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Straight guys and bi/lesbian women and the dynamics

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by Tightrope, Jan 16, 2014.

  1. Tightrope

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    All right, this comes up on EC a lot. I don't offend easily, but I'm slightly miffed by this.

    Why is it that there is this overarching presumption that straight guys are interested in converting bi and lesbian women, and that women's sexual preferences are a joking matter? Does this stereotype refer to all, most, some, or a few straight guys? Or is it mostly with the "hey watch this, I've got game" types? Most of the straight guys I knew or still know do not even bother with women who are bi or lesbian. It's very much "sorry," if they are informed, or "thanks, but no thanks," if they know of their status anecdotally.

    Also, if straight guys are aware of and even overly concerned with gay guys, why can't they acknowledge that the same situation may be true of women when it comes to their preferences?
     
  2. Hexagon

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    I don't see why a straight guy would need to convert a bi girl... Anyway, It usually only refers to a few guys. I've met a few, they certainly exist. But I see no reason not to believe in the decency of most of the population.
     
  3. stocking

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    I know not all straight guys are like this because I've met a few not trying to convert lesbians but I have met a lot that try to convince lesbians that straight life is better or they should be with them or take No for an answer and make the rest of their gender look bad
     
  4. SheWhoHasNoName

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    There was this one guy I met last year that tried to convince me that because i haven't had sex with a guy, I can't know if I'm really a lesbian. I asked him if he's ever had sex with a guy. He said no. I told him, "Then how do you know you're straight?"

    That shut him up pretty quick...
     
  5. stocking

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    Oh i've gotten that once online .This one's my favorite Oh your a lesbian so am I and I said so you have a boobs and vagina then that shut that guy up pretty quickly .
    Another man Girl What did a man do you wrong ! that you became a lesbian

    I get those on the rpgs I play straight guys always trying to convince me to live in straightvill
     
  6. fortheloveoflez

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    1) Because t's true. This is how we get treated a lot. Just look at "lesbian" porn, it's not for lesbians. It's for straight men; usually involves some type of weird power play and some man just stepping in out of nowhere like "ohhhhh you must be so happy to see me". So I think virtually every thing I see, and as I experience as a woman, has told me since birth "women aren't whole without a man". "Lesbian sex isn't real sex, no sex is sex without a p**** (thanks patriarchy)". "Women aren't visual creatures". "Women can't M*********". "Women can only get off from "p****" (how far off this one is, noting that most women are virtually physically UNABLE to get off from this, but you can thank the patriarchy for this misguided belief). And SO many people, of all genders, internalize this concept. They really do. So, just go on youtube. Open up ANY lesbian-themed video FOR lesbians (remember, most is for straight men) and see all those comments of men going like "I'll convert you...."..."all you need is a good d******"..."lesbians aren't real"........seriously, I can tell you from my personal experience that it's true but I think it'd be better that you come to the conclusions yourself. Society has taught women to be sexually repressed "virginal" goddess, but also sexually cater, to MEN to be worth any thing...they are "sluts" if they do as little as seek enjoyment but then they are "prudes" if they don't succumb to sexually flaunting themselves to men...not to mention the thousands of years people thought women don't have a sexuality (it took all the way until the 1900s with Alfred Kinsey to even STUDY women's sexuality) so go figure....

    On a more pleasant side note. I know a couple men who don't try to "convert" and I really care for them as they do treat me with respect.

    2. Oh jeez..ask them....actually, I think I might know what contributes:

    1) women are taught to NEVER speak up for themselves especially when talking about sex, it's almost like they are taught to not enjoy it from a young age...or to accept when it's painful/dull (look at all the "experts" who say it will be, and then all those graphic words like "deflowering" and "penetrating" just normalizes unpleasant sex to women) 2) the porn industry deludes people, look at how women are just smacked around and NO "foreplay" the fact that the act of "foreplay" which statistically gives most pleasure to women is called just "foreplay" and set as "optional" is already super telling about how society views women's sexuality is given, if it is it's like 5 unremarkable seconds...then this woman gets "pounded" to death, gets thrown around + degraded, fakes orgasms...basically her hand is the real star of the film, she has to get off by herself. So what does this have to do with some straight men? Viewers may internalize the concept that women don't have to enjoy sex to do it. When it comes to women's vs. men's pleasure: men's pleasure topples. So, then it's like, (assuming this person believes that lesbians are real, because we have so much sayng already that women can't be without men etc.) well if a women doesn't have to enjoy sex to do it..that means "I can get a lesbian". Basically, men may learn to be entitled to women...because heck....look at even the Hollywood movies out there and how about Miley Cyrus's music videos whch show that women are just begging to take their clothes off. and what we teach our daughters...when a guy does some thing great you give him sex as a reward, when he doesn't you withhold. It's just this weird thing......
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    At the end of the day it hurts every one. Because women start getting defensive, then all the guys get a bad name. Not only that, women who are bi/straight internalize this idea that "sex will be bad". Lesbians feel threatened that they are sexual targets. Which by the way, statistics show that lesbians are 7 times more likely to get raped. 7 times. In fact, there's an entire culture of violence against lesbians. It's called corrective rape. Here's a link. http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/07/26/opinion/26corrective-rape.html

    And this is where it all comes from.
     
