Your opinons on snobbery? - Empty Closets - A safe online community for gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgendered people coming out

DarkClarity · 21st Jul 2011, 06:20 AM

What I'm talking about are people who for whatever reason are snobs when it comes to things like TV and Movies, Music, Food, Class, Art etc. I know class is a whole another issue but you can comment about it if you want.

When it comes to TV, Art and Food I just don't really understand. Taste is subjective so I fail so see how you could look down upon a person just because they don't like what you like or disagree with your opinion. For example I don't like the Jeremy Kyle show but I don't object to others watching nor do I think less of the person.

Music is another one. Comments like "they don't know what real music is like" or (this one I saw on youtube once) "Only an idiot could dislike this". Again I feel this is down to taste so I don't really understand how someone looks down on someone simply because they like a different genre of music. While I'm on the subject of music I also find it odd when people regard you less of a fan of a artist or band if you haven't known about them since they first broke through.

So, what are your opinions on snobbery and on people who are TV snobs, Food snobs or just snobs in general?

Bowie · 21st Jul 2011, 07:48 AM

I think there are two ways to appreciate "art" (I'm using the word in a very broad sense here, meaning "work that is created with the objective of creating specific sensations on a group of observers"). The first one is very subjective. You enjoy it because you relate to it in some way. Maybe it's a song that deals with a significant experience you've had, or that refers to an important aspect of your cultural, social or emotional background. For example, I've really enjoyed watching Thor, mostly because it's a decent action film that's based on a comic about mythology, which I like very much. I've also loved Beautiful Thing, not because I think it's an exquisite piece of cinema, but because I thought it was really cute and it had much to do with something I'm going through right now.

The second way to appreciate art is much less personal. You enjoy it because it's a pleasurable sensory experience, or because it's really cleaver and sophisticated. That kind of art tends to be academically regarded as "good", and researchers from from their respective fields (literature, music, cinema etc.) try to establish more or less objective, although arguable, parameters to measure its quality. That kind of art usually aims to be "universal". For example, although I'm not religious and haven't lived in Bach's time, I can (and do!) enjoy his Toccata and Fugue in D minor.

There are obviously problems with that line of thought. I don't really think that "objectively good" art is really universal, to start with. An evidence of that is that different, equally qualified, academics have different "tastes", that is, tend to think that different works of art are good. On the other hand, I can't deny that there is a difference between the way I enjoy reading, say, Gabriel García Marques' 100 Years of Solitude and the way I've enjoyed reading Harry Potter.

The biggest problem, however, is that sometimes people think that the only kind of art that's worth enjoying is the "objective" one. That means disregarding the possibility of taking pleasure from something because you relate to that, which is rather silly, in my opinion. They completely deny that a work of "art" can talk directly to them. I believe that that is caused by a social notion according to which people who like "objective" art tend to be more intelligent than people who like "subjective" art, which is also very stupid. Therefore, I'd say that a snob is someone who thinks that only one kind of art is worthy of being appreciated by people other than him or herself.

I'm speaking as a layman here, out of my own, personal experience. I haven't actually studied the subject. Also, I'm not sure how that applies to food.

Steve712 · 21st Jul 2011, 07:56 AM

bookworm43 · 21st Jul 2011, 08:30 AM

snobs honestly make me wanna punch them in the face- they're extremely irritating.

Kerze · 21st Jul 2011, 08:50 AM

My big thing is music (some of you may have noticed this

), and I hope one day to be a music critic for two reasons;
1. My two passions are writing and listening to music. I consume music and listen to a wide variety of bands/acts/styles/genres, which isn't to say I don't have personal favorites.
2. I think I am good at objectively listening to music and appreciating it for how complex it is, or the atmosphere that is created, or the techniques the artist has employed, or the originality of the ideas and sound, or the skill required to make it, among other things.

I think using these things make something more valuable artistically than other music and this is what I judge things on when I listen to music. I can dislike an artist and I can think that something has no value in this way, but I also think there is a different value in music than people enjoy. If somebody likes it then fair enough, you go and enjoy it and I'm happy that you have something you like, even if I don't think it has artistic value. (That sounded very condescending and it is not intended to be, sorry about that...)

