Coming clean

I don't care that you lied sam I'm just glad you're ok (*hug*) I'm actually kind of relieved u lied about HIV cause I was thinking oh man this poor guys suffering in the worst way and his poor daughter is gonna be fatherless but I'm glad that's not true and you're doing ok and I forgive you (*hug*)

 

I'm not surprised. It was suspicious. I just prefer to lean on the side of trust. Because what if somebody actually was going through all that?

I didn't really invest energy in you, so it's easy for me to feel unaffected, but, thank you for telling us the truth. Some stuff you said would be a truly horrible situation for somebody to be in and you still wouldn't deserve to suffer such a fate.

This is going to sound like a "Captain Obvious" statement... Sam, please keep this in mind; If you tell the truth about problems, you're likely to get more useful help.

 

It's very unfortunate that you lied, Sam2. =( But, I must say that it is very brave of you to make a post about it and be honest about the lies you've told. That's something very few people can do.

I'm obviously not happy that you told these lies, but you know that too. You are deeply sorry and there's nothing more you can do. Look, people can stay angry at you, that's their decision, but that won't fix anything.

The fact that you've confessed these things says something about your personality too. =) I hope others will accept your apology too. It'll take time, but I think they will, eventually. =)

 

Hi Sam,

While I can't say that I've invested huge amounts of time and energy in your situation (no specific reason, circumstances have just usually conspired to shake out that I didn't feel I had anything useful to add to a thread by the time I saw it. Or the subject matter was beyond my experience to feel I could say anything useful), I have followed it with interest.

While it's unfortunate that you lied, you are now stepping up, admitting your mistake, and seeking to make amends in a manner that can't be pleasant for you. And that earns you quite a bit of respect in my book (and no one automatically gets respect in my book. It must always be earned). I've already felt some for you watching you fight your addiction and family situation (know a little about both of those, actually). Now you've got more.

They say that living well is the best revenge. If you can grow from this and continue on your journey to the sort of life I know you can have and that you deserve (great husband, loving daughter, true friends and family,even if they aren't the ones you started with), then that's something worth a bit of discomfort now.

All the best to you and don't ever let them get you down. I'm not on EC as much lately, but if you ever want to talk, feel free to ping my wall and I'll get back to you ASAP.

Take care,(*hug*)

Todd

 

Sam, it's fair to say that I did invest a lot of time in responding to your posts on the forum, not just recently, but also going back over a number of months and I will admit to feeling rather upset and disappointed, most especially by the last thread you posted. HIV/Aids is terrible and it has devastated the lives of many thousands of LGBT people the world over. It's not something to lie about, or make light of, ever. If there is one thing that is sure to offend other people in our community, that's it.

Having said all of that I am impressed that you chose to offer a full and frank public apology and since I believe in forgiving people I will not hold it against you or condemn you in the way you expect. I would also urge other members to weigh their comments in a similar way.

Please remember that you do not need to lie or embellish things to make friends or find support here. Nobody does. You get the most out of EC membership by being real and authentic at all times and saying it how it really is.

You accepted my friend request a few weeks ago and I'm not taking it back Sam. A friend offers support at times, but fair criticism at others. I've been a little bit critical today, but now that I've said all of that, I'll continue to offer support if you ever want someone to talk to.

Patrick

 

I remember reading some of your posts, and finding some of them to be quite questionable. But in all honesty, I'm not mad. Was it wrong to lie? Yes. But I also think what is more important is that you are owning up to it, and are now coming clean about it. I have to commend you for that. I also am just really happy to hear that some of the things that you say you were experiencing were not true. I was worried about you when you said you had HIV for example and that you were dying, but honestly I am just truly happy that you do not have HIV, and you are well. I find this post to be highly commendable of you (*hug*)

 

Hi Sam. To be honest I'm not overly impressed with the likes but I'm glad you have been honest about it now. I don't embrace everything church has taught me but forgiveness is one of them and I'm still delighted to offer any support that I can give to you. I'm hoping the ec community can come together to support you regardless.
Thanks for being so honest now

 

Well thank you very much sam and no I'm not mad at all. I would be if you continued lieing but I think that was very brave for you to tell the truth. I kind of understand why you did that I mean I'm guessing it was for attention or whatever the reason was but with your past I wouldn't blame you at all. (*hug*) I really don't care that u lied and honestly I'm kinda glad u did lie really because I was thinking ah shit Sam's gonna die within the month but now it seems like you're ok and I know for sure we would all rather have you alive then dead.

