Hey guys! I've recently read an interesting article in a magazine about homosexuality in other species and then I started wondering... There's dozens, if not hundreds of species where two individuals of the sam sex feel attraction to eachother, but there's only one that discriminates individuals based on that. Us. And my question is why? I used to think it was all because of the Bible, but gay-hatred was probably around at the time of ancient romans and greeks, long before christianity spread. I wouldn't go ahead and include the Egyptians because they were a lot more open about sexual stuff compared to other civilizations. Did one ape-man with a club just decide not to like gays and it became fashionable or what?
Actually, there was a lot of gay sex around the times of the greeks and romans. I see several possible conditions for the rise of homophobia: -Population was declining severely, so reproductive sex was encouraged, and relationships that couldn't lead to children frowned upon -Someone down the line realised that controlling sex controlled people, and used this to their advantage -Some religion decided to change their attitudes towards sex in order to set themselves apart from all the others. Because no, homophobia has not always been around.
All I can say is that the new Pope seems to be ok with gay people and that laws and stuff are being passed everywhere allowing gays more rights. I really hope it turns out good; for the sake of all of us here!
It's me...sorry guys, my bad. But seriously, folks, Do you just assume this? Or do you have evidence? I truly doubt it has been well-studied (or even remotely studied)...but it's certainly worthy of study. But in terms of why *we* (humans) discriminate, I posted this video earlier on another thread...very entertaining, but also very informative regarding where our culture gets some of its views about sex: History of Love and sex - Documentary - YouTube Enjoy!
Ancient greeks and romans had gay sex and orgies everywhere. You can google search 'ancient greek gay pottery' you'll see proof - however I'm not posting any on here because it'll probably get me banned (although personally I don't find it pornographic or offensive, it's history/archaeology) Even Apollo, the god of light, one of the most loved and widely worshiped gods in Ancient Greece was gay and mythology has many stories of him and his male lovers. Then religions popped up, Middle Age, puritanism, all these things got 'prohibited', sex was allowed only after marriage and only for reproduction, and since these ideas remained for centuries generation after generation they are now deeply rooted in most traditions and peoples' way of viewing morality, and what is 'wrong' and what is 'right'.
IIRC, homophobia was very strong in Rome. You were fine if you simply topped other men, but if you bottomed it was seen as undesirable. If you pursued other men past a certain age it was also looked down upon--it was more seen as a youthful, immature interest. There are other cultures that have had a "topping fine, bottoming bad" sort of view. And there are also other cultures with institutional pederasty, like the Romans and Greeks--which can still be homophobic at the very same time which is sort of unusual for us westerners to wrap our heads around.
I think ultimately it comes down to a basic primal recognition that many people have of the importance in passing on their genes and reproduction. So, there is a social pressure for people to promote heterosexual sex to keep one's family, tribe, nation from dying out. Interestingly, the Greeks thought that homosexuality was superior to heterosexuality precisely because it was not for reproduction but represented pure love.
It challenges gender roles severely, which is the largest single factor I can think of (with religion often used as a tool to enforce roles). I don't believe that ancient social necessity and a primal instinct are responsible. The belief that it comes from a need to keep populations high strikes me as a sort of urban legend. Unless anyone has periodical (it's almost always ancient Israel as the example) sources proving that, I'm not going to believe it.
Romans and Greeks were very open, homosexuals weren't frowned upon and they even ran in a circus competitions naked... We can speculate but there is atleast 1 thing that certainly started a hatred war against gays and it's christianity.
Except in Ancient Greece and Rome, the bottom was officially subservient and often a slave or a much younger/less powerful man (or both), and the bottom was socially in a very low position. It wasn't a healthy sexuality, and the less dominant position got a great deal of disrespect. That's not anything like what we talk about in modern acceptance of homosexuality. Christianity is not alone in being a tool against homosexuality (and I wouldn't call it a cause)
We can't know exactly and precisely what happened 2 thousand years ago. But there are some things we do know: homosexuality was accepted before but after the arrival of christianity homosexuals started getting hunted. I'm not saying it caused all of this, maybe something entirely different did it, but christianity (and some other religions) is what exagerated the hate to the extreme.
