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American Flag ban on the Fifth of May

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by DMark69, May 5, 2014.

  1. DMark69

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    A federal appeals court agreed that the school can ban display of the flag of the United States, in a high school in California. This is a violation of the students free speech, and I find it offensive that a public school would ban the flag of it's own nation. The holiday that is supposed to be today is NOT even a United States holiday. I don't have any problem with students wearing the flag of their nation, weather it be Mexico, Germany, Brittian, or any other, but if they can, then students who are proud of the United States should be able to as well.

    I guess I am a little more patriotic then many on this site. I have spent 12 years in the service defending this country. I also have to post this video in solidarity with those students whose freedom of speech was infringed:
    The Star Spangled Banner
     
  2. Caillin

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    Wai...wha...how is this a violation a free speech exactly though im just trying wrap my head around that...

    ---------- Post added 5th May 2014 at 07:23 AM ----------

    oh wow I read that wrong I thought they took the flag away because it violated free speech :lol:
     
    #2 Caillin, May 5, 2014
    Last edited: May 5, 2014
  3. BookDragon

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    A flag isn't speech it's expression, but regardless, you have a source for this or are we just taking your word for it?
     
  4. DMark69

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  5. BookDragon

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    "ongoing racial tension and gang violence within the school, and after a near-violent altercation had erupted during the prior Cinco de Mayo over the display of an American flag."

    Well if this is the case, I mean what is the alternative? Suspend the antagonists for wearing flag shirts and chanting USA? I bet that would go down like a house on fire...If it's a safety concern...I mean it might not be the BEST of all possible options but I currently can't think of anything more appropriate...last thing I would want as a school staff member is a flaming gang war starting up because a handful of idiots couldn't keep their damn mouths shut...
     
  6. Dinah

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    The whole legal proceeding I agree is quite ludicrous, but ^^^ that sums it up quite nicely. It's one thing to preserve freedom of speech and whatnot, but when a person or group of people takes it too far, to the point of inciting violence between opposing groups of people, then it's a problem. The solution is far from ideal but necessity breeds compromise.

    ---------- Post added 5th May 2014 at 08:49 AM ----------

    Hell, Fred Phelps and his merry band of fundamentalist Christian terrorists are a prime example of abuses of American 'freedoms'.
     
    #6 Dinah, May 5, 2014
    Last edited: May 5, 2014
  7. HuskyPup

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    Schools have the right to ban kids from wearing just about anything. (sadly enough) I think this was merely a compromise to try to diffuse explosive racial tensions.

    I think what's more to the point of the matter is the increasingly anti-foreign, anti-Mexican, xenophobic, nationalistic sentiment that's bubbling up among the American right, and any number of Republicans. This isn't so much about flags, as race and ethnicity, and another example how how the right takes some minor event, and makes it look like everyone is out to get them.
     
  8. valerie247

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    Let's clarify something that seems to be highly misinterpreted EVERYWHERE.

    The rights that citizens of the US have (freedom of speech, for example) ONLY protect people from being punished by the government. That's it. You can't be sent to jail for voicing your disdain for Obama. There are two more subpoints to this:

    1. That right isn't even without exception. You can be punished by the government for harrasment, verbal threats, etc. You do not have the freedom to say absolutely-fucking-anything, despite what many people believe.

    2. That right has absolutely no bearing on what other organizations, companies, families, etc. put into their rules of conduct. You can be fired, you can be suspended, you can be boycotted, etc. for what you say. None of that infringes on your right to free speech because you are not being escorted to jail. Words have power, and everyone reaps the consequences of what they say, whether positive or negative. Just because the government can't send you to jail, doesn't mean the general public has no recourse.

    That is all.
     
    #8 valerie247, May 5, 2014
    Last edited: May 5, 2014
  9. Dinah

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    :eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap
     
  10. valerie247

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    I forgot to add, in this scenario, it seems as though they were using the US flag to harrass others. Again, harrassment isn't covered by the first amendment.
     
  11. Caleb2001

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    I think if they ban our flag then a compromise would be to ban ALL flags. Not just ours. That is a compromise to me.
     
  12. Beetle

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    Well, Cinco de Mayo is an American holiday. It was started by Mexican Americans in the western USA around the Civil War to celebrate their heritage.

    But it is a bit ludicrous. It sounds like some students were using it to harass others, though.
     
  13. Aussie792

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    Your nationalism strikes me as rather inappropriate; they were harassing Mexican students on one of their national days by being nationalistic and almost certainly racist. I'm sure you wouldn't like it if someone displayed an Imperial Japanese flag on the day of the Battle of Midway. Although the link isn't as direct, the point is that what they were doing was inappropriate and deliberately divisive.
     
  14. Redd

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    I remember reading this a long time ago, it sparks a lot of interesting thoughts. If I remember correctly, there was also a case in which an elementary schooler was in trouble for wearing a Green Bay jersey on a school field trip to a Minnesota practice. I can see why the school would want to disallow that, because it isn't exactly polite, and they have the right to enforce a dress code, but it just doesn't sit right in my mind that dress codes exist. There should be better ways of teaching kids what's appropriate to wear where, like maybe just a solid understanding of respect and practicality would be effective. Force only creates rebellion, which perpetuates the problem. Usually there isn't a problem in the first place though, I am a huge advocate of breaking from the crowds and looking how you want, as long as it doesn't cause trouble. On the flip side of that, there are some things that cause trouble that shouldn't because people react rudely to things they disagree with, but this could also be solved if everyone could get a good handle on the concept of respect. The law should be left out though, regardless. The intent of the constitution was not to decide what people are and aren't allowed to wear. It amazes me how reliant society is on the law to say what is right and wrong, like if it isn't a law they should go out and abuse the fact that it isn't illegal. I definitely don't think all people are that way, or even a majority, but there are way more people out there like that than there should be. I just don't get why people start trouble, unless they truly believe it's for a good cause.
     
  15. Pret Allez

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    It's dumb to ban the flag, I agree, but I think patriotism is extremely questionable. It amounts to worship of the State.
     
  16. Argentwing

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    After my initial patriotic indignation subsided XD I agreed with the school for the one-day ban. If students only wore it to incite conflict with Mexicans, then it should be taken away. The "bad kids" (and you can almost always pick them out by sight alone) have the funny talent of ruining the most innocuous things for everybody else.
     
  17. BryanM

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    The reason it was banned was because the flags could have invited violence, as most of the people wearing the American flags are the "they took mah jerb" anti-immigrant types, and think that they're superior because they were born here, and like to inflame others for simply celebrating their heritage. As someone who is part Native American, I find those particular displays of the American flag offensive and believe they would be offensive to those of Latin American origin. A one day ban of the US flag should suffice, and that should be the end of it. You can wear your flag the other 364/5 days of the year.
     
  18. all paths

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    *standing O*

    ---------- Post added 7th May 2014 at 10:09 PM ----------

    :roflmao:
     
    #18 all paths, May 7, 2014
    Last edited: May 7, 2014
  19. Pret Allez

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    I am of the opinion that, instead of banning things because violence might magically materialize out of the aether, we should, you know, deal with peer abuse in our schools.

    We could maybe start with actually punishing bullies. (I know I'm in fantasy land now, but a girl can dream right?)
     
  20. all paths

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    Yeah, that too.

    It's just that, you can't force them to change from the inside out. Sometimes all you can do (which they did) is enforce a change on the outside. (Unfortunately in this case, banning something otherwise positive and/or innocuous because of jackholes.)