Goodbye everybody

For starters, I'm going to reply anyway, even though you said not to. I believe in putting thoughts out there for the subject to see (whether they check them out or not), even if only for my own sanity.

Anyone who does that to a person should be hit by a bus.

And I also liked the Jeffrey Dahmer and Aileen Wuronos reference. Although I thought he was bisexual, but that's irrelevant.

Now, down to business:

I'm sorry you feel this way. If leaving is something you feel is best for you, then I won't try to stop you. Allies are an important part of our community, both here and in the "real world". Sometimes we as a collective forget who we are talking to and don't bear in mind that they are on our side, so to speak. And you deserve kudos either way, because you're going to continue to support what you feel in your heart is true and just in the world with regard to LGBT causes. So thank you for that.

I hope you'll reconsider. In the event that you do choose to not return, I would like to take this opportunity to wish you all the best in your future endeavors.

 

I'll be honest, I've looked through your post history and haven't found much of what you're talking about. There's the instance with the library, I don't agree with how it was demonized but still. And your post about the cis privilege thing which I understand you taking offense towards, but everyone gets categorized one way or another and you kind of have to accept that.

Being an ally is great, but that doesn't mean you deserve any more praise than anyone else. You're not doing us a favor by getting into arguments or trying to make people feel guilty by how much they've 'wronged' you. If you want to talk about privilege and entitlement this is what we mean. You're an ally, what do you expect when you came rushing to help us? Praise and acknowledgement? We aren't a charity, and I don't take solace in being used to clear your conscience for the day.

 

Yeah... Gays are cray.

I wish you all the best, and thank you for being an ally. If it's what feels right in your heart, don't let anyone tell you otherwise. <3

 

See, its replies like this that probably got her so upset that she had to leave this forum. While we may not be a charity there are lots of people who hate us for simply being who we are and to have straight supporters of the lgbt community is a blessing.

Thank you AllyCat for being so caring and compassionate. I wish you all the best.

 

+1, and please remember not all of us are jerks. You're welcome here anytime you'd like to stop by.

 

Yeah, there are people that hate us. And the people that like us are great and all, but being pro-lgbt doesn't make you special, it just makes you not a dick. Sorry if that's offensive but I'm not going to hand everyone that says they're an ally a giant gold star and congratulate them for being decent human beings.

 

^ I'm going to have to agree with fugs, but I am sad to see you go.

Just for the record, we do happen to have 2 members on Staff who are both straight, very supportive, and no one one here seems to have a problem with them. If you want to get in contact with them and see if you can figure this situation out then I think that might be a huge help.

Best wishes!

 

I disagree. There is a difference between people who don't mind/care about lgbt and let us get on with our lives, and there are people like AllyCat who actually give a damn about us by going out of their way to change the perception of others. If you can't recognise this as something special then its worrying. Your apathy towards pro-lgbt persons is worse than those by what you call "to clear their conscience for the day".

 

Why do pro-lgbt people deserve my apathy? Do you think better of a person for not thinking twice about a black guy walking down the street? What's to be apathetic about a straight person working towards our cause? What are they giving up, should I feel bad for them having to associate themselves with us, or them having to think of us as human beings?

Don't get me wrong, I have straight friends and cis friends, and I hold nothing against them. I love and respect them so much. I just don't think there should be a special reward for people treating us like human beings.

 

I have absolutely no opinions or feelings towards this except sadness. It really does suck to see another ally go, for whatever reason. They're just as important, especially now when we're becoming more progressive and can't lose steam. I'm sorry you feel that way, but thank you for the support.

 

Sure there should be! They can have this cookie:

 

I had hoped it wouldn't come to this, especially since I had given you support over your wall. Allies are great, and as I indicated, I believe you write in good faith, and I agree with what of your views I have read so far, though admittedly, I am am particular about the threads I respond to. (Most people here will be pleased to find that I just don't participate in threads about religion, for example, because I just don't have productive things to say except for the perfunctory acknowledgment that many religious people are nice and not heterosexist.)

However, allies are not always right. (Although for the record, I did completely agree on having the book removed.) I mean, I identify as a feminist, but I'm still a cismale, which gives me privilege. So sometimes I just don't understand certain things, which might cause me to say controversial things that offend women (transwomen very much included). And sometimes I feel like I get torn down. But I learn from it and keep going.

I want to say on the other side though that a lot of people in oppressed groups have different views, and just because you get torn down by one person doesn't mean that you're in the wrong. An example I like to think of is the debate in communities of color about how white activists should behave. There is a lot of acknowledgment that we (white activists) do and say things which are problematic. However, those debates don't often take into account the assumption of good faith, and sometimes people flat out have terrible ideas of things to be offended about. (For starters, the people who think that affirmative action is racist are part of the problem.)