I have a problem with people who go to videos on youtube to tell people what great taste in music they have an how much this particular song sucks. That's nice, well done for likeing music, leave these people in peace to like the music they like. People like that

me off, because why would you do that, and why do you think these people want to hear what you think?

I guess I can sum up what I'm trying to say like this; there is a difference between being critical and being a snob. I don't like snobs who flaunt what great taste in music they have, look down on people who like other types of music and, most of all, listen to something because it's cool or obscure instead of because they like it. I have more respect for people who listen to music I don't like because they like it than people who listen to bands that I do like for the wrong reasons.

I don't think that was particularly clear, ask if I didn't say anything properly...

Markio · 21st Jul 2011, 11:50 AM

I just don't like 500 Days of Summer, and everyone else does. Oh how I wish someone would agree with me.

Bowie · 21st Jul 2011, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Markio

I just don't like 500 Days of Summer, and everyone else does. Oh how I wish someone would agree with me.

I agree with you! I really, really agree with you.

It's not that I think it's *horrible*, but I didn't think it was good either.

FJ Cruiser · 21st Jul 2011, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve712

Image

Yes.

I personally just laugh at them and think about how there are way more important things to do than nitpick other people's tastes.

Holliepop · 21st Jul 2011, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Markio

I just don't like 500 Days of Summer, and everyone else does. Oh how I wish someone would agree with me.

I don't hate it, but I didn't find it amazing. I kind of just watched it for Joseph Gordon-Levitt and Zooey Deschanel. Heh.

When it comes to music, I am a little bit snobby, unfortunately. There's just some songs or bands in which I don't understand how people can like them. Music is about expressing yourself and being creative, in which many artists who are incredibly popular aren't at all. That, and a song has got to at least sound good, and whilst that is subjective, there are some songs where I just go "Really? You heard that and thought it would be a good idea to pay money for it?"

I'm not snobby when it comes to musical genres though. I hate that. I have friends who LOVE heavy metal music and they actually talk about their hate of emo/softcore/indie/rock pop/alternative music more than their love for heavy metal. They say it isn't 'real music' and they call people who like that sort of stuff (I am one) really nasty things. But then, people can insult their type of music pretty easily too. People should just understand that whilst disliking/bashing a song/singer/band is fine (IMO), bashing A PERSON for their taste is a bit silly and childish.

**Lexington** · 21st Jul 2011, 01:35 PM

I can't be bothered to respond to this thread.

Lex

Bibliophile · 21st Jul 2011, 01:42 PM

I respect anyones right to like whatever they please and I will keep silent if I disagree with their taste for the most part. However when they try to put something I consider modern mass marketed drivel on the same level as timeless works of art I cant help but speak up. I mean just the other day I has to listen to someone on the bus try to call some teen vampire drama timeless.....really? You are going to put some mass marketed fad on the same level as a book such and The Hobbit or the works of Shakespeare? Yeah right. Or people that try to compare rappers like 50 cent to real artists like Dean Martin, Frank Sinatra, or the like. I am fine with people liking what they like but there is clearly good and bad art out there even if it does have its fans.

bookworm43 · 21st Jul 2011, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lexington

i Can't Be Bothered To Respond To This Thread.

Lex

Lol

Emberstone · 21st Jul 2011, 06:11 PM

To prove a point, I will be all academicly snobby, and tell you all to read Plato's 'Allagory of the Cave'.

Plato: The Allegory of the Cave

or, if you dont like fancy book-learnen, here is a animated version:

+ YouTube Video

and if that does nothing for you, here is a girl farting in a hot tub:

+ YouTube Video

RedState · 21st Jul 2011, 06:18 PM

My primary residence is in a country club filled with white republicans that throw black tie cocktail parties till all hours of the night every weekend, so I don't know if I've ever seen a snob so I don't know what one is.
But I think I would like them

thedreamwatch · 21st Jul 2011, 08:43 PM

I guess there are some people who honestly think they're better than everyone else because they're more cultured or something...

but sometimes I honestly wonder... what's the real difference between "being a snob" and having an opinion or enjoying really delving deep into something to find meaning or enjoyment?

Emberstone · 21st Jul 2011, 08:52 PM

about the only group of people I will say - with scientific certainty - I am better than are 'Twihards', and their cultish leader, Stephanie (bella swann) Meyer.

