The World History Of Male Love

[Z3ni]

Check this out, I didn't realise homosexuality was that long.

And I had NO idea male love ws popular in greek times.

[RaeofLite]

Yep. There used to be acceptance of it til the Dark Ages I believe when Religion tried to stamp out science and other civil rights issues.

[Johnnieguy]

Originally Posted by RaeofLite

Yep. There used to be acceptance of it til the Dark Ages I believe when Religion tried to stamp out science and other civil rights issues.

I'm so glad we live in more enlightened times...Or do we?

No offense, but I have difficulty taking seriously a site that wants to attempt a semi-scholarly discussion of history while advertising for gay pornography at the same time.

[Bryan90]

Lol.. History is often romanticized.

With my limited knowledge in history, I have yet to encounter a "homosexual relationship" (in 21st century terms) in the books of history. From what I've heard, in ancient greek, relationships are more between older men and younger boys (pederastic relationships); and I think the people depicted in history (a very small sample) were expected to get married and bear children.

The same goes to the Islamic civilization (say Ottoman Empire). Although literature was abound on relationship between men and boys, sodomy was punishable by death.

So, can we actually say homosexuality has a long history? The statement itself is ambiguous as we have yet to define homosexuality. Today's idea of homosexuality, men building families with men and adopting children etc, I don't think was ever recorded (to my knowledge) in the books of history.

[L|L]

Butt darts is as old as time!

[stratavos]

... nice site

[Miss Bubbles]

Actually people Greeks were only ok with it if only one guy was the "Man". They did not allow swapping of roles in those relationships. And even then they only really allowed it to happen first with a boy of the age of 13-19. After the boy became a man his "Mentor's"(older lover) life would be put on trial if the boy did not think the lover was good enough. And if they did think they were good then they had the choice of staying with them or taking on their own "prodigy"(younger lover). And the receptive partner was not considered a man at all because they viewed being penetrated as being weak. As for the dark ages it was legal until they viewed the act of being penetrated as a sin not the act of "pitching". So in England they began to have anti-sodomy laws which made that act illegal. I have been studyng this for a couple of years. And in some places in the ancient world it was actually expected of a man to have a younger male lover. Thats how we get pedophiles. It actually had a starting basis in ancient Greece.

[Daniel]

It really depended on the city-state. And then there was the Roman emperor who declared his gay lover a god. WOW...Alexander the Great was gay as well.

All this I learned in my Ancient Western Civ class last semester.

[SaturdaySaviour]

Different cultures had/have different views on homosexuality. In many of them gay relationships (usually consisting of an adult male and an adolescent boy) were considered normal, but during Renaissance the Church and the authorities in the West decided to stop the acts of sodomy.

Still, considering that the relationships were (borderline) pedofilic and there was a social stigma towards men that "took the role of women", like one poster above said, I wouldn't really compare our situation with that.

Originally Posted by Kevin42

No offense, but I have difficulty taking seriously a site that wants to attempt a semi-scholarly discussion of history while advertising for gay pornography at the same time.

Agreed

In ancient Greece, homosexual sex was only acceptable if the 'receiving' male hadn't hit puberty yet. It was unacceptable for a grown man to 'receive' because that was the role of a woman.

In ancient Rome, homosexual sex was only acceptable if the 'receiving' male was not a Roman citizen. Like Greece, it was unacceptable for a Roman citizen to 'receive' during sex.

[dromadus]

Originally Posted by Bryan90

Lol.. History is often romanticized.

With my limited knowledge in history, I have yet to encounter a "homosexual relationship" (in 21st century terms) in the books of history.

So, can we actually say homosexuality has a long history? The statement itself is ambiguous as we have yet to define homosexuality. Today's idea of homosexuality, men building families with men and adopting children etc, I don't think was ever recorded (to my knowledge) in the books of history.

This is an excellent observation and I think along with others responding to this thread you have hit on some important points. I agree with you.

We have entered a totally unmapped universe with our version of what it means to be gay. This is the 21st century with new ideas, forms, tools, and visions. However, men who liked boys, boys who liked other boys, women who liked other women (and I do mean sexually) have always been around trying to make their lives work and their needs met.

We are doing something new with it and I think while it had roots in places you have discussed (Greece, Rome, etc.) our modern version goes at least as far back as the late 19th and early 20th centuries (Oscar Wilde and his date with a jail cell), Gertrude Stein (who coined the word "gay") and Alice B. Toklas (known for her famous recipe for brownies -don't ask ) and many many others. And we are gathering momentum every year. This is something "new under the sun."

What is going on now is an absolute revolution and we are all a part of it.

[Mirko]

Hi there! EC Staff have removed the links as the sites contained porn ads and links to port sites. Please keep in mind that EC is a PG 13 site.

I would encourage you to find more 'educational' sites on the same or a similar topic or sites that do not have porn ads or provide links to 18+ sites.

Sorry for the interruption.....