Outing people - double standard?

Where I am in life now, I have problems with forcing someone out to others, especially for entertainment or retaliation purposes. Respectfully discussing the possibility out of concern for a close friend or family member can be ok in specific occasions. But not as a means to humiliate a person. It's tough enough dealing with some of the str8s, really.

However I do notice in both your cases, the temptation to do so seems to come out of frustration that the outee appears to be taking advantage of a situation, and being on the dl manages to escape some of the negative aspects of being out. I can see how frustrating that can be, and that having that knowledge is something available to change the balance of power in a situation.

Personally at this time tho, the only time I can see it possibly justified is if the outing was only incidental (i.e. you find out your best female friend's husband is happily cheating on her with a dude, or the only friend's alibi against some serious charges is that he was with another guy at the time, at a known gay bar, etc...).

Food for thought, definitely.

 

It's only okay to out someone against their will if they are doing violence to the LGBT community be publicly agitating against it. The homophobic politicans getting butt fucked on the side, those are the ones who need outed.

I live by the maxim that in the LGBT struggle, there's no draft, but I will suffer no treason.

 

I think that unless someone specifically asked you for help with that, maybe because they don't have the courage to do it themselves, it is not ok to out them. You don't know what kind of impact that would have on their personal and professional lives, it could ruin their career, it could put a major strain in their relationships with their family. It would take a really nasty attitude for me to even begin to consider doing something like this and even so, ultimately, I don't think I could do it. Having said that, human behavior is complicated and at times unpredictable, things are rarely black and white.

 

As far as I'm concerned, it's never okay. Especially since outing someone can get them disowned, physically harmed or worse. It's purely a power move. Most of us can think of a time when we weren't out and damning that information getting out into the wild might have been.

 

Never never never...

I don't like it when gay media or bloggers try to one-up each other and compete to out people, especially if those people aren't hostile and haven't worked against gay rights. The bloggers usually say, "Well, this person should be standing up for us and our rights!" but not everyone is a leader and not everyone feels comfortable being a spokesperson. I think it was Anderson Cooper who they were really piling on for a few years, and now he's out and advocating but in his own time. Forcing them out is really inconsiderate and disrespectful, not to mention it could have serious consequences. I know it's 2015 and all, but still.

Not that anyone cares, but if someone outed me to my family my relationship with my parents would be destroyed. Unfortunately I know that because my parents are outright hostile to anything gay or lesbian. If someone outed me they would be taking away my choice to do it in my time, the way I choose to.

The only exception is when it's a politician who has been hostile to gay rights and votes against marriage equality and things like that. Those are public figures and they know their personal choices will reflect on them professionally. I'm still not comfortable with outing people like that, but I guess I'm a little more understanding if they've been hypocritical and doing real harm to LGBTQ rights.

 

No, I don't feel anyone has the right to out someone, without their permission, its like violating someone's privacy.

 

An interesting and much debated subject in the LGBT community.

Peter Tatchell threatened to out gay bishops in the Church of England if they chose to discipline clergy for marrying same sex partners. It's something he did a few years ago amid some controversy. You can read more about it here: Peter Tatchell: I am considering outing bishops who discipline married gay clergy · PinkNews

Many will disagree with me, but I support Peter Tatchell on this. It's one of the few circumstances when I would support the outing of an individual. In most cases I am totally opposed to outing anyone.

This thread gives me the opportunity to put a scenario to the good folk of EC that I haven't seen arise on this forum and maybe never will, but I have come across elsewhere...

Suppose a closeted gay friend tells you (an open member of the LGBT community) that he really, really wants to come out, but will never be able to find the courage to say it. He then tells you that he wishes someone would publicly out him to force the issue, just so he could be done with it and get on with life.

How would you respond? Would this be a legitimate reason to out someone? Would you do it? Just interested in your opinions.

 

I don't think it's okay to out people, but I fantasize about someone else spreading gay rumors about me. Mainly because no one seems to believe me when I try to come out. I think people would be more likely to believe gay rumors. Especially if more than one person spreads it.

 

There's something to consider about all of this...

Some individuals, depending on their place in society or power they hold, if they were outed, could actually force people to be aware of the issues, and to reconsider their stance. For example if, for whatever reason, Barack Obama were outed as homosexual, it would definitely challenge some things.

Compare this to say, Dave who works at McDonald's. Some folks could be beneficial to the community as a whole, if they were out.

Of course, outing people when they aren't ready is fucked up, that's hard to argue for or justify.

 

If they are exploiting and hiding behind homophobia or transphobia, that's an act of violence. It's stunning to me that the LGBT community can still be arguing the ethics of this issue for decades.

 

Just pointing that out.

Not something I'd ideally do, save maybe for the example PatrickUK mentioned.

 

Lol, I agree. It's probably better for them to be outed, for their own good and the community. however, I'd probably argue that you should help them once you've outed them, who knows what they were raised in, why they were the way they were, and what psychological damage this has done. I'd rather see both parties come out just fine.

 

I said exploiting and hiding behind. I am baffled by the difficulty in construing those words requiring outward manifestation of violent behavior.

My requirement was that the behavior of the homophobe is measurably harmful (ie causes a discriminatory legislative outcome.)

 

with pictures and videos.
lets just call it the republican congressional year book.

 

I would agree with this. In every other circumstance, I believe that it is no one's business. The cruelty of the act of outing some private individual would be unfathomable. It would not only affect the individual, but could adversely affect family, work, and friends. To leave someone exposed like that is vile.