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The rich get richer and the poor get poorer...,

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by Alexander69, Mar 5, 2014.

  1. Alexander69

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    I over heard some people talking at a Starbucks today and they said "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer" if I understand that right then I disagree..... Because yes it's hard to make it big but if you work hard ad keep trying I truly believe anyone can have money and e successful.

    It bothers me that people think it's easy getting money it's not at all my family on my dads side started with nothing like my great grandparents they worked hard and created a company and after sold it and made a fortune and then created another company that my grand parents kept going until they sold it off and my dad had his company and works for others as well so it's not easy but If you work hard and don't stop I assure you you will make it. Maybe not soon but you will it takes time if it didn't take time and effort then everyone would have millions.

    I guess if you have never had money it seems all great but I see the stress and how time consuming it is. And people go "oh look at that car" or look at the clothes or accessories and ya it's nice but my GOD it's only things!!! People I have tons of "things" I'm not happy really. At the end if the day I have expensive cars.... And a big house and nice clothes...... I would trade IT ALLLL to have a family that showed they loved me a family that did things together and was home at 6 to eat dinner together..... To have a boyfriend that loved me not the things I have....

    I'm jealous of everyone that has those things I would trade my life in a second to you...... The only thing I have going for me are my "things" I show off because it makes me feel like a bigger person. I wish I was just happy walking around in a blank t-shirt hair messy and no facial work done.... But I don't.

    You don't want your life to revolve around money it fucking sucks... The rich get richer because we only care about money and we only do things to get more because its an addiction. The poor stay poor because they may say they hate their life but at least you have people around you.

    But if come in to money I warn you don't let it be you life. Keep your friends don't show off. I was born in to a wealthy family I never had a normal life. But now that I live on my own I want to change I want to be normal I want to be like 90% of the world. I don't want pretentious people around me. If rather have just enough money then to have more than I need.

    Sorry I went off topic a lot just a lot is going through my head
     
  2. dfiant

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    The saying is politically motivated. They saying basically means those that can least afford it are taxed higher percentages.

    There is also a saying that the poorest 90% are taxed to support the rich 10%
     
  3. Alexander69

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    Really I didn't know that? Maybe I'm ignorant :O
     
  4. Rakkaus

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    If you recognize that having all this material wealth will not make you happy, then why do you keep trying in vain to make yourself happy with expensive goodies? Every thread you make you seem to talk all about the expensive Italian marble being installed in your very own personal mansion that your father is paying to have built for you, you talk about your Bentleys and Astons and Range Rovers that you father bought for you. That shit won't make you happy, so why become so obsessed with it?

    Maybe you should consider trying to live a simpler life, a life without flashy expensive things. Constantly flaunting your wealth and all your expensive goodies is a turn-off to guys looking for a real relationship; you are not going to find a boyfriend who loves you- you are going to find a boyfriend who loves your money. Likewise you will find a lot of people trying to become "friends" with you, when their real aim is simply to become "friends" with your money.

    So my suggestion to you would be to maybe try toning down the flashiness and the gaudiness, don't try to flaunt your exorbitant wealth. Sell the Bentley and donate the money to charity. Making a real difference in the lives of other human beings is far more fulfilling than showing off material wealth.


    As for the saying...the truthfulness of it is self-evident. "The rich get richer and the poor get poorer" is the way it's always been.

    Most people who are wealthy are wealthy because they were born into families with means. Our entire system is stacked toward entrenching wealth among those who already have it while laying every obstacle possible to prevent poor and working class people from getting ahead in life. Meanwhile the middle class is being squeezed out of existence.

    In the U.S., for example, we have someone like multimillionaire Mitt Romney. His father's money bought him into the top universities and business schools. His father's money provided him the startup capital to create Bain Capital, a private equity company which made even more millions for Mitt by destroying businesses and jobs of working class people. His father's money bought him the connections to get involved in politics. Mitt inherited vast wealth from his father, and was able make even more money by investing the money. Mitt betrayed just how out-of-touch he was with ordinary folk when he suggested to a group of young students that if they wanted to start a new business, they should borrow money from their parents, as if every young person has a multimillionare parent out there with a few spare millions to lend their son or daughter.

    And to add insult to injury, mega-millionaire Mitt Romney pays a lower tax rate than does the single mom working two minimum wage jobs just to afford to put food on the table.

    Money begets money.

    What we need to do is radically change the system and redistribute wealth, we can start by taxing the rich at substantially higher rates to fund policies to help poor people move up the economic ladder.
     