    #6 fortheloveoflez, Apr 5, 2014
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2014
  7. stocking

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    When I say straight guys are obsessed with lesbians I'm not talking about all but most of straight guys are a lot in fact . If there we not obsessed with lesbians there wouldn't be a site online giving straight guys tips on how to sleep with lesbians and telling them they can do so even if the girl says she's not interested . Cause I can tell you a lot of lesbians can tell you stories of straight guys being disrespectful to them or trying to convert them .
    I even heard a straight guy say online to a lesbian who was complaining about how girlfriend and her were being harassed by straight men and the guy told her to take it as a compliment . You can also see this in porn the porn that's really popular now is 3some porn with a guy having sex with 2 girls guys are obsessed with it mostly straight men , I even read yesterday a straight guy told another man because he had a 3some with a guy and his girlfriend that 3 somes should strictly be only one man and two women .
    In my opinion the obsession is becoming very unhealthy this is the one reason I don't come out as a lesbian I don't feel safe around most straight men , I wouldn't sleep over at a straight guy's house I just don't feel safe . I can be friends with some but I know even though I'm a lesbian and if they know this they will still desire to sleep with me and the scary part is they would want to sleep with me more because I'm a lesbian and a challenge to them .
    I get harassed by guys regular and I know for a fact if I was out as a lesbian it will increase more .
     
    #7 stocking, Apr 5, 2014
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2014
  8. ChromeNerd

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    I think all men that disrespect lesbians should get hit on by a gay man.
     
  9. stocking

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    I agree , in fact I love it when that happens :grin:
     
  10. Fallingdown7

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    I don't think the blaming straight men thing that comes up is aimed at all straight men. I think the term is just used because the people that generally do this ARE straight men.

    I too sometimes bring this up, but It's not like I hate straight men. I know guys who respect me. I'm just bringing up who is generally the cause of it. Even straight girls do things rather similar too (Oh you're gay, does that mean I can experiment with you?).

    Hell, lesbians in general AREN'T taken seriously, because we're taught that they (and their experiences) are inferior or lesser.
     
  11. fortheloveoflez

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    It's because women aren't taken as seriously, sadly, so when you have two of these "submissive indescisive creatures" then you really hit the jackpot...

    And also, you are right in saying that there is quite a number of straight women who don't take us seriously either. I feel like that annoys me a tad more because it's like mirroring all the degrading messages we are force-fed about women and the one-dimensional view society has. It's pretty much women using misogyny on other women. Sad.
     
    #11 fortheloveoflez, Apr 5, 2014
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2014
  12. stocking

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    I came out to my straight female friend and she asked me if I had sex with a guy, which to her means piv l told her no the she said that l'm just confused and I should try dick and that I wasn't trying hard enough to be straight and she was laughing while saying this. I have heard homophobic things from my mom how lesbians can't have sex and we just rub our things together and we put on fake penises because we can't do anything in the bedroom. I even know a straight girl that would call lesbians the f word but with have respect for gay men. As a lesbian you have two strikes against you .first your a woman second your gay woman so your seen as weak plus your sexuality is taken as a joke
     
  13. Fallingdown7

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    Yes, the heterosexism directed at lesbians is because of misogyny.

    I have bad luck with straight women too. I've had friends that didn't respect my sexuality and forced men on me, or curious straight girls who thought they could flirt with me/try to kiss me/try to experiment. It's always really pissed me off that some straight girls flirt with any girl when she knows she's gay. I have standards too, and happen to be very sexually conservative; my sexuality doesn't change that.

    I'm not saying all straight girls are bad though. My therapist is straight, has a husband and six kids, and is highly supportive in gay rights. When I told her the devaluation I got with other straight people devaluing lesbian sex not being "real" she had a hilarious expression as if she didn't believe it. In her words "Anyone who thinks a penis is needed to be non-virginal is a fool".

    I love that! Why can't more straight people think like this?
     
  14. stocking

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    Some can't accept that because it hurts the male ego