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Gay Muslims?

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by Rogue, Mar 11, 2013.

  1. Rogue

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    I couldn't help it, I had to go do some revision for my self and I found this


    Best Answer - Chosen by Asker

    There is not a known origen of homosexuality.. Who can say by sure it's not heir fault? In Islam I only have found that having sex between males is not only haram, but was also the cause of destruction ( of 2 cities, also known in the Bible) Truth is that there are many men who are afraid of bring gays but they do not know, so there is always a "smart" gay who get close to them to convince them : "yes u r gay, but it's ok"
    For men it's haram in Islam to have sex other than with own wife, so how not to be haram having sex with a man who cannot be your "wife", since marriage is for 1 men and 1 women, considering in Islam men can have up to 4 wives withing the limits Allah/God have set.
    In the Quran it's said that Allah/God created women to men to marry and have sex with, .

    A person with mental disorders should get married? Would you allow your son or daughterr to marry someone with any mental sickness? And if at the beginning that sickness was hidden, then what? have to get treatment of course.

    Homosexuals are called in the Quran degenerated, evil doers, transgressors...In short it's haram for men to have sex other than with his wife ( a real woman)
    If one can be believer, that one should be sure that Allah/God created us as He say in the Quran and then our mind, environment + weak personality cause us to believe we are other way that the one Allah/God created us.
    And if the affected really thinks Allah/God is the guilty one( beside he is saying a lie against Allah /God, what is also reprobable and haram for muslims) he must make his best to go against his instinct and do things as Allah/God say things have to be done.

    All in this life is a test and we have to strive to succeed, this life is too short thinking of the eternal last one, hell for ever ?? no thanks




    I'm a Muslim and this is kind of making me struggle big time,
    I'm not a big religious follower like pray ever day 5 times a day but i do believe in god.

    So..... yea..... (I don't wanna burn in eternaty....)

    I'm on the verge of Decision. But i Sure as hell dont wanna see hell forever x.x;;

    It cant be one for me..... and i cant be perfect.... and this is really losing
    (Me) <---- Complaining like a B!atch!!! X.X'
    I don't like hell
    This whole thing is scaring me.
    I believe in God!
    Oh crap... (whats happening to me?) *Faints*
     
    #1 Rogue, Mar 11, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2013
  2. I've always wanted to know, how gay Muslims reconcile their faith with their sexuality.


    See the Christian Bible and Muslim Quran are both said to condemn homosexuality

    But in terms of Christianity, we could always bring up that the Bible was written by men. However, the Quran according to Muslims is direct revelation from God to Muhammad. So how do gay Muslims reconcile that?
     
  3. Dublin Boy

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  4. random nobody

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    The only sin you could ever commit is if you go against your own conscience.


    I don't really like Muslims. A lot of Muslims support the killing of gay people and a number of them do it for sport. They torture them by castrating them, putting glue in their anus and then shooting them in the head after more ordeals. I got this off an article I read where they interviewed the extremist leader of one group. They targeted their victims through dating sites.

    It's a good thing you live in London and not in the Middle East countries.
     
  5. Dublin Boy

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    There are a lot of good Muslims in the world though, the ones you talk about are in a minority, all the Muslims I know are kind hard working people who abide by the Law & believe in peace :slight_smile:
     
  6. BudderMC

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    I'm pretty sure if you rounded up all the white people or all the Christian people who committed hate crimes against LGBT you'd also have "a lot". This is a little thing called "illusory correlation", and might be worth reading up on if you're interested.

    Just some food for thought.
     
  7. hello1992

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    My answer to your post:

    Islam sees homosexual behaviour as a form of adultery. This could be interpreted as saying that gay marriage will make gay activities okay in the eye of islam. Thats not what it is saying. For one thing, like many religions, marriage is seen as something only between a man and a women. Secondly homosexuality is seen as a mistake as you arent doing nay harm to others.

