of calling a doctor. Luckily reason cast some light, because the parents have been charged with 2nd Degree Negligent Homicide, though IMO it should be at least 2nd Degree Murder.

Parents' legal journey begins

And before all the shouts of "But those are fundamentalists!" come up let me make a preemptive strike. It is those of moderate faith that demand automatic respect for their unprovable beliefs that provide cover for those of fundamentalist faith. The religious moderates and liberals are like big trees protecting the saplings of fundamentalism from the scorching sunlight of reason and criticism by demanding respect be show for any religious belief no matter how stupid and destructive. Moderates and liberals are of course also damaging their children in far more subtle ways by filling their minds with all manner of inane/stupid religious opinions, ideas and poisonous morals.

[Steve]

for the first one mate ..... i know what you mean i live right in the middle of it ... so stupid....

my english teacher was telling one of the locals wife how good her daugther was doing ... and he got all " you are discracing my wife and my family " blah blah blah

I think we should stay away from discussion about religion. I repect people religion and I don't beleive at some Fake stories posted online. I'm from France and now let me tell you that , the link about the freanch muslim is completly false. You can judge a community just because some kind pathetic ignorant posted a lie online. We should respect people religion and stay away from judgement. How we expect people to respect us and accept us as homosexual if we can't respect and accept others people religions.

[sparkyboyM]

i'm so atheist i'm anti-theist.

thanks, that's a ton of fule for those deeply religious arguments i get into all the time...
...that wouldn't have happened without the bible, or the torah or the qur'an or god or allah or whatever the hell fiction writer they believed in.

oh and about that accepting other's religions like we want to be accepted, well no offense at all but sexual orientation isn't a choice, and it doesn't harm anyone. UNLIKE religion and fundamentalism. *finger click* owned.

Well, if that is your view about religion, you will have to deal with people who views about homosexuality. Many people don't believe like you that sexual orientation is not a choice. Some think that is a sin or a choice. The only way for them to understand that it is not a choice it is form them to be educated on that. How do you expect them to be educated on sexual orientation , if you don't want to be educated on others people religions.You will be the first one to call them homophobic because they don't understand. What have done to others , to those who have differents culture, religions, and believe than you? I respect others people religions, culture and values. I think by doing that I will expect people to treat me the same way. if they don't at least I have done my part.

We KNOW that homosexuality is not a choice. We also KNOW that religion is a choice. Therefore, you can't compare the two. In my opinion (I won't be using that again because you know it's I who is speaking), we must judge things. I dislike this "ignore the reality and world around you" behavior. This is why we as the Western world are always surprised when something happens (ie. 9/11, school shooting, cult/religious suicide and the works). So what if they don't believe homosexuality is a choice. We know it isn't and we also can't spread it among people or force it down their throats. Sure we can push for acceptance but we can't convert them as they love to believe. They on the other hand, can convert our children and even some of us in our moment of desperation by offering an an illogical solution to our problems when life seems to make the least amount of sense. By forcing kids to sing "All Hail the Fags" in school, they won't become gay; however, if we force "All Hail Allah/God/Brahaman" upon them, some WILL become members of those religions. And yes Science DOES work. I for one refuse to accept ignorance, whether or not it "supports my lifestyle". There are some "religions" that don't really seem like religions though -more like philosophical edicts with a dash of godesque belief. Like some forms of Buddhism, Taoism, eastern religions in general and the New Age stuff.

Originally Posted by bitou

I think we should stay away from discussion about religion. I repect people religion and I don't beleive at some Fake stories posted online. I'm from France and now let me tell you that , the link about the freanch muslim is completly false. You can judge a community just because some kind pathetic ignorant posted a lie online. We should respect people religion and stay away from judgement. How we expect people to respect us and accept us as homosexual if we can't respect and accept others people religions.

We should NOT stay away from discussion about religion. That is very closed minded of you.

Originally Posted by bitou

The only way for them to understand that it is not a choice it is form them to be educated on that.

If we avoided discussion about "Being gay not being a choice" then how would the people be educated? If we were closed minded on this subject, it wouldn't go anywhere.

[Gustav]

You saying that the Muslim dad in the article is stupid because he believes in his faith, is just as ignorant as someone saying being gay is a choice. RELIGIOUS TOLERANCE should be more widespread, no matter what the religion is based upon. People should respect other people's beliefs to the point where they are allowed to FREELY practice them. The Hospital denying that man's religious rights by not allowing a female doctor (Which i'm sure they had one- even if the story is presumed to be false) to deliver the baby is horrendous!

People should not be forced only to practice their religion in private, because it's every human's natural right to openly believe in God, and spread their word to others.

Originally Posted by Nicvcer

We should NOT stay away from discussion about religion. That is very closed minded of you.