  5. Argentwing

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    Money is power, and while exceptions exist, I agree with the sentiment. Not only do you have to spend money to make money (a simple trend of capitalism) but the people with an offensively huge amount of wealth adjust the system to work in their favor. Why do you think their was a backlash against Standard Oil a century ago that resulted in anti-trust legislation? Corporations get powerful enough to rule entire markets, and you bet your bells they don't use that economic clout for altruism.

    On the other side of the coin, if you have little money, life is disproportionately hard. I had to leave my job for school (attended in order to get money to become independent), and because both my income and direct deposit were cut off, my bank began hitting me with fees. That problem was solved, but if something else like a major car breakdown were to hit, I'm sunk. Somebody with a couple grand would have no problem overcoming it, but I have no such security. I can only post here because others are infinitely generous and I aim to pay them back when I graduate/get hired. "Stuff" is the last thing on my mind; even hobbies have fallen by the wayside since my money goes only to food and gas for my car.

    Wow, this turned into a rant. But I do agree that the rich (I use that term loosely to mean the 1%) do all they can to amass more money than anyone could enjoy, the rest of society be damned.
     
    #5 Argentwing, Mar 5, 2014
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2014
  6. Techno Kid

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    I'm sorry you are having trouble finding a relationship is...believe me. :/ I do have a family who loves me though so that is something.

    "...it's not at all my family on my dads side started with nothing like my great grandparents they worked hard and created a company and after sold it and made a fortune and then created another company that my grand parents kept going until they sold it off and my dad had his company and works for others as well so it's not easy but If you work hard and don't stop I assure you you will make it."

    Having a company given to you is not the same thing as working hard to get there... it's just not. And if you are in a bad place in life getting things can be impossible if you don't have a support system from the government and loved ones.
     
  7. Alexander69

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    I don't understand taxes I have someone do that ya.... But maybe I should look at that. But maybe that tax us less because we have worked for our money and they want us to continue to have money to put in to businesses I know my father invests and In order to invest you need money...... Maybe that's why? I know my dad is republican or something he's technically an American he was born in America but his family lived in Canada I don't really understand it but ya it's confusing. But he always talked about republicans that's how I know. I don't know American politics I know it's a serious thing out there but I don't know the gov out there. But I know that republicans are in it for money that is all I know really and that a lot of people don't like republicans. All my family in the states are republicans as well.....

    But I'm going through my closets tonight I'm going to donate some clothing and shoes. And I'll try and get my mom to donate clothes I know she has a ton even still she does and I she wants to stay with me she has to respect what I ask her to do. PLUS I've been more than generous to her.

    And I know that I talk about that stuff and I do it because it makes me feel superior I guess because I really don't view myself highly if I did I wouldn't fake and hide who I am behind "things" I get that and I want to change I'm so sick of feeling like shit I want to be me I just don't know who I am..... I don't know.....

    ---------- Post added 5th Mar 2014 at 08:17 PM ----------

    My family has gone under before so I know what it's like to be bankrupt I don't talk about this often to anyone but ya. We had absolutely nothing we lost homes the company my fathers other businesses went under all investments. I mean we got back from that and did better than ever with other competition gone after but I know it's hard to get back but my family did it and that's why I say If you try and try and try you will get there eventually all good things take time
     
  8. Argentwing

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    Addendum to my views: I don't see it as a "democrat vs. republican" issue. Both of them raise taxes on the little people when they can, and republicans at the very least like to cut them for the ultra-wealthy with the philosophy that the benefits will "trickle down." Great in principle, but in reality (and a very shocking turn -.-) they usually decide to keep it. That would explain why profits are in the stratosphere and wages have remained stagnant or even dropped considering inflation. And I don't think raising the minimum wage would help much either, as the crony capitalists would raise costs for the end consumers and stay the course. :/
     
    #8 Argentwing, Mar 5, 2014
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  9. Foxface

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    nvm
     
    #9 Foxface, Mar 5, 2014
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  10. Jared

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    Not to be mean, but you are naive to the point where it is almost sad. The 1% is taxed less since they can hire accounts to find loopholes in the tax code for them. And they've also spent a lot of money lobbying in politics to make sure the tax code stays favorable to them. The low taxes aren't a reward for hard work, but a reward for simply being rich and making it so you stay rich. I come from a rather wealthy family, probably not in the 1% but in the top few percent for sure, and I know my family pays less taxes than some of my friends families who make way less than my parents. It's sick and really should change, I don't think the rich should be taxed out of all their money, but they certainly won't miss some of it.