    In my research, i have never come across homosexuals being called 'evil doers'. The onyl references that i know of in the quaran to sexuality talks about how it is OKAY to be gay as god created your mind, but it is not okay, and is seen as a mistake to do gay things as we have freedom of our own choices. Its meant to be sort of like a test. The quaran also talks about suitable punishments for gays, but dont really require the killing or discrimination of gays (unless you look at the hadith). One punishment involves locking gays in a house until they repent if a certain number of witnesses come forward.


    in short, islam isnt what you want if you are looking for a religion accepting of homosexual activity. That being said, it never condones any sort of marginalization or discrimination (except for the punishments). Try looking at the torah, apparently there is soem sort of mention about it okay to have activities with the same gender as long as you are actually gay and not just experimenting.

    My reconciliation:

    there is none. I never really practiced and i dont consider myself a muslim, but i am more of one than of not. Like you, i am worried about the possible very long term (i.e. life after death) consequences. But i just cant help but try and rationalise it and say to myself that i have been, and am, a very good person.

    But these issue has made very depressed at times, i don't want to be alone in life, no one does. I can't help but thinking if i am like this now, imagine what i'd be like 5 years from now!

    I still respect a number of islam's teachings, but i have in limbo when it comes to gay. I am still deciding. Coming out to my parents and home friends will be hard because many of them are muslim and i doubt they would react well...This has been plaguing my mind for the past 3 years now.

    I think at the end of it all, i will come out. Just don't know when or how. Probably when i have a place of my own and maybe even someone to come out for. A part of me just wishes something would happen that would make my parents suddenly find out and approach me about it. That way if they begin lecturing me about it i can always say that i didnt tell them because i was deciding myself, rather than telling them after i have found a guy. I will never bring myself to marry a women though, too much guilt, so its gonna be crunch point when the topic gets onto marriage.

    So sad, so sad. Something will give, just don't know when....

    p.s. this probably did not put your mind at ease. But my only advice is that you must keep in mind that the choice is entirely yours. And you should also be careful with what you read. If you are going to read content in the quaran, make sure that the authors actually cite the references so it doesnt seem like they are just pulling stuff out of their head.

    feel free to message me if you want to talk about it x

    ---------- Post added 11th Mar 2013 at 11:12 PM ----------

    Not gonna lie, you need to be careful about what you say in a forum which is meant to promote acceptance and anti hatred.

    You are getting confused with causation and correlation. Yes many muslim countries are associated with such atrocities. But its all well and goo you saying this from an onlooker form the Western world at this time. During the medieval ages when the muslim-christina conflict was at its height, you could argue that from a muslim perspective then, christians were seen as brutal. Witch burnings and slavery of an entire race seem far more severe than the stoning of raped women. And lets not forget the Christian purges of both muslim and jews. Its all about context. By your logic you should also hate black people because African history recently has been associated with genocides, corruption and dictatorships.

    Your articles suffer from selection bias as well. Of course the articles you will read about these sort of things will have the most explicit of reports, and you can do that with any topic! I am sure there are plenty of juicy articles relating to western atrocities?
     
  8. random nobody

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    ._.

    I'm really sorry. I just kind of always sound like a dork every time I say something. A large number of the people who bully me at school are Arabic and come from Muslim families and I might have become prejudicial, so that might be a reason. The impression I get is that Muslims hate gays because the Quran tells them they will burn in eternal hellfire.

    The Bible is the same but I always saw Muslims as being extremists from what I read in papers and that all gay muslim men keep their sexuality to themselves.

    I'm an Atheist, so I can sound offhand on religion. I really didn't want to offend anyone. Sincere apologies if I did :frowning2: I joined an hour ago and I already feel like a douche.
     
  9. hello1992

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    haha, dw about it. I think my whole 'reconciliation' has made me prejudice against my own kind anyway. I just dont want to be judged.

    i wasnt offended even the slightest, was just trying to reason with you :wink:
     
  10. Dublin Boy

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    Don't worry about it, it's only what most young people read in the newspapers, some can be pretty bias & like to stir up prejudices, especially the Sun Newspaper in the UK, people do follow their religion closely, but don't always take every thing literally, after all these religions are thousands of years old & what was relevant then, is not always relevant now :slight_smile:
     
  11. Rogue

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    British Muslim born and raised =/
    and Those people torturing other such as the above you said, They will be punished more then you could possibly imagine Thats fkn cruel for real.
    I'm not to be compared with any other kind, everyone is different in their own ways.