 

Sam I was quite distressed by your recent posts. So there is a mixture of relief and anger but it seems you have done a good thing now and maybe learn from this whole experience.

 

Sam, were you serious about your suicidal thoughts? I don't see that mentioned here exactly...

 

I understand the reason why forum members take every personal story and cry for help seriously. Because if the story happens to be true and people react with indifference or with unsubstantiated accusations of deception, then they've just made an awful mistake. There could be harmful consequences, especially when dealing with topics such as physical assault, terminal illness, depression and suicide. And I believe that's why people are still being so kind to you now, even though you lied. No one wants to exacerbate your problems, whatever they might be.

But let me say this (since I am not quite so kind). I don't think your apology was either sincere or brave. A couple of weeks ago, when I read that you were dying of AIDS, I nearly left a message of sympathy for you, but something compelled me to check your posting history. I found more than a few incredible stories there. Story-telling is an art form and attention to the details paints a more realistic and believable picture. It was interesting to see how you would sometimes weave in specific details like CD4 numbers, how many months or years ago certain events took place, or the number of cars, assailants, lost teeth, and broken ribs.

It's not so easy to separate the lies from the truth and I cannot say for sure that I have any idea who you actually are, since Sam2 seems to be a fictional character that you created. So, regarding your apology, what difference does it make now if Sam2 is outed as a liar? He's not you. And you can just use a proxy, make a new account, assume a new identity, and start posting more stories. I suspect you've already done so.

Here's the thing. In my own life, I've known someone who lied compulsively to me and to those around him. He would lie, steal and manipulate to get what he wanted and other times he would lie for no discernible reason. And no matter how kind I was to him and no matter how many times I forgave him, he would still do it. It hurt me very much and it didn't work out for him either, as I am no longer his friend.

But here's what I took away from that experience. People who are pathological liars don't just come clean, change their ways, and then never do it again. It never happens like that. When a pathological liar gets caught in a lie, he doesn't become a better person, he becomes a better liar. I learned that the hard way. It's like that fable about the Frog and the Scorpion. They promise not to lie and manipulate ever again because it would hurt them, it would hurt you, it would hurt everyone. But, after all is said and done, they end up doing it anyway. Why? Because it's in their nature.

 

Suicidal thoughts can cause people to do wild things. I especially can't judge you if those feelings were true. I totally forgive you. I hope that you live a good life. I am glad you are being honest about this. Secondly, I applaud staff for their leniency in this issue.

 

Hey Sam,

I commend you for coming forward and admitting what you have done.

Several months ago, you told me you are Jewish. So, whether you are, or not, I will give you a story about a liar, and a rabbi.

In a small Jewish village in what is now Poland, there was a man who spread terrible gossip about the local rabbi. After a while, he felt remorse and approached the rabbi with contrition, saying that he felt sorry for what he did and that he needed to know what to do to make it better. The rabbi told the man to come back the following day for an answer.

As an aside, it is a great sin in Judaism to spread rumours about someone, even if they are true. One of the Ten Commandments is to not bear false witness. When the man returned, the rabbi told him to take a pillow outside, cut it open and then let the wind carry away the feathers. Once done, he was then to pick up and gather each and every feather.

You did indeed cross the line with that HIV story, it was especially troubling to me personally, as my sister is suffering from that condition; you need to be aware that I don't treat this issue lightly, and I can tell you from personal experience that this is a very serious and damaging disease. There may have been others here at EC as well who have loved ones who are nearing the end of their lives, or who may themselves be very ill.

Everyone, absolutely everyone has a chance at redemption, to re-deem yourself is to regain your value and your reputation. King Solomon himself would say "A good name is rather to be chosen than riches." So I commend you for attempting to redeem your good name, while reminding you that you have done a lot of damage. It isn't easy to pick up all those feathers...and just like gathering up scattered feathers, it will take a long time, just as it will for us to regain trust in you.

Nevertheless, I'm glad you are owning up to this and I wish you well in your effort toward redemption.