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Old 12th May 2012, 09:28 PM   #1
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Default Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

I'm Jewish, but think the case for reincarnation is solid in terms of empirical evidence. Also, it doesn't contradict with my beliefs at all since the Kabbalists of the middle ages held to a similar belief.
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Old 12th May 2012, 09:33 PM   #2
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmurf View Post
I'm Jewish, but think the case for reincarnation is solid in terms of empirical evidence. Also, it doesn't contradict with my beliefs at all since the Kabbalists of the middle ages held to a similar belief.
Ok, i'll bite.

What empirical evidence?
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Old 12th May 2012, 09:39 PM   #3
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

I have not seen reincarnation. I have not heard a credible or verifiable account of reincarnation. If one comes up, I will surely believe in reincarnation.
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Old 12th May 2012, 09:42 PM   #4
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

i believe in reincarnation, thats deriving from the belief that everyone has a soul and that the soul is eternal therefore coming back to relive many life experiences from different perspectives,

what i dont believe is that you come back as an animal or insect lol
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Old 12th May 2012, 09:42 PM   #5
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pseudojim View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmurf View Post
I'm Jewish, but think the case for reincarnation is solid in terms of empirical evidence. Also, it doesn't contradict with my beliefs at all since the Kabbalists of the middle ages held to a similar belief.
Ok, i'll bite.

What empirical evidence?


+ YouTube Video
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+ YouTube Video
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---------- Post added 12th May 2012 at 09:43 PM ----------

just a few examples.. some of them are too stacked up against the odds to be explained by psychology and false memory syndrome.

---------- Post added 12th May 2012 at 09:45 PM ----------

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what i dont believe is that you come back as an animal or insect lol



All living things have a soul, even microbes.


So yes, I think that apes and dolphins on occasion probably reincarnate as humans..


Stranger yet, a few people who underwent past life regression therapy recalled lives as aliens on other planets in the universe. The life goals, perception and sensory adaptations of these aliens were so markedly different that the reincarnated people had major adjustment issues in this life.
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Old 12th May 2012, 09:56 PM   #6
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

None of that is evidence, it's unverifiable, the antiques roadshow guy even says so in the opening seconds of the first video.

There's also no evidence for the concept of an intangible soul, and given its conceptual intangibility in most definitions, there probably never will be.

This is too airy-fairy and fanciful for me to lend any credence to. It is wishful thinking on the part of day dreamers to me. It's magic and sorcery, and this is the 21st century.

Last edited by Pseudojim; 12th May 2012 at 10:00 PM.. Reason: typo
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Old 12th May 2012, 09:57 PM   #7
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

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None of that is evidence, it's unverifiable, the antiques roadshow guy even says so in the opening seconds of the first video.

There's also no evidence for the concept of an intangible soul, and given its conceptual intangibility in most definitions, there probably never will be.

This is to airy-fairy and fanciful for me to lend any credence to. It is wishful thinking on the part of day dreamers to me. It's magic and sorcery.



You're welcome to your opinion.
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Old 12th May 2012, 09:59 PM   #8
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

the spooky music gives that away as what it really is, in my opinion: flights of fancy elaborately put together to impress and entertain those who want to believe in such things, and will at the opportunity the video gives them.

sorry this was supposed to be an addon to the previous post, you replied before i could get it in
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Old 12th May 2012, 10:00 PM   #9
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

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---------- Post added 12th May 2012 at 10:00 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pseudojim View Post
the spooky music gives that away as what it really is, in my opinion: flights of fancy elaborately put together to impress and entertain those who want to believe in such things, and will at the opportunity the video gives them.

Did you gloss over the Crimean video?
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Old 12th May 2012, 10:02 PM   #10
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

Oh and also:

Quote:
Empirical

Pertaining to, derived from, or testable by observations made using the physical senses or using instruments which extend the senses
By definition, there is no empirical evidence.

Pseudoscience
Any body of knowledge purported to be scientific or supported by science but which fails to comply with the scientific method.
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Old 12th May 2012, 10:02 PM   #11
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

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Old 12th May 2012, 10:07 PM   #12
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmurf View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pseudojim View Post
the spooky music gives that away as what it really is, in my opinion: flights of fancy elaborately put together to impress and entertain those who want to believe in such things, and will at the opportunity the video gives them.

Did you gloss over the Crimean video?
that's the spooky-music video i'm talking about
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Old 12th May 2012, 10:15 PM   #13
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmurf View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguine View Post
what i dont believe is that you come back as an animal or insect lol

All living things have a soul, even microbes.


