Cheating...

I don't have an answer, but a question...

Is it cheating if I go out with a female who I pretend to be interested in (but I'm not 'cause I'm gay), if I've encouraged my boyfriend that she's just necessary to end gay suspicions surrounding me at my school and I don't actually feel anything for her but she doesn't know that??

Well... I'm starting to fall into this position and wondering what to do... the female in question has started phoning me and is picking me up tonight. My bf seems surprisingly upset at this (there are maybe a few reasons which are too difficult to explain also, but never mind that) and he was supposed to come over a few hours ago but now has not shown up, so I'm gettin' worried.

In a way I almost feel like I feel something for this female, but I don't think so at the same time... and also this may be one of my last chances to experiment with a female (I haven't really experimented with females all that much yet).

So, what does everybody think of that? (I know the answer will be 'cheating' except that in the past didn't lots of gay men have to accept the fact that their boyfriend/partner will have to carry on fake female relationships or a sham marriage?)

 

All I can tell you is that if I were your boyfriend, I'd be pretty pissed at you too. I don't know if I'd term it "cheating," per se, but I can completely understand why he'd be upset with you going out with some other person for cover.

Uh... you have a boyfriend already. Unless you guys have agreed to be non-monogamous, "experimenting" with a girl would definitely be cheating.

Yes... in the PAST. And just because a lot of people felt they had to do it, that doesn't make it right, whether it's 2006 or 1956.

The real issue here is why you think it's okay to lead someone on who you have no interest in. I can understand being afraid of being "found out" but to toy with someone else's feelings simply to provide yourself cover... that's just plain wrong. There's no grey area here, unless you think your life is actually in danger if people find out you're gay, in which case I assume you'd go to a female friend and ask for her help, rather than using someone. If you can't have a relationship with a guy without duping some innocent, then you shouldn't be having a relationship with a guy.

Or, from another perspective, how would you feel if someone started a relationship with you, not becaue they liked you but because it provided them some form of cover? I'd imagine you'd feel pretty damn shitty; I know I would. The golden rule, then applies: do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

Or maybe you'd like the Wiccan version: An it harm none, do as you will. The converse being true: if it's hurting someone, don't do it.

It's one thing to be confused and to have a girlfriend but then end up involved with a guy. It's quite another to have a boyfriend and consciously go seeking a relationship with a woman when you're pretty sure you're not into women, you're already in a relationship, and you're seeking to use the woman in question for selfish reasons.

You sound like you're seeking some kind of validation, and this is the only validation I can give: it's totally normal to be scared about being found out. And it's totally normal to wonder exactly how gay you are. But making those two issues someone else's problem? That's completely unacceptable.

 

I think different people have vastly different notions of cheating. For instance, I kissed another guy I had feelings for on the lips (and that's it, just a goodbye kiss) and my then-boyfriend was extremely unimpressed and felt I had betrayed him. I felt like I hadn't because quite honestly I wanted to sleep with the other guy badly--but that's a pretty selfish and relative way of looking at it. People don't generally get rewarded for NOT doing something bad, otherwise I'd have a whole house full of medals for not killing several of the utterly stupid and worthless people I've met in my life.

My general notion of "cheating" would be doing something physically or emotionally intimate with another guy who is not your boyfriend. The "physically intimate" thing is easier to figure out than the "emotionally intimate" bit... maybe it's more like "doing something emotionally intimate with a guy you have romantic feelings for" (in order to rule out being accused of cheating on your boyfriend with your best friend(s). But I could also see a significant other having issues with spending a lot of time with someone you had feelings for.

Of course, some people are (in my opinion) extreme and believe that even HAVING feelings for someone else while you're in a relationship is a betrayal. I don't think I've ever met anyone who's ability to be attracted to others simply turns off when they become involved with someone, so I tend to think that the people who find this kind of thing to be a betrayal are a little... high-strung, shall we say.

I think people in healthy relationships are comfortable enough with and trust one another enough that they can admit when they find someone else attractive (physically, personality-wise, mentally, etc.).

So yes, in a lot of respects, cheating is a very relative thing. It doesn't seem like that at first glance but human relationships are some of the most complex relationships there are, so it stands to reason that something like "cheating" is not very cut-and-dried.

 

Joeyconnick: harsh... I agree, though, really. Some of what I said above was more just to play devil's advocate to what was going to be said but...

To be honest, I'm getting more and more confused here because I did meet with my bf (he was just later than expected) but it just didn't feel the same anymore. Not that I was thinking of her, but just that it's "different". And there's something about the female... I seriously don't know what I'm feeling... I don't think it's normal heterosexual feelings but more just a desire to hold her and kiss her... really strange. Alright, my post is getting too much like 'I'm a sexually confused teenager' thing...

I'm not just leading her on... because I do like her. I'm not just using her to provide me with cover. (My above post was more of a macrocosmic/general situation. Personally: I do feel something for her). I'm upset about how upset my bf is too and so I'm struggling with this. The way I feel, I really do feel like going out with her. So, that suggests I'm bisexual... but I have a nagging in the back of my head that I'm not. That, to me, is a very bad sign... urgh.

Golden Rule: I don't think I'm hurting her (not yet; potentially never). I can't predict what's going to happen. I'm trying to play it by ear but things aren't going so well.

