Paragraph 175

[suburbs_of_sodom]

So this semester I'm taking a class on Nazi Germany, and today we watched a movie on Paragraph 175 (the law criminalizing homosexual acts in Germany instituted 1871) and Gay people in the Holocaust. While the entire movie was fascinating, one bit that I found particularly interesting was the unexpectedness of it all. During the 1920s, prior to the Nazi's rise to power, Berlin was a world-famous gay mecca where no one really followed Paragraph 175 and gays lived in freedom similar to that of gay people in the U.S. during the late 20th century. Even when Hitler did gain power, homosexuals didn't expect anything bad to happen because one of his leading officials, Ernst Rohm, was a known Homosexual. When the Communists tried to use this against the Nazis, Hitler even made a statement essentially saying that what his officers chose to do in their private life was not for him to judge unless it fell in direct opposition to National Socialist policy. It was only when Rohm became too ambitious and tried to expand the SA at the expense of the army in 1938 did Hitler order his execution and turn against gay people, sending about 100,000 gay men to concentration camps over the next 7 years.

So I just found this particularly intriguing and for me, it sort of serves as a reminder that all our rights can so easily be taken away if we're not careful. Just the fact that no one expected anything like this to happen is especially frightening in that it seems like we have so little control over our future. So I was just wondering if y'all had any thoughts on this fascinating bit of history.

[Brett]

I did hear that gays were also sent to concentration camps, but I thought Hitler always hated them.

[divadarya]

Originally Posted by Brett

I did hear that gays were also sent to concentration camps, but I thought Hitler always hated them.

That's where the Pink Triangle came from..it was the gay equivalent of a Jewish Star.

[Levi]

I set my orientation to 175er a while back because of that. Didn't know the details though, twas interesting

[Brett]

Originally Posted by divadarya

That's where the Pink Triangle came from..it was the gay equivalent of a Jewish Star.

Oh! I always did wonder about that! They need like a whole history class about this kinda stuff!

[Alexander]

The leaders of the concentration camps labeled everyone with triangles and other shapes:
* yellow for Jews,
* red for politicals,
* green for criminals,
* pink for homosexuals,
* black for anti-socials (and prostitutes),
* purple for Jehovah's Witnesses,
* blue for immigrants,
* brown for gypsies.

whatever that means. it's all from here.

[beckyg]

Originally Posted by Brett

Oh! I always did wonder about that! They need like a whole history class about this kinda stuff!

I didn't know where the Pink Triangle came from! Maybe someday there will be a gay history month and children can learn this in school!

[iPieman]

I always thought it was Pink for lesbians and black for gays.
I was taught wrong, evidently!

Originally Posted by beckyg

I didn't know where the Pink Triangle came from! Maybe someday there will be a gay history month and children can learn this in school!

All In good time Becky *puts on to-do list ^_^*

Since im very interested in Nazi Germany and Adolf Hitler (chatroom peeps should know ) I've done a lot of looking up about this sort of stuff. So interesting!

[Psychedelic Bookmarks]

Apparently lesbians used to get black triangles too. They were just lumped together with prostitutes and other female sexual "devients".

[suburbs_of_sodom]

There were actually only 5 known cases of Lesbians being sent to camps. The Nazis viewed homosexuality in women as curable, so once they were "cured," they could fulfill their chief duty as mothers of the new Aryan race. It's kind of funny, that contradiction, how women could be cured but men couldn't. Someone should write a book on the double standard Nazi Germany (as well as societies worldwide) had for homosexuality in men and women.

Paragraph 175 didn't just exist in the Nazi era it was merely expanded and revised to suit their ideaology. In fact it had existed since the first German constitution of 1871 (Imperial Germany 1871-1918).

While the Nazi persecution of homosexuals is reasonably well-known today, far less attention had been given to the continuation of this persecution in post-war Germany. In 1945, when concentration camps were liberated, homosexual prisoners were not freed but were instead made to serve out their sentence under Paragraph 175.

In 1950, East Germany abolished Nazi amendments to Paragraph 175, whereas West Germany kept them and even had them confirmed by its Constitutional Court. About 100,000 men were implicated in legal proceedings from 1945 to 1969, and about 50,000 were convicted.

In 1969, the government eased Paragraph 175 to an age of consent of 21. It was lowered to 18 in 1973.

It was only after much debate and protest that it was abolished on the 10th March 1994 by the reunified German parliament.

[suburbs_of_sodom]

I had no idea that things were that bad for gay people in post-war Germany. One would think that the Allied nations had learned their lesson about tolerance upon seeing the camps, but apparently not. Still, in a way it's almost better for America in that such laws outlawing homosexuality were abolished in 2003, and still many states haven't yet bothered to update their constitutions. Granted, we never held gay people in Nazi-designed concentration camps, but the comparison is still rather interesting.

It's also interesting to see how communist-controlled East Germany was more liberal than democratic West Germany on this issue and I wonder why that was.