Similarly, just because you get criticized by some queers doesn't mean they are right. It's just a journey that you have to undertake. You have to figure out whose criticisms to take seriously, and whose to think are full of crap. If you'd like an example of what I am talking about, Tim Wise is a master of this.

Please don't give up. If you stop posting here, at least please just talk to me over the wall for a while so that you feel comfortable again.

I'd ask for your contact information, but I have the feeling that I'll be denied despite my good faith.

 

The fact is, gay people are exactly that... gay PEOPLE. People come in all varieties and unfortunately you have run into some bad ones, but it has nothing to do with the LGBT community. The fact that this happened to you both with something as simple as cats and LGBT rights illustrates my point exactly. Some people will be hateful or rude regardless of race, age, gender, sexuality, or any other factor. They may frame it in the context of sexuality, but that is (to go scientific) their left hemisphere ascribng logic to an emotional and subconcious action. They may say it's about "cis gendered privelage", but that's just their attempt to make their emotions make sense.

I guess what I'm trying to say in a roundabout way is don't think all gay people are like that, just like I know not all straight people hate gays (and some are actually supportive like you, which is great btw). So I'm sorry this was your experience, but frankly it could have happened if you tried to join a book club or take up a sport or any other new social situation.

 

I'm going to give it to you bluntly, because I'm not one for sugar-coating. I won't say I'm sad to see you go, give you congratulations for merely being a decent human being as Fugs said, or try to make you feel better by telling you "gays are crey."

I don't buy that you're facing so much adversity due to being straight. I think you're just attributing it to your heterosexuality, because you can't think of any other reason that it's happening. (I also think you have a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy thing going on. You see yourself as an outsider, so you act like one, which might make people uncomfortable around you.) Guess what? The truth is, the queer community isn't one big happy family. We all have different values, and even though many of our goals are similar, that's not always the case. There are queer people for or against gay marriage and adoption, those who agree or disagree with DADT, etc. I have replied to your thread on the library book, a post in which I respectfully disagreed with your actions, as did many others. I saw no one personally insult you, nor imply that they thought you were wrong because you weren't queer. If you were trans, a lesbian, a gay man, bisexual, whatever, I'm sure many of those people, including myself, would have replied in the exact same way. Look at some posts here, queer people have definitely gotten into some pretty heated arguments with each other. Are there people out there who will treat you negatively for being an ally? Of course, but from what I have seen, that has not taken place on this forum.

You say you want people to stop calling you ignorant. You are ignorant, but only because everyone is. It isn't a synonym for stupid --- it just means you haven't learned something yet, and anyone worth your time will educate you about the topic. If they won't, don't listen to them. Alternatively, do your own research; it shows you care.

As far as priviledge goes, everyone has it in some capacity. There are a certain sub-set of people who take it way too seriously, such as the "die cis scum" people. Ignore them. However, realise that some groups are not aimed at cisgender straight people, and it's their space. Become familiar with the rules. If you're not supposed to talk, sit back and observe.

Finally, if you really want to be any kind of activist, queer or not, you need to grow thicker skin. It's not a job for the oversensitive.

 

I'm not sure what hardships you would have endured as heterosexual and cisgender on this site, but I am sad to see you go like this. I hope you will read this thread and reconsider.

 

Best cookie ever.

 

Everyone's touched on a lot of good things. I think the most important thing to take out of this is that yeah, LGBT people, like all other people, disagree. Just because we belong to a group doesn't mean we default to sharing the same values.

I won't rehash what everyone else has said. Though, I do hope you reconsider your choice to leave. It's much easier for us to focus on one or two counts of adversity over all of the other counts of support and agreement. In all honesty, I don't think there was a lot of intentional aggression towards you after reading some of the posts. That's also not to belittle your feelings, but rather hopefully identify that I think there was an issue in communication.

 

I don't care if you read this or not. I have something to say.

You aren't too sensitive for this world. You're just having a little bit of an existential crisis. There be haters everywhere. Ehv. Ree. Where. And they will paw at you whether you are in or out of your chrysalis. Laugh it off and cowgirl up.

Don't let the semantics police push you around. Most LGBTQ terms have three or four different interpretations and those that don't are being "reinvented" or "clarified" by some group or another. It's not about the words. It never has been. And people who use those words as a weapon against you can choke on them; regardless of sexual preference.

That having been said, if you'd like to go back into hiding, by all means do it. But don't blame your retreat on someone else. You chose to be an ally. You chose that burden. You can't take on that burden and then complain that everyone is making it too hard to carry.

I hope you do come back at some point. You have a great writing style and a sharp wit. You're articulate and passionate. I would count it as a loss to never come across that again.

 

There are plenty of people who don't meet the minimum standards of being a decent human, so if someone really wants a cookie for not being among them, I don't begrudge them one. But even better if they consider virtue to be its own reward.