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Is homosexuality morally wrong?

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by Tim C, Sep 28, 2007.

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  1. Tim C

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    Over the years I've come to believe that most of what we've been taught about God misses the mark. Many of the doctrinal positions that are taught as gospel don't stand up to close scrutiny. As an Interfaith Minister, my position on homosexuality is exactly the same as it is on heterosexuality: sin has nothing to do with sexual orientation- it's all about hurting others.

    Being gay is no more of a sin than being straight. How can I say that with certainty? Because being gay doesn't automatically hurt anyone anymore than being straight does. Does that give a gay person the right to sleep with multiple partners in an irresponsible way? No, especially with the current dangers of disease but no even without that. Hurting others selfishly to get what you want is always wrong- it's always a sin. In fact, that's the definition of sin.

    God is love...

    That sounds good but there's a lot more to God than that, right? I don't think there is. Love is actively caring about others- caring in the right way. It's a combination of goodwill, genuine kindness, honest forgiveness, true acceptance, and of constantly hoping for a positive outcome. If someone hurts you, it's okay to want justice but it's not okay to feel hatred. To err is human, to forgive divine. To sincerely hope that people will turn from their wrongs- to grow wiser, more considerate, more faithful, and be less hurting to others- that's the way of God. It has nothing to do with how often you go to church. It has nothing to do with the specifics of your doctrinal beliefs. It has nothing to do with your sexual orientation.

    John Lennon's words were, "Love is the Answer and you know that for sure". Some of you who are reading this are nodding because you do know it. You know that God loves you regardless of your being gay. You know that being gay has nothing to do with the content of your character. You know when your conduct is totally selfish and when you're doing things from a compassionate heart. God isn't in the religion business- he's in the love business.

    If anyone reading this still fears that God is disappointed that they are gay- trust me- God doesn't care. God wants you to be honest and honorable. She wants you to be balanced and responsible. She wants you to live the life you truly believe to be right for you- with a genuine commitment to caring about yourself and others.

    Being gay just is. It's like being left handed. Most people are right handed- so what? Why would that make them morally superior? If God didn't want you to be gay- he's certainly powerful enough to push you away from that.

    You are a growing, experiencing individual who finds it easier to love (romantically & sexually) people of the same sex. This would hurt nobody if they simply took it at face value. Any hurt that comes from that comes from a lack of acceptance. It comes from judging. It comes from a belief that it's morally wrong. But for it to be morally wrong- it would need to injure somebody. Stealing is morally wrong. But being gay just is.

    Tim
     
  2. Wow, that was a very very good way of putting it. It helps a real lot. I always thought about that stuff, how if God is there he must hate me for liking members of the same gender. But believe it or not this makes me feel a whole lot better about the situation.
     
  3. Ilayis

    Ilayis Guest

    tell me something i don't know
     
  4. bvtsjm116

    bvtsjm116 Guest

    Yes, I go to a catholic school and it made me mad looking in the back of the book (to write the prayers we had for homework) and under like the really bad sins were "homosexual activities" then it showed the bible verses, which, were VERY unclear and made no sense to me at ALL. I believe in the God I want to believe in. Most people think its a choice to be gay, but, really, if a guy had a choice to be gay or straight I know I would want to choose what society call 'normal' but it is not a choice. I've liked guys since I was like 7-8 years old. I wasn't even sexually attracted to them yet. Ok, well, anyways, I'm going to believe in the way I see God and the Church cannot tell me otherwise. They don't know I'm gay and they don't have to know. I don't feel like I am doing anything wrong. I was born this way and I cannot force myself to LIE to a woman and PRETEND to be straight, then end up in a relationship thats a LIE. Also, straight guys are just as bad. Just cause you like girls does not mean that you are a good person. Just because you are gay doesn't mean you are a bad person. Just because our sex doesn't produce offspring doesn't mean we are bad. From the little I know many straight people don't just have sex to have children :wink:

    Ok, well, I am going on... I probably made no sense but thats how I feel.
     
  5. Kibuki kid

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    Finally some one said it! Thank you so much for posting this. Im pretty sure all of us here think and believe this but its always nice to see some one write it, especially some one in your position. Even though its nowhere near enough ala i can say is thank you.
     
  6. cutegayjessie

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    do ya'll actually believe in god lol
     
  7. Ilayis

    Ilayis Guest

    I'll give ya a tip,watch what you say buddy!
     
