I was reading the news from www.cbc.ca/money, and came across the following article: "GM won't commit to Oshawa plant, Hargrove says" So anyway, after reading tons and tons of news everyday with regard to wages, unions and strikes, I've decided to do some research. The following are the results. I decided to compare 2 countries. Singapore and US National Average Wage 2006 US - 38,651.41 (In US dollars)[ssa.gov] Singapore - 42,658 (In Singapore dollars) [mom.gov.sg] Then I looked at the "Big Mac Index" published by the economist. Price of Big Mac 2007 US - 3.41 (In US dollars) Singapore - 3.95 (In Singapore dollars) Which is why I thought it would be relatively accurate to compare these two economies since the average standard of living is about the same. Next, I checked the Wages for Factory Workers. US "In 2006 a typical UAW-represented assembler at GM earned $27.81 per hour of straight-time labor" Singapore Electornic equipment/component assembler - 1,106-1,839 Singapore dollars a month. Assuming that GM workers work 25 hours (TWENTY FIVE HOURS A WEEK!) a week, and 100 hours a month (A HUNDRED HOURS A MONTH!), they earn $2,781. Can you imagine? a 100 hours a month only, and their wages have already transcended the workers in Singapore who live in a country that has a standard of living of little deviance. And you wonder why GM can no longer support their factories in north america. Note: I am not trying to argue if it's right or wrong for factory workers in north america to have such relatively high wages. Just showing some statistics. However, you are more than welcome to express your views.
Of course GM can support their factories in North America, if they wanted to. They'd just have to be willing to lose some profit, or cut some of the obscenely high compensation they pay to their CEO and upper-management. It always shocks me that people buy into that whole "oh woe is us, we must seek cheaper labour or else we will perish" garbage that companies spew. They wouldn't perish if they had to pay people a decent living wage in the US or Canada; they just wouldn't do as well in terms of reaping obscene profits which are paid out to a tiny number of people at the very top of the company.
(The following is not my point of view but a popular response to your response nick) The idea is that these High Level Managers are the ones who come up with Million Dollar ideas and contribute to the company's competitive edge. So if GM doesn't pay their High Level Managers well enough, perhaps some would run to Ford, Toyota or Honda. And now that there are other places where labour is a lot cheaper, they would rather sacrifice the fix cost of building a factory somewhere else than to relinquish their BIG MEN/WOMEN. The question comes down to how much should people be compensated based on their skills doens't it? Do CEOs with innate high abstract thinking skills and good education deserve 100 times more than an average worker with little education? And so far, because US was built on a capitalism foundation, the answer was yes.
Except... the argument is flawed, because when top people do well, they're (obscenely) compensated, yet when they do poorly, they are... wait for it... obscenely compensated, which has nothing to do with capitalism and everything to do with the rich and powerful cementing their positions as the rich and powerful. They are literally rewarded for complete and abject failure. So it's a win-win situation for them. They might get fired/let go but then they just go on to become an executive officer or board member for another corporation. And I don't think there's ANY empirical proof that CEOs have "innate high abstract thinking skills" and a good education. They might have an education from a well-respected institution but that's not the same thing. They could have had very average or poor grades at that well-respected institution or their daddy could have ensured they graduated by pulling strings or making donations. (Think George W Bush and... Yale, was it?) Welcome to the credentialed society, where the place you got your piece of paper matters more than what you actually accomplished or what you're actually capable of. And "100 times the compensation" of an average worker is probably underestimating it severely. And no, I don't think anyone should be paid that much more money than someone else, because it promulgates this notion that somehow the people at the top are worth more (not just in pay, but in terms of actual value as human beings) than everyone else, when in the vast majority of cases, they are at the top because they were born into the upper echelons of society. Maybe if the responsibilities of being a CEO or COO were actually commensurate with the pay, you could make a case for it. But someone like a bus driver holds literally dozens of lives in their hands each day, and gets crumbs compared to someone who sits in an office and goes to meetings all day... and if one of their decisions happens to eliminate 1000 or 2000 jobs, they are far more likely to be rewarded for that than punished. And let's not ignore how self-serving the argument that of course the people at the top deserve all the money they get is. Who do you think comes up with that line of thinking? I can guarantee you it's not the janitors for that company. And then the dreaded spectre of the "they'll just go work somewhere else" convenience. Funny how that doesn't apply to people except at the top, huh? Somehow people at the top are just immensely irreplaceable and people at the bottom are completely disposable. And people say there's no class system in the US (or Canada). Ha! At least the Europeans are more honest about it.