    ---------- Post added 12th Mar 2013 at 12:00 AM ----------

    dont worry about I'll let you know if you hurt my feelings lol ♥♥♥
     
  12. AKTodd

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    In my experience religion (pick a religion, any religion) is usually just a vehicle for people to do what they want to do anyway, but now they get to do it with 'divine permission'.

    So if some people want to commit violence or say horrible, awful things about other people, they will find a way to get their religion to justify it. It doesn't matter if the religion says one thing about punishing some group or people or some particular act and 10,000 things about loving everyone and being peaceful, there are some people who will find and fixate on that one thing and try to make the whole religion about that. Because really doing that one thing is what they want to do anyway.

    At this particular point in history, both Islam and Christianity (probably other religions too, but these are the two we hear about most atm) are trying to cope with a world that is changing at a tremendous pace as well as a whole host of factors such as economic development, feelings of fear toward other cultures and peoples on the planet, and likely much else. Some people within these religions turn to hate and violence as a way of trying to cope. And barring <insert name of divine being of your choice here> showing up and flat out denouncing them they aren't likely to stop any time soon, unfortunately. However, the vast majority of Muslims are just regular folks who want to be left alone to go about their business in peace.

    As I understand it there are a fair number of gay Muslims on this forum. There are also a few gay friendly mosques scattered around the planet. No idea if the trend among younger people to be more accepting of gay people extends to the Muslim community, but with luck it will get there eventually.

    My 2c worth,

    Todd
     
  13. Argentwing

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    The way I see it, even if it was 100% proven that gays burn in eternal hellfire, isn't that punishment enough? Why not let them be until then? It's God's job to judge; we should love our neighbors.
     
  14. hello1992

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    haha, thats my take on most forms of punishment beyond imprisonment. But unfortunately many people do not follow the same logic.

    Why can't people just keep to themselves and not infringe on the well-being of others? Because people are selfish and stupid thats why!
     
  15. Unsurevirgin

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    Um I'm Muslim but confused and the Quran and bible state rape and greed but ppl see lewd as adultery which it is. Both and judiasm say do not fornicate ,doesn't matter which orientation u are. The reason is stds and they looted ppl they sodomised as punishment that any person come into their territory . Ppl are ignorant even animals are homosexual but ppl see male lions as acting dominant and females being affectionate as friends . God wrote it as a code so his true believers can be separated from his false ones . Even our nabi wasn't homophobic . The Hadith fabricates everything even when the prophet told us not to write anything . Bc it's like the bible being rewritten many times . Arabic term for bible is injeel and the injeel has prophet Muhammad peace b upon him in it. He had a hard life but he had a big generous heart . The reason they kill is for money and sorrow . If u kill and do adultery ur very behind on what religion is and what it is and what it does . I'm not forcing anybody to believe it but I watch prayers for bobby and my heart hurts for him.his mom said the same thing about gay ppl but was wrong when she throughly explored what the bible said. The bible was rewritten by various ppl and Quran was written from god himself to separate his true believers and false ones. Islam accepts gays but bigotry ppl don't sadly :frowning2:
     
    #15 Unsurevirgin, Apr 19, 2013
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  16. asmith6543

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    I can't agree with you more on the book called the Hadith, but I think you ought to pay closer attention to the Koran. Have you read the Koran's story of Lot?


    For ye practice your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds.

    It talks about how the people of Lot were homosexuals. God sent down two angels disguised as men as guests to Lot. The men of the town began hitting on the men/angels. God then destroyed them. But the Koran specifically talks about them being homosexuals, lusting after other men, and not women.