So yes, I think that apes and dolphins on occasion probably reincarnate as humans..
that may be true but i seriously doubt you go back an evolution in terms of consciousness


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Stranger yet, a few people who underwent past life regression therapy recalled lives as aliens on other planets in the universe. The life goals, perception and sensory adaptations of these aliens were so markedly different that the reincarnated people had major adjustment issues in this life.
i believe this too
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Old 12th May 2012, 10:51 PM   #14
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

Seems like a bit of a logical leap to go from saying "you remember some things that may or may not be similar to something that someone that we have some slight knowledge of may have experienced" to "you are actually that person born again."
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Old 12th May 2012, 11:08 PM   #15
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

There's a difference between being a skeptic and being closed-minded.

Ian Stephenson's work studying reincarnation at University of Virginia has spanned some 30 years, and he's had dozens of grad students working with him. He's extremely conservative in how he evaluates and considers reincarnation, and he meticulously documents all of the cases he looks at, seeking alternative explanations other than reincarnation that could justify the findings he's come across.

He's written a number of articles in the scientific literature, and published several scholarly books on the topic, along with, I think, a mass-market book as well.

Here's University of Virginia's page on his department:

The Division of Perceptual Studies — School of Medicine at the University of Virginia

If you actually spend the time to look over Stephenson's work with an open-but-skeptical mind (as opposed to a mind determined to believe it isn't possible), he definitely points out some things that are very difficult to explain in conventional terms.

Stephenson, himself, last I read his writings, was pretty cautious in how he framed his work; he doesn't (or didn't at the time) definitively state that reincarnation was what he was finding evidence of, but he was saying, in essence, "I'm ruling out other possibilities, and what I'm left with, in a number of these cases, is little else but the idea that this person lived before, in this place, and remembered specific details or information that he had no other way of knowing about."

I personally do believe that reincarnation is part of life. And of course, it's one of those things that's difficult to say without a doubt is or is not. But Stephenson's evidence, and the somewhat less rigorous but nonetheless intriguing evidence offered up by a few other researchers, including Brian Weiss MD and his work with past life regression, certainly paints a picture that there's more out there than what we think we know as absolutes.
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Old 12th May 2012, 11:10 PM   #16
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

@ Chip, good stuff.

And reincarnation doesn't necessarily even have to imply a "soul" in the conventional "spooky" sense. It could be something that will someday be explained by quantum science.
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Old 13th May 2012, 12:18 AM   #17
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chip View Post
There's a difference between being a skeptic and being closed-minded.

Ian Stephenson's work studying reincarnation at University of Virginia has spanned some 30 years, and he's had dozens of grad students working with him. He's extremely conservative in how he evaluates and considers reincarnation, and he meticulously documents all of the cases he looks at, seeking alternative explanations other than reincarnation that could justify the findings he's come across.

He's written a number of articles in the scientific literature, and published several scholarly books on the topic, along with, I think, a mass-market book as well.

Here's University of Virginia's page on his department:

The Division of Perceptual Studies — School of Medicine at the University of Virginia

If you actually spend the time to look over Stephenson's work with an open-but-skeptical mind (as opposed to a mind determined to believe it isn't possible), he definitely points out some things that are very difficult to explain in conventional terms.

Stephenson, himself, last I read his writings, was pretty cautious in how he framed his work; he doesn't (or didn't at the time) definitively state that reincarnation was what he was finding evidence of, but he was saying, in essence, "I'm ruling out other possibilities, and what I'm left with, in a number of these cases, is little else but the idea that this person lived before, in this place, and remembered specific details or information that he had no other way of knowing about."

I personally do believe that reincarnation is part of life. And of course, it's one of those things that's difficult to say without a doubt is or is not. But Stephenson's evidence, and the somewhat less rigorous but nonetheless intriguing evidence offered up by a few other researchers, including Brian Weiss MD and his work with past life regression, certainly paints a picture that there's more out there than what we think we know as absolutes.
And there is a difference between close-mindedness and judicious use of occam's razor. Having posted for a long time on a forum with a room partially dedicated to debating pseudoscience (amongst other things), stephenson's work, while thorough, provided no evidence (in the scientific sense) to back up any claims of reincarnation. Making the leap to belief in it is an act of faith, not reason.
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Old 13th May 2012, 02:07 AM   #18
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

OK. I think this is a place where we have to agree to disagree. The OP's original request was whether there were people who share his beliefs, not whether there were people interested in shooting them down
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Old 13th May 2012, 02:30 AM   #19
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

I'd like reincarnation to be real, but I'm a little bit of a skeptic these days. I used to believe in a lot of things that I no longer do.
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Old 13th May 2012, 05:53 AM   #20
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Default Re: Does anyone here share my belief in reincarnation?

I believe in reincarnation. There are many examples of it all over the world. There are souls among us that has lived many lives. Some of them can even tap into their previous lives in the right circumstances.
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