Another thing to think about is that she's probably wondering why I haven't asked her out yet. We're right beside each other touching/snuggling at every party and we spent a long time staring into each other's eyes last night. Her friend told me she'd go out with me if I asked her, and then told me to ask her "tonight!" So, I think she must really be wondering why I haven't just asked her yet...

I'll have to just keep going and see what happens. I don't know what I'm striving for anymore.

But, would telling my bf he can have a female relationship too solve everything?? (That's not a serious question, but answer it if you want)

 

I've found that a lot of times people (and I'm including myself here) will use the excuse of being confused (especially when it's societally "sanctioned" the way the notion of the "sexual confused teenager" is) to justify getting themselves into situations which I think that if we were honest with ourselves up front we know are going to turn out badly.

If it's not going so well, that's a good reason to pull out of it right there. And yes, you can pull out. Another thing we like to do is convince ourselves that we're powerless over certain situations when in reality, we could have changed course at any point.

And this would be where the whole notion of "cheating" comes in.

You have a boyfriend. If you ask her out without breaking up with him, that's cheating. You don't have to be a neurosurgeon to figure that one out. And no romantic partner that I know is going to be remotely okay with their loved one touching/snuggling with someone else at every party.

I really wouldn't advise you "keep going" in the direction you're headed. You're already hurting your boyfriend as it is (from what you've said about his reactions so far)--do you really want to include another person in the mix?

No, it wouldn't. About the only thing that would solve everything (given what I can tell of what you want at this point) would be to ask your boyfriend if he minded if you dated someone else while you guys are dating and having him say "not at all" and then asking the girl you are interested in (or think you're interested in--I only say that because you sound relatively unsure on this point) if she minds if you're dating a guy at the same time the two of you are dating and she says no, that's fine with her.

And the likelihood of that happening? About as likely as the NDP forming the next federal government of Canada on Monday.

 

(Joeyconnick: :eusa_clap I love your writing! I laughed the entire way through your last post!)

Anyways, don't worry: I really do seriously understand the situation. What I'm honestly doing is: just kind of accepting her advances and not really actively responding, but not making any forward moves (which she likely finds acceptable because I'm "shy") and so nothing has happened and nothing will happen most likely.

Except, this has caused my bf to get fairly upset... that is something on which I could use advice; I'm not sure how to reassure him and I'm not exactly sure whether he's alright with my aforementioned approach to this.

Besides that, the only other real 'problem' is that if she asked me out I can't say 'I already have a boyfriend' for obvious reasons, and from the way I've acted in the past (and what I've said to her friends when I wasn't dating anyone) it's mostly impossible for me to say I'm not interested or that I'm going out with any other female right now (plus, I'm a terrible actor/liar).

 

I agree with joeyconnick... boy or girl, you are hurting two people. You're looking at this situation too selfishly; "This will be the last chance I have to experiment with a girl, so it's ok to be dishonest to my bf." Affections come and go. If you're looking to try out a girl, then look for a prostitute, not a girlfriend. You can't just put your boyfriend on hold as if he were a machine to be turned on and off at will.

If I was in his position, I would be wondering if you were doing the same to me. What is there to prevent him from thinking that he isn't another experiment?

The girl, too. "Will you go out with me? I have a boyfriend, but I really care about you, and you can trust me with your time and your emotions."

If you really like your boyfriend, don't put him through this. If you like the girl, then tell your boyfriend. He shouldn't be your boyfriend if you deeply care for someone else more than you do for him, unless you're both just looking for fuck buddies.

You know more about your situation than we do, and we can only speculate. Whatever you decide, be honest to youe bf/gf if you expect the same.

 

I really understand your actions up to this point. I don't think you have intentionally lead anyone on (at least too far) yet. Your boyfriend does know that you are seeing this girl- just not that you may actually have feelings for her. And the girl- to be fair, you went out with her as a friend/cover in the beginning. That you actually have some feelings for her was not expected of intended to hurt anyone.
Now, where you go from here is important. It sounds like you shouldn't date the girl since you already have a boyfriend and since you mostlikely are gay an dnot bisexual. And to date a girl knowing your true sexuality is unfair and yes dishonest (I am a straight girl though, so maybe that opinion is biased).
What I think you should do is tell the girl that you are genuinely interested in her and that you like her, yet right now you want to work on developing a good friendship with her and see where that leads. If you say something like that you suggest a future (even just as friends). If you affirm her by telling her the things you like about her and don't say something like "we wouldn't be good together" etc. she will probably be okay with that. Also, since you daid you haven't been too intimate I don' t think she would feel rejected.
This way you can maintain your romantic relationship with your boyfriend and grow closer as a friend with the girl. If your boyfriend is still jealous, I would be concerned because he should allow you to have friends, even girls. If in the future you reexamine things and want a relationship with this (or another) girl that's okay because you've left that option open. In time, you may also tell her about your boyfriend, but probably not until you are closer friends.

 

Jenny2005: Hey, thanks. It's great to get an opinion from the perspective of a straight female. And... I think you've helped me. I think that's a great idea... I had kind of decided I'd tell her about my ex (yet pretend he's a she) and talk about how I'm not exactly comfortable dating her right now/that's why I didn't ask her out. And, telling her I genuinely like her but want to try getting to be better friends first is great. Good advice...

My boyfriend doesn't know what I feel for her, but he keeps asking and I only kind of answer. I would rather be with him than her but... it's surprisingly complicated.

Yeah, great advice... thanks again.