  8. bvtsjm116

    bvtsjm116 Guest

    Umm, I sorta do. Well, I know its hard to believe in, and I still struggle believing something exists I have no proof of, but I guess I am sorta mixed but I'll say yes. There has to be something after this life...
     
  9. ALieToDieFor

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    I believe in god but i dont believe he is the supreme being everyone makes him out to be.
    My friend sent me this and i have kept it on my computer/myspace and anywhere else I can put it.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPzso1OOTPM
     
  10. I don't believe in God really, but worrying over this stuff is what led me to stop. So I appreciate that someone actually is saying my fears were unfounded.
     
  11. waitingsucks

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    this was really good hearing another person affirming what i already though. There are so many more saying the opposite to you and the main weapon people use for homaphobia is faith even though they overlook so many of the basics the bible and the world around them is teaching them
     
  12. Kimi

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    I thought it was really good. It makes whole alot more sense than the bible:eusa_clap

    Even tho I don't believe in god, it still made me feel good:slight_smile:
     
  13. pirateninja

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    I'm not really religious, but it made me feel a whole lot better.
     
  14. Tim C

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    It's quite interesting that Jesus never says a single thing in the bible about homosexuality. But he has plenty to say on the subject of judgment and forgiveness! He tells us that as we forgive others, so shall we be forgiven. And he tells us that with the same judgment we judge others, so too shall we be judged. He also talks about perfecting ourselves before we begin pointing out the faults of others.

    It's true there are bible verses that seem to condem homosexuality. But a key element of getting the most from the bible is to look at everything it says with an accurate context of what it was really trying to say. The Old Testament was written before Jesus was born. It was written prior to his bringing his amazing gift of Grace. Much of what the Old Testament says serves as a history- it provides us with a context of how things were prior to Jesus (please note that this explanation is coming from a Christian perspective- I believe that other religious perspectives deserve every bit as much respect).

    The Old Testament was written in Hebrew, a language with very few words and no vowels! The Hebrew word for kill, murder, injure, do injustice to are all the same. So a verse as simple as Thou Shalt Not Kill is probably translated inaccurately because we kill all the time. We kill to defend ourselves, our loved ones, our country- a more likely translation of that is Thou Shalt Not Murder.

    The verses that seem to condemn homosexuality may have similar problems. How much of what is written is condemning promiscuous & irresponsible sex and not homosexuality in general s very difficult to pinpoint. How much is cultural or societal is difficult to pinpoint. And how much is the opinion of the author and how much is God- that's also difficult to pinpoint. We have to remember that the Old Testament writers believed that God required animals to be sacrificed to him- that seems a little barbaric, doesn't it?

    Look, I'm not advocating an irresponsible "do whatever you want" spiritual perspective. The great Chinese philosopher Confucius gave us a brilliant starting point when he told us "not to do to others what we wouldn't want done to us." I wouldn't want you to kick me so I won't kick you. I wouldn't want you to steal from me so I won't steal from you. I wouldn't want you to lie about your feelings for me so I won't lie about my feelings for you. I wouldn't want you to say something mean to me so I won't say something mean to you. This Golden Rule shows us an easy way to respect others and to establish moral boundaries.

    Tim
     
    #14 Tim C, Sep 29, 2007
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2007
  15. Ty

    Ty Guest

    Im slowly begging to accept myself...this website is so helpful
     
  16. beckyg

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    You know what, it's okay if somebody doesn't believe in God. Let's just keep this conversation respectful. We all have different religious backgrounds. Some of us are religious, some are not, some consider themselves spiritual instead. One of the things that I have loved about being around the GLBT community is that they seem to have more tolerance and respect for people of different beliefs and faiths than the average joe. I love that!
     
  17. Ilayis

    Ilayis Guest

    I apologize for that statement!
    It is always interesting to hear other people's opinions on what they think about God,just as long as they are not preaching,which I don't care for,as nobody is here.
     
  18. xxAngelOnFirexx

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    i believe in a higher power. i do not beleive in religion. i have beleifs of what may be true nothing is in stone to me. good post many people here seriously need to read this.
     
  19. joeyconnick

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    Nope... not as some kind of sentient, omnipotent patriarchal entity, and not as "god is love" either.
     
  20. 24601

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    Although I myself don't believe in God or any higher power, I still found your post to be interesting and inspirational reading. I wish all religious people could see the world in this way.

    Aside from the actual contents of the post though, I noticed you called God a she. I have never heard this before, and while it doesn't really matter to me what gender you believe your God is, it still piqued my curiosity.
     
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