    Also when you have a business it is easier to lower taxes as you can write off a lot of things, i.e. artificially lower your income on paper, by saying they are for business when they aren't. Also by keeping your money in a business, the benefits are two fold, the corporate tax code is very easy to manipulate into paying little taxes, and since you personally didn't make the money, the business did, your personal income can be very low. People without the means to start a large business, or didn't inherit one, don't have the luxury of hiding their money in a company, which if it's a profitable company will increase your money.
     
    #10 Jared, Mar 5, 2014
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  11. Alexander69

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    Well I don't know what to say besides I have no idea about any of this maybe I am naive....
     
  12. Chip

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    Alexander,

    I think, honestly, that you are a combination of naive and really sheltered. You've learned a lot at EC over the past couple of years you've been here... but you still have a lot of views that don't square with reality, and that, unfortunately, is because of the sheltered life you've had.

    I don't know how it is in Canada, but many of the wealthiest people in the US made their wealth at the expense of others. Wal-mart. for example... the Walton family is among the richest of people in the world, and yet all of their employees make minimum wage or very close to it, they source the cheapest, crappiest stuff out of China, and they have a reputation for being really shady in their dealings with employees.

    Certainly the same is true with all of Wall Street. Huge sums of money, that make millionaires, come from insider trading, ripping people off, and running all sorts of shady deals. Even Bill Gates, who is now doing really wonderful things with his money, made it by being shady, ruthless, monopolistic, and basically extorting companies, and using his wealth, power, and influence to squash competition. You can argue it's free market, but it isn't so much when one side has unlimited money, power, and influence and the other has nearly nothing.

    Mark Zuckerberg became as wealthy as he has by stealing an idea from other people and by ripping off his early partners

    There are some success stories of people who have made their money honestly and ethically... but there are a lot more who make their money on the backs of the working poor and by exploiting people.

    It's much easier, once you have money, power, and influence to keep it than it is for anyone to get into that sphere of influence. And... many people, like your dad (and you) were born into wealth so all they had to do was maintain it, grow it, and not screw it up. That's much, much easier than building something from scratch, particularly if (unlike Gates and Zuckerberg) you do so with integrity and ethics.

    It takes a lot of vulnerability to talk about giving it up in order to have family, and I really believe you in that regard.

    But the problem is... your actions don't match your words. You just bought an enormous house in a stuck up, pretentious community of estates, you drive a Bentley, and you're furnishing it with furnishings that likely a single one of which costs more than a 2 bedroom house in the midwest. By living the lifestyle and in the community you are living in, you're surrounding yourself with a culture of people who are just like your family... focused on money, material objects, and shallow things at the expense of real connection. And you aren't likely to find someone who's going to like you for you as long as you live, act, wear clothes, and drive a car that says "I have a ton of money." What you are going to get are people like your mom... who are interested in your money and not in you.

    I'd think, with all the discussions we've had about this here in the past 2 years that this idea would be beginning to be part of your understandings, but it doesn't seem like that message has gotten across.

    I know a number of people who are quite wealthy. But you'd never know it. They dress in nice but non-flashy clothes, drive a newer but not expensive/flashy car, live in a 3500 sqft house, and never flash their money around. In fact, most people when they meet them, don't even know they have money. And, as a result, when they meet new people, the friends they make are a byproduct of people wanting to know them because they're cool people, not because they have flashy things.

    Until you understand that and start living and acting that way, you're going to be stuck with either pretentious already wealthy people, or people who aren't wealthy but want to marry into it like your mom. Neither of those are likely to be emotionally healthy and happy people you'll want to be around.
     
  13. Simple Thoughts

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    It'd be nice to be rich...nah, I should rephrase that. It'd be nice to have something. I'm broke, jobless, carless, and I owe the govt money so they won't let me go back to college...It'd be nice to just have a place to put my foot on the ground. -.-'

    I don't really care much for expensive things. I never understood flashy cars and the brand label clothing...personally, I'd be happy with a place to call my own and a modest car that could be respected. Sadly, teenagers don't make the best decisions and past me kinda screwed the pooch...oh well, what's life without something to overcome anyways? Sometimes I feel bad being stuck here with family. At 22 you should be self-sufficient...*sighs*

    Anyways,

    I have two things I want to address specifically.

    1.) The only hard work that sounds like it was being done was by your father's father. This I'm assuming was at least back in the area of let's say the 50's somewhere along those lines? That being the case the rules were a little different. It was still tilted in the favor of the rich, but back then a person with dedication and a good idea could still make it in with the top dogs. This is 2014, and the rules have changed. Now, everyone gets screwed unless they're in that top percentile.