But we all are better by default.

Just Passing · 21st Jul 2011, 10:21 PM

I don't mind some sort of snobbery. Sometimes it just has to be done. Saying Justin Bieber is the greatest musician of all time over bands and individuals like the Beatles, Steely Dan, Michael Jackson, etc is just laughable, but there are some people who just generally thing that.

Other times however, I hate it when I express a minority opinion, say like when I say a film is overrated (like Finding Nemo, I can't stand it), but then I get slated for it and told it's not overrated. Excuse me, but when something has been highly rated, had a successful box office along with reviews and everything else, chances are it's overrated. There's plenty of films and TV series I love, but I can admit they're overrated when told. Pure snobbery.

I do love friendly debates though that doesn't literally insult the other person's opinion. I'm not even going to mention the time I admitted I used Internet Explorer on here and got pure slated for it and diminished into a certain group (aka the group that consists of little kids and elderly people supposedly, because they're crap, when I'm not crap on computers), because I used it. That pissed me off and I may have over reacted, but I was irritated as crap.

heatqueen · 22nd Jul 2011, 01:44 AM

Just let people enjoy whatever music/art/etc that they're into. If you don't like it, don't listen to it, but don't put down other people because they do like it. *sigh* when is the world going to learn to let people just be without judgement?!

21st Jul 2011, 06:20 AM	#1
DarkClarity Just a miserable pile of secrets. Full Member Gender: Male Orientation: Kinsey 4 Bisexual. Out Status: Not out at all Location: England, UK Age: 17 Posts: 1,025 Join Date: May 2011	Your opinons on snobbery? What I'm talking about are people who for whatever reason are snobs when it comes to things like TV and Movies, Music, Food, Class, Art etc. I know class is a whole another issue but you can comment about it if you want. When it comes to TV, Art and Food I just don't really understand. Taste is subjective so I fail so see how you could look down upon a person just because they don't like what you like or disagree with your opinion. For example I don't like the Jeremy Kyle show but I don't object to others watching nor do I think less of the person. Music is another one. Comments like "they don't know what real music is like" or (this one I saw on youtube once) "Only an idiot could dislike this". Again I feel this is down to taste so I don't really understand how someone looks down on someone simply because they like a different genre of music. While I'm on the subject of music I also find it odd when people regard you less of a fan of a artist or band if you haven't known about them since they first broke through. So, what are your opinions on snobbery and on people who are TV snobs, Food snobs or just snobs in general? __________________ I'm not a human being. I am merely a product of capital. I solely exist to carry out the will of capital. I will work, comsume and die all in order to preserve the status quo, to preserve inequality, famine, poverty and injustice, to preserve individualism and materialism, to preserve Capitalism.

21st Jul 2011, 07:48 AM	#2
Bowie Well Known Full Member Gender: Male Orientation: Gay Out Status: Out to everyone Location: Brazil Age: 19 Posts: 191 Join Date: Jul 2011	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? I think there are two ways to appreciate "art" (I'm using the word in a very broad sense here, meaning "work that is created with the objective of creating specific sensations on a group of observers"). The first one is very subjective. You enjoy it because you relate to it in some way. Maybe it's a song that deals with a significant experience you've had, or that refers to an important aspect of your cultural, social or emotional background. For example, I've really enjoyed watching Thor, mostly because it's a decent action film that's based on a comic about mythology, which I like very much. I've also loved Beautiful Thing, not because I think it's an exquisite piece of cinema, but because I thought it was really cute and it had much to do with something I'm going through right now. The second way to appreciate art is much less personal. You enjoy it because it's a pleasurable sensory experience, or because it's really cleaver and sophisticated. That kind of art tends to be academically regarded as "good", and researchers from from their respective fields (literature, music, cinema etc.) try to establish more or less objective, although arguable, parameters to measure its quality. That kind of art usually aims to be "universal". For example, although I'm not religious and haven't lived in Bach's time, I can (and do!) enjoy his Toccata and Fugue in D minor. There are obviously problems with that line of thought. I don't really think that "objectively good" art is really universal, to start with. An evidence of that is that different, equally qualified, academics have different "tastes", that is, tend to think that different works of art are good. On the other hand, I can't deny that there is a difference between the way I enjoy reading, say, Gabriel García Marques' 100 Years of Solitude and the way I've enjoyed reading Harry Potter. The biggest problem, however, is that sometimes people think that the only kind of art that's worth enjoying is the "objective" one. That means disregarding the possibility of taking pleasure from something because you relate to that, which is rather silly, in my opinion. They completely deny that a work of "art" can talk directly to them. I believe that that is caused by a social notion according to which people who like "objective" art tend to be more intelligent than people who like "subjective" art, which is also very stupid. Therefore, I'd say that a snob is someone who thinks that only one kind of art is worthy of being appreciated by people other than him or herself. I'm speaking as a layman here, out of my own, personal experience. I haven't actually studied the subject. Also, I'm not sure how that applies to food.