    How is it that you say that Islam is accepting of homosexuals when the Koran specifically speaks against that claim. There are more verses I could have quoted, but I I chose just one.
     
  17. Unsurevirgin

    Unsurevirgin Guest

    I just see rape in my eyes in the Quran , god is merciful and compassionate he brought the book to separate his true followers us and the false ones . The Hadith is not a book but a fabrication . The males that are talked about in the Quran were two angels as beautiful rich men. Lot had a wife ,she was promiscuous and str8 and outed lot and did not believe in god at all . the environsnt was a rape zone even children couldnt be safe there . so god told lot to take anyine eho believes him and arent into promiscuousity . even christians and islamic scholars know this . and men have a feel good button there and so do women in the anus but ppl dont know that . i see gay ppl and i see struggle ,ppl struggling to get acceptance and a good life . just like bobby griffth . The towns ppl wanted to rape the men that were angels. The women the Quran is talking about is women of the country . It's a saying . God wouldn't condemn his own true followers . God is pure and gentle and the devil is arrogant and heartless. He told ppl to rape whoever comes into their land and Loot them. Same thing happens in prison ,why? For control and power and dominance and lust . Just wait for the right person and do it with them only and that's what god is saying . Why ? Bc he cares for us he knows aids will occur no matter what orientation u are and what gender .
     
    #17 Unsurevirgin, Apr 20, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 20, 2013
  18. asmith6543

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    so are you saying that the Koran sees rape of women as better alternative to the rape of men? and not that Koran sees homosexuality in bad light? These are the words of "Allah", by the way.

    My intention isnt to offend anyone here. Just discussing what is quite interesting in my view, that Islam is NOT a religion that sees homosexuality in positive light. As far as I have studied, the Hadith is made up bull that contradicts the Koran, and is the basis for Sharia Law, which is also crap. From what I've studied on Islam, I do see the Koran as not being a book for a person to judge others, only oneself. It leaves the latter part up to God himself. However, the Hadith makes judging one another everyone's business. Thanks for responding!
     
  19. Unsurevirgin

    Unsurevirgin Guest

    ur not getting it ,lot was trying to distract the towns ppl he was trying to save Lot and those who were tramatized by rape . And Allah is the Arabic term for god . He wanted to protect lot and the others from rapists. They weren't safe there no one was safe and the place was destitute . God is all knowing he knows us better than anyone. He knows our suffering he made us , god was patient hoping the rapists for turn their ways but they wouldn't . Even Christian scholars even looked into it and it was rape. Rape for anyone that comes in their land . Ur not getting message here . God loves us unconditionally . we have to do right meaning only have sex with spouse and no one else and be generous . The reason bad things are happening is bc devil challenged god he can be a better ruler and look bad things happen wherever he goes .
     
    #19 Unsurevirgin, Apr 20, 2013
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  20. asmith6543

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    Okay, I think you are so concerned with being able to justify your orientation and religion, that you arent really reading the quote I got from the Koran. Again, im not trying to offend you, but get you to understand from my perspective, that the Koran, and therefore by extension "Allah," does not view homosexuality as acceptable.
    Im not going to press this issue any further after this post. I ask that you actually DO read the quote from the Koran below.

    26:165 What! Of all creatures do ye come unto the males,
    26:166 And leave the wives your Lord created for you ? Nay, but ye are froward folk.


    I dont think this has anything to do with rape, rather its pretty obvious its talking about homosexuality. If a guy rapes another, that doesnt necessarily mean a person is leaving their wife. It is however, stating that if a male takes a male as a partner, then clearly they would be leaving a female. The Koran then calls homosexuals as are "froward folk" ( i.e. Stubbornly contrary and disobedient)

    and please dont respond by saying that "God loves us, and therefore is okay with homosexuality" b/c that really isn't an argument. Can you provide me a quote where it is deemed acceptable? In my research I have only seen quotes such as the one above where it is deemed unnatural and perverse, and thus "Allah" is not okay with it.
     
    #20 asmith6543, Apr 20, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2013