Opening a can of worm with this. Genders.

Do you need proof of language?

Gender IS a social construct. But so is language, and actually, labelling sexes is a social construct too. But that doesn't make it any less real.

Simply the fact that there are people who don't identify with their assigned gender is proof that it's real.

 

please dont start a fight , i already saw another thread with this crap

 

@Eatthechildren: You're confusing gender with gender roles. It's a common mistake.

As for the topic, Reptillian, I exist. The existence of transsexuals alone proves that gender is a real thing. If you say we're not real, then yes, you should be prepared for a lot of angry trans people posting in this thread.

Here's the thing: you're cis. That automatically means you will never know what it's like to be trans. You have to take our word for it that gender is a real thing. If that isn't enough for you, you will have to wait for the science to catch up. Science is revolutionary, but it often works on the scale of decades. Those of us who are trans already have all the evidence we need, but I understand that it can be difficult to understand for cis people.

It's like being a sexual orientation other than straight. Prove to me that it exists. Can you prove that it exists with only purely scientific terms? The science behind sexuality is still iffy too.

 

No, I mean gender. Gender (At least to me) is a complicated sense of identity, that originated in assigning in assigning roles to different sexes, but has become something more
(Or at least that's my understanding of it)

Like... Sexual orientation always seemed like a social construct to me too... Doesn't make it any less real, but that's what I think

 

You're right: that wouldn't make you female. They actually did tests like that. They injected male volunteers with estrogen to see what would happen. The results were that they developed gender dysphoria. They started to feel self-conscious about any feminine traits they were developing--even if it was in their head. Since gender dysphoria occurs from the brain rejecting hormones. It's one of the few ways a cis person can understand temporarily what it's like to be trans.

 

Well if genders don't exist, I'd like to know why I've always felt like a male. I never understood how females work. I look at them get all excited over dresses, make-up, shoes, nails etc, and I can't say I've ever gotten that excited over things like that. Also, them actually wanting to be a mother...I don't understand that. I never want to go through pregnancy. I don't want to give birth to a child of my own...and I actually feel bad about that at times.
So I believe genders do exist, male brains and female brains are definitely wired differently. Unfortunately for cisgendered people they take their gender for granted most of the time because they can't feel what we trans* people go through everyday; and it's really hard to explain.
Sure we can say..oh we feel like a trapped man/woman in a woman's/man's body. But if you ask cisgendered folk to picture it...at least the ones I've explained it to, they just don't get it.

 

I'm not saying that what we use to assign sex isn't real... But like, going "This child has ____ and ____ so they are physically male" IS a social construct.

Like, what would you call someone with XXY chromosones (Yes it's a thing), with ambiguous genitalia?
(Our society at least) wouldn't be able to assign a sex correctly (To it's own rules) because people assign sex with two boxes, "XX chromosones - Vagina - Oestrogen - Female" and "XY chromosones - penis - Testosterone" and don't leave room for anything else.

Sorry if that didn't make any sense, I'm bad at putting ideas into words

 

l feel like a box of cereal myself and l pretty much have the same approach to gender identity.

But. Here's the thing, as a gay person, l obviously have a gender preference. l can't say that they don't really exist.

lt could ultimately be some kind of conditioning on my part and l've tried endlessly to figure out if that's the case. lf that is the case, l'm probably beyond repair.

l don't believe in assigning personality traits to gender and can have the same kind f emotional connection to anyone regardless of gender.

But...since one gender is "right" for me as far as attraction goes, l must either be subconsciously labeling my attractions based on gender or there is some small difference that attracts me, even if it's only in apperance

 

I don't even know, honestly. It's something my gender therapist told me once. It's his job to research this stuff. If you're asking everyone who posts in this thread to post in-depth scientific essays, you probably won't get many who do that. Not many people enjoy making persuasive essays for fun.

---------- Post added 2nd Feb 2013 at 05:21 PM ----------

You should get into contact with some gender therapists and ask them these questions. It's their job to know this stuff and defend it within their psychoanalytical groups of peers. Asking the odd queer person about this won't get you very far.

 

Also, you might consider not just calling up some random gender therapists and grilling them. Ask to make an appointment to ask questions to cure your curiosity. Just a suggestion.

 

I don't understand why people make threads like these. If you can't get the answers yourself on a tricky topic like this, I doubt there will be many people that can give you the answers you need. It almost seems as if you want people to give their opinions just to start a war haha. These threads never have a good outcomes

 

right?

 

You can claim it all you want but at the very least you need to respect other people's identified genders. Just like you don't bash someone with a different religious view than you it's not right to argue about someone's identity. It's their choice and really isn't up to you.

 

I couldn't agree more, and seeing as flaming is against the Code of Conduct, there's really no reason to let this thread go on any farther.