Sorry to disagree with you Joey, but I do think that it has to do with capitalism. This is how the capitalistic system operates. Greed and the desire for increased profits (even at the expense of the workers and the poor) is an integral part of the system, regardless of how well the people at the top do. Bringing in a different point, I think that GM has the problems that it has in part because it has failed to react to the changing market conditions for years. I mean gasoline prices have gone up for a while now and what has GM done? Nothing! GM has continued to manufacture inefficient trucks and cars when it comes to gasoline consumptions while Japanese car manufacturers have responded to the changes a lot faster and more effectively. Someone at GM should have seen this coming. For a few years now, Toyota has eaten into GM's market share as well as Ford's and Chrysler's) precisely because it is building more efficient (and might I add better) cars.
*We've come to the notion of capitalism and socialism* I really really hope that ensuing discussions will abide by the Code of Conduct, because it's going to be sad to see another interesting discussion go heated. The thing about capitalism is essentially this question: "How many people can replace a bus driver if he/she disappears?" (Tons) "How many people can replace a CEO if he/she disappears." (Not many) So in this case, the dynamics of capitalism will widen the financial gap between these two groups just because of scarcity. Like why Gold is so much more expensive than Silver. (They are both metal!) And Joey, the job of a CEO or any other "expert" is really not easy in my opinion. These people make decisions that affect a lot more lives than you think. Every decision made my these corporations affect the economy and the securities market(stocks, bonds) which in turn affects the WORLD... Recessions and Depressions all at one point originate from these powerful individuals. A few "experts" who claimed that the "internet" was a big thing, created a bubble that, when burst, caused distress across nations, which resulted in another bubble.. which just burst recently, and is causing even more distress. But then again, (in my opinion, this is the only opinion that I truly believe in), people are simply selfish. When capitalism brings them wealth, during the Cold War and a period after it, EVERY American and possibly citizens from NATO was screaming Capitalism, condemning Communism. And now when they experience the negative effects of Capitalism, everybody now wants regulations and unions (precisely the notion of communism). It's just being human. And of course America has a hell of a class system.. I mean come on, it claims to be a capitalist state, it would be but naive to believe that everybody can be equal in a capitalist state.
Price of Big Mac 2007 US - 3.41 (In US dollars) Singapore - 2.89 (In US dollars) National Average Wage 2006 US - 38,651.41 (In US dollars)[ssa.gov] Singapore - 31198.73 (In US dollars) [ [mom.gov.sg] US "In 2006 a typical UAW-represented assembler at GM earned $27.81 per hour of straight-time labor" Singapore Electornic equipment/component assembler - 808.89 US dollars a month. Without the Ammounts being in the same curency it was like comparing apples with oranges Are they realy comparable? The US is number 12 on the Human_Development_Index and singapore number 25 and if we were listing them by GDP USA is number one ans SING is number 45...
Actually I deliberately compared them in their respective currency. Comparing them in the same currency assumes the theory of "Purchasing Power Parity." (Brief and unquotable explanation from a sophomore: a theory that states "real" currency exchange = 1) And since that theory involves a lot of assumptions that gives a leeway for arguments, it is best to leave them at home currency. It's like, if you earn 2 dollars and you spend 1 dollar, you would feel as rich as if you earn 2000 [insert currency] and if you spend 1000 [insert currency].
POFFT! that is not the important thing to be looking at honey, u know what is. The important thing to look at is that GM workers are being paied for low quaity work. Now i know this may sound strainge but ask any of the asian members of EC...idk..umm...Kimii? or...whatever....:dry: (i feel soo dehydrated in this hot summer) BUT ANYWAYS, GM and Ford cars are not sold on the local market in asia. They do not pass their environmental standards. Same here, GM and Ford cars are not sold on local market. Very few people have them and those who do are asked to take them off the road. Compair to the asian brands like Honda, Toyota etc. they are the ones with the top of the line hybrid cars and while they are making sales in your country GM arn't meeting international standrads yet still people still have their jobs:eusa_eh: isn't there something wrong with this picture.