21st Jul 2011, 07:56 AM	#3
Steve712 EC Addict Full Member Gender: Male Orientation: Gay Out Status: Mostly out. Location: New Brunswick, Canada Age: 17 Posts: 1,294 Join Date: Feb 2010	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? __________________ "Yet if hope has flown away / In a night, or in a day, In a vision, or in none, / Is it therefore the less gone?" - Poe

21st Jul 2011, 08:30 AM	#4
bookworm43 Ketchup Addict Full Member Gender: Female Orientation: Lesbian Out Status: My Immediate Family, 4 friends, 1 stranger Location: NY Age: 15 Posts: 585 Join Date: Jun 2011	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? snobs honestly make me wanna punch them in the face- they're extremely irritating. __________________ "A question that sometimes drives me hazy: am I or the others crazy?" - Albert Einstein

21st Jul 2011, 08:50 AM	#5
Kerze Formerly Concretehands Full Member Gender: Male Orientation: Gay Out Status: two Location: London Town Age: 17 Posts: 1,297 Join Date: Aug 2010	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? My big thing is music (some of you may have noticed this ), and I hope one day to be a music critic for two reasons; 1. My two passions are writing and listening to music. I consume music and listen to a wide variety of bands/acts/styles/genres, which isn't to say I don't have personal favorites. 2. I think I am good at objectively listening to music and appreciating it for how complex it is, or the atmosphere that is created, or the techniques the artist has employed, or the originality of the ideas and sound, or the skill required to make it, among other things. I think using these things make something more valuable artistically than other music and this is what I judge things on when I listen to music. I can dislike an artist and I can think that something has no value in this way, but I also think there is a different value in music than people enjoy. If somebody likes it then fair enough, you go and enjoy it and I'm happy that you have something you like, even if I don't think it has artistic value. (That sounded very condescending and it is not intended to be, sorry about that...) I have a problem with people who go to videos on youtube to tell people what great taste in music they have an how much this particular song sucks. That's nice, well done for likeing music, leave these people in peace to like the music they like. People like that me off, because why would you do that, and why do you think these people want to hear what you think? I guess I can sum up what I'm trying to say like this; there is a difference between being critical and being a snob. I don't like snobs who flaunt what great taste in music they have, look down on people who like other types of music and, most of all, listen to something because it's cool or obscure instead of because they like it. I have more respect for people who listen to music I don't like because they like it than people who listen to bands that I do like for the wrong reasons. I don't think that was particularly clear, ask if I didn't say anything properly... __________________ Please Understand. We don't want no trouble, we just want the right to be different. That's all. - Pulp/Different Class

21st Jul 2011, 11:50 AM	#6
Markio EC Addict Full Member Gender: Male Orientation: Gay Out Status: Family, friends, and staff! Location: California Age: 21 Posts: 1,140 Join Date: Oct 2008	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? I just don't like 500 Days of Summer, and everyone else does. Oh how I wish someone would agree with me. __________________ Celebrate diversity!

21st Jul 2011, 01:35 PM	#10
Lexington The gay gargoyle EC Advisor Gender: Male Orientation: Gay Out Status: Out to everyone Location: Colorado Age: 42 Posts: 12,372 Join Date: Dec 2007	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? I can't be bothered to respond to this thread. Lex

21st Jul 2011, 01:42 PM	#11
Bibliophile EC Addict Full Member Gender: Male Orientation: Bisexual Out Status: My sisters and close friends. Location: Connecticut Age: 26 Posts: 357 Join Date: Feb 2011	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? I respect anyones right to like whatever they please and I will keep silent if I disagree with their taste for the most part. However when they try to put something I consider modern mass marketed drivel on the same level as timeless works of art I cant help but speak up. I mean just the other day I has to listen to someone on the bus try to call some teen vampire drama timeless.....really? You are going to put some mass marketed fad on the same level as a book such and The Hobbit or the works of Shakespeare? Yeah right. Or people that try to compare rappers like 50 cent to real artists like Dean Martin, Frank Sinatra, or the like. I am fine with people liking what they like but there is clearly good and bad art out there even if it does have its fans.