    2.) You sound unhappy with things as they are. You want your family to be closer, and that means more to you than money ever could. I'm sorry that your family chases the almighty dollar. It's sad when people chose that route, it is. If you're family doesn't want to be that way, than create your own family that will be. Meet people, good people. Don't flash around your cash, just be yourself and learn to live modestly. In good time people will find their way to you, and good people too who'll be more than happy to take time out for dinner. :3
     
  14. squally89

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    What Chip wrote is very true in regards to mega corporations like Wal-Mart (adding Amazon to the list). Alexander I don't know about your upbringing is in terms of wealth vs. poor, but it is good that you are potentially aware of the hardship people go through just to make ends meet.

    We all love to think everyone is born with equal opportunities to be "successful" but in reality that is simply not true. Who you are racially, ethnically, and what your family's socio-economic background before you were born are all factors to the chance of how successful you can be in the future. Yes there have been cases where the poor got rich, but the chance of that happening is lower than the people who has got the money to educate and "buy" things so readily available to them - rich people got better and more options.
     
  15. Alexander69

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    I know that I have a better chance and more chances at being wealthy than other people I'm not that ignorant. But wealth doesn't mean success as many of you say wealthy people make money at the cost of others. That's very true. It's sad and disgusting but money is an addiction and when you make it all you want is more more more more more seriously it like a drug and then it gets easier and easier to make it when you have a company or corporation.

    I know that there are people who are broke and have nothing and I'm sorry about that I really am and I feel like a c*nt for bringing my life up. And afte reading some of the hardships people are going through here I feel like shit really I do. I don't think I want to talk about my life anymore. Not the way I have because my life really isn't that bad compared to many other.... I'm a spoiled brat and I know that.

    So.... I'm sorry.

    Wow I feel like a dick like its really hit me this time I have empathy for you guys like I always thought if people work hard they will become rich that's the way I was raised and I guess when I read what's being said That's not true. I was looking up on the Internet some people's companies and I mean they should be so successful but no one knows their name and that sickens me. Like these people who wrote a book but because no one knew their name they wouldn't publish it.....

    I'm sorry again and I actually really won't talk about money here it's a soft topic and I see that. I want to be normal and leave money aside I'm so sick of standards and money and materialistic - ness. I hate it I want to feel confident in my skin be who I am not the stuff I wear. Fuck lables fuck standards of beauty it's to much. Seriously I'm sick of it it ruins people it does it really really does.

    So I'm promising no that I won't discuss this anymore I want to be treated and looked at kindly not like "he's pretentious" I want you guys to say "what a down to earth guy" from now on and ill make sure to show that I am!
     
  16. robclem21

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    This is precisely the reason for my response to the older thread about your parents (i.e. yawn). There are only so many times you can say you really want to change and then go spend a thread ranting about your big house and fancy cars and money before it just gets boring to listen to.

    I know you weren't thrilled with that response, but it is hard to have sympathy when you continually ignore very very good advice that awesome people here spend so much time giving you.

    Not saying its easy either, but if you say you want to trade it all for money, I believe the ideology is there, but I also believe you would miss you money.
     
  17. BookDragon

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    ". Because yes it's hard to make it big but if you work hard ad keep trying I truly believe anyone can have money and e successful. "

    Did you ever hear the response to that belief?

    If success and wealth were truly the result of hard work, every woman in Africa would be a millionaire.
     
  18. Simple Thoughts

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    Don't feel guilty friend. You didn't ask to be born into a rich family, and honestly most of us are happy that life's been financially kind to you. Not everyone is so lucky.

    You have no reason to feel bad, it's not like you're using your wealth to do bad things to people. No, the reason we're all fired up is because of the question you asked in specific. A lot of us have been a little down on our luck, and some don't necessarily see a way to make any better of it.

    You can't blame yourself for the place you were born at, and more than that you shouldn't feel guilty for it either.

    You said you were unhappy with the wealth, so we were suggesting that you try and find a way to live more modestly instead of relying on money to make you appear as though you're doing well. (*hug*)
     
  19. Ettina

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    As you well know, being rich doesn't make you happy - even though it makes others jealous.

    If you look at happiness versus income, the two are only correlated in the lowest ranges (eg, a minimum wage worker is happier than a homeless person, on average). Once you have enough money to live off of and meet your basic needs, having more doesn't make you any happier.
     
  20. Rose27

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    Alexander (*hug*)
    Lots of lengthy posts so forgive me if I repeat what others have written.
    Find a cause or charity you are passionate about. Volunteer. Learn about others struggles. Be compassionate.
    Rent a small apt. Downsize your life. Find out what sparks your joy and makes you want to get out of bed in the morning.
    You have a lot to give. I don't mean money. Share you. You deserve to be happy. Find out what makes you happy and do it!