Well , I think you are the one who is closed minded because you want to discuss something that you don't understand. At least you discuss about something when have informations . What do you know about Islam? Buddism? Mormonism? Orthodox? prebisterian? Indou? and many more... . Nothing . Unless , you want to become steriotypical of others religions differents of yours. I did say that we can discuss about religion, but do not make the confusion between discussion and bigotry. You guys are judging or comparing religions. Well, It is not appropriate. You don't know anything about my religion , unless some steriotypes. That is what you want to discuss about, steriotypes. Stay away from biases because that make you ignorant and just respect others people religions. I don't know what you want to discuss about others people religion when you don't even understand what they doing. Just respect them , there is nothing to discuss about them.When you have a question about someone else religion, please ask.Don't discuss something that you don't understand. You see open you eyes cause the closed minded might be you.

Originally Posted by Gustav

You saying that the Muslim dad in the article is stupid because he believes in his faith, is just as ignorant as someone saying being gay is a choice. RELIGIOUS TOLERANCE should be more widespread, no matter what the religion is based upon. People should respect other people's beliefs to the point where they are allowed to FREELY practice them. The Hospital denying that man's religious rights by not allowing a female doctor (Which i'm sure they had one- even if the story is presumed to be false) to deliver the baby is horrendous!

People should not be forced only to practice their religion in private, because it's every human's natural right to openly believe in God, and spread their word to others.

At least there is someone like you in this thread you agree with me. We should stay away of judgements about others people. I am very surprised, because these are the same people who want to be recognize as gay. I am pretty sure that we have many of them here who are rejected by theirs own religious group, but they are insulting others religion.My friend at least we have people like you in this world, but what can you say to somoeone you choosed to remain in the dark? I guess nothing

[SamAlex728]

Thank you, Negasta. This is mostly how I feel. I try to respect other people's religion, but when I have already told them I am an atheist and they still try to shove their religion down my throat, that's when I get pissed. They believe in something, so that's fine for them, but when I know what they are saying is complete bullshit, and I'm still forced to listen to it, I tend to get a little.....a lot....opinionated. I mean if you believe in it, leave me out of it.

Like this kid at my school, a very good friend of mine, I think he is more Christian than male. Seriously, we were writing persuasive essays on the same topic (Pledge of Allegiance using the words 'under God' and being required in schools), and he was for it saying 'under God', and in case you couldn't tell, I'm against it. We were talking about it and he started shoving some shit about him being ill and some "Christian thing" cured him in a few hours. I just wanted to punch him. I had already told him I was an atheist, yet he just kept throwing his religion at me. That is one of the things I have against religion. And when somebody puts another life in danger because of their bullshit beliefs, that is crossing the line.

[LOVEjames]

While I respect Atheists, they always seem so incredibly angry... o.o Like, I just don't get it.

[MeskElil]

Guys, may I respectfully ask that we stay away from discussions about religion? People can get hurt by it. We don't all view the same thing, and when someone is different from us sometimes we just overreact and say something we regret. I just don't want people on here to get hurt by prejudice. We get enough of that being gay.

[LOVEjames]

Things never to bring up in a large group if you want the conversation to remain civil: Homosexuality, Politics and Religion. <3

Originally Posted by MeskElil

Guys, may I respectfully ask that we stay away from discussions about religion? People can get hurt by it. We don't all view the same thing, and when someone is different from us sometimes we just overreact and say something we regret. I just don't want people on here to get hurt by prejudice. We get enough of that being gay.

Thank you , I have been saying that all day long . I got slamed just because I said that we should stay away from discussing people religion. I though that , when you gay you are more respectful and accepting of others. I guess I was wrong . I really puzzled by some comments here.

[MeskElil]

Originally Posted by bitou

Thank you , I have been saying that all day long . I got slamed just because I said that we should stay away from discussing people religion. I though that , when you gay you are more respectful and accepting of others. I guess I was wrong . I really puzzled by some comments here.

Discussions about religion never turn out well unless the people discussing it all believe in the same thing. And like LOVEjames said, three things you shouldn't discuss: homosexuality (except here, of course), religion, and politics.
It always hurts. That's why I never talk about it.

[LOVEjames]

I view these types of things as personal things, and things that shouldn't be taken out of the one person. If people of like minds want to go ahead and get together to talk about things, then there's nothing wrong with that, but if two separate ideas clash then all mayhem will ensue. I just think that religion especially is personal and something that should be used to make you stronger as a person, and if you don't believe in something higher, you still have a belief in yourself, and that will also make you stronger. I don't think that you have to go around spouting your belief on everyone, especially when those beliefs can hurt someone. It's morally irresponsible to just spout around hurtful things, and it shows a blatant disregard for people in general.

Finally , we are in the same page. I said I from France and that French muslim story is completly false. Personally I respect people religion and when I have a question about how they are practicing it , I don't mind to ask. I always have a good feeback when I ask. One of my great friend is muslim and I think that is a great person. He thought me a lot about his religion and I did the same about mine. I'm outraged by the way we view muslim in this country like "terrorist" even in some European country few have are radical , but not all of them. I know through my friend and others that there are great muslim men and women out there . So, thank you again by your instructive comment

[Paul_UK]

This thread is getting nasty in places. We don't want to close it, but it can't continue as it is.

Please everyone remember that while you may disagree with someone's opinion, you should challenge the opinion and not attack the person. Respect other members regardless of their views.