21st Jul 2011, 06:18 PM	#14
RedState The Grendel to Everyone's Beowulf Full Member Gender: Male Out Status: 2 Location: The Southeastern Conference Age: 30 Posts: 1,448 Join Date: Aug 2008	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? My primary residence is in a country club filled with white republicans that throw black tie cocktail parties till all hours of the night every weekend, so I don't know if I've ever seen a snob so I don't know what one is. But I think I would like them __________________

21st Jul 2011, 08:43 PM	#15
thedreamwatch Maximum Ridiculosity Full Member Gender: Female Orientation: Kinsey 5. So, pretty gay. Out Status: Out to everyone Location: Wisconsin Age: 22 Posts: 1,274 Join Date: Jan 2011	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? I guess there are some people who honestly think they're better than everyone else because they're more cultured or something... but sometimes I honestly wonder... what's the real difference between "being a snob" and having an opinion or enjoying really delving deep into something to find meaning or enjoyment? __________________ "I came out laughing, I came out screaming, I came out dancing..." - T&S

21st Jul 2011, 08:52 PM	#16
Emberstone Flappychap Full Member Gender: Male Orientation: Gay Out Status: Out to everyone Location: Oregon, USA Age: 28 Posts: 5,595 Join Date: May 2008	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? about the only group of people I will say - with scientific certainty - I am better than are 'Twihards', and their cultish leader, Stephanie (bella swann) Meyer. But we all are better by default. __________________ TYPE YOUR NAME: Cory. TYPE YOUR NAME WITH YOUR ELBOW: vcoiptryu SLAM YOUR FACE ON THE KEYBOARD: About three things I was absolutely positive. First, Edward was a vampire. Second, there was a part of him - and I didn't know how potent that part might be - that thirsted for my blood. And third, I was unconditionally and irrevocably in love with him.

21st Jul 2011, 10:21 PM	#17
Just Passing EC Addict Full Member Gender: Male Orientation: Gay Out Status: Almost there Location: West Midlands Age: 20 Posts: 513 Join Date: May 2011	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? I don't mind some sort of snobbery. Sometimes it just has to be done. Saying Justin Bieber is the greatest musician of all time over bands and individuals like the Beatles, Steely Dan, Michael Jackson, etc is just laughable, but there are some people who just generally thing that. Other times however, I hate it when I express a minority opinion, say like when I say a film is overrated (like Finding Nemo, I can't stand it), but then I get slated for it and told it's not overrated. Excuse me, but when something has been highly rated, had a successful box office along with reviews and everything else, chances are it's overrated. There's plenty of films and TV series I love, but I can admit they're overrated when told. Pure snobbery. I do love friendly debates though that doesn't literally insult the other person's opinion. I'm not even going to mention the time I admitted I used Internet Explorer on here and got pure slated for it and diminished into a certain group (aka the group that consists of little kids and elderly people supposedly, because they're crap, when I'm not crap on computers), because I used it. That pissed me off and I may have over reacted, but I was irritated as crap. __________________ Meh.

22nd Jul 2011, 01:44 AM	#18
heatqueen Official #1 fan of Celine Dion Full Member Gender: Female Orientation: Pansexual/Homoromantic bisexual Out Status: Generally whoever asks Location: I travel a lot Age: 20 Posts: 5,707 Join Date: Jan 2008	Re: Your opinons on snobbery? Just let people enjoy whatever music/art/etc that they're into. If you don't like it, don't listen to it, but don't put down other people because they do like it. sigh when is the world going to learn to let people just be without judgement?! __________________ Don't drink and drive. You might hit a bump and spill your drink. Co-founder of the 'Sailor Moon Made Me Gay' club...and the lesbians.