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Why does the LGBT community gravitate towards the left?

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by vhrebels, May 15, 2013.

  1. vhrebels

    vhrebels Guest

    Why do many LGBT people believe that more government will fix our nation's problems? The government is what regulated what is and isn't a legitimate marriage for so many years, which made many LGBT americans unable to marry. I just really can't comprehend why "more government" would fix our social issues. I am fairly anti-government, because the only they are good at is killing people and wasting money. The government has deprived the nation of their constitutional rights for so long, why do so many people think that the government will fix the issues that they have caused?
     
  2. Owen

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    The leftist philosophy is less government involvement in social issues, more government involvement in economic issues. We don't want "more government" overall; we want more government in certain areas, and social issues are not one of those areas.

    If you're thinking it's unreasonable to think that we can have more government involvement in some areas and less than others, let me point out that the rightist philosophy seems to be more government involvement in social issues, less in economic issues. So both sides are running on the philosophy that government involvement doesn't have to be universal across all issues.
     
  3. Luke Matt

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    I gravitate towards the left because the right is generally very conservative on many issues that I consider important (e.g. abortion, marriage equality, religion vs science).
     
  4. vhrebels

    vhrebels Guest

    I guess what I'm trying to say is; why isn't the Liberitarian party more popular? I subscribe to many of the ideals that they believe in, like trying to ensure that everyone is happy. It seems like the republicans are trying to take away gay rights and the right to have an abortion, while the left is taking away guns and freedom of religion and speech. I wish we could have true freedom in our country, where everyone could peacefully coexist. The government shouldn't have to force beliefs down our throats; we should make the right decisions ourselves.
     
  5. Convoy

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    The rightest party is just rooted too far in religion and homophobia right now for me to support them not to mention that I'd be a 'leftest' either way.

    Social issues and things like union support are important to myself coming from a working class family and background, right wing interests won't help me any so why would I support them?

    Economically my interests are vested in the leftist side of politics, and economics are the most important part of anything to be honest; if I can't get food, I'll starve, no medical insurance then I'll deteriorate from disease and illness, no job support and I'll be worked to death. There's reasons there other than "wahha, I'm a liberal give be stuff". :/.

    Not to mention not all democrats and leftist politicians are 'liberal' and supporting of lgbt rights anyways; in someways I feel the democratic party is becoming increasingly split on this.

    I'm not really for the Libertarian party just because they're all over the wall and really there isn't a good way for me to support them. It just doesn't work out right unless they really want to organize properly. Plus they still wouldn't help me as a working class citizen, so what's the point in freedom when I have to rely on charity to support myself (Not a 'freeloader', but there's only so much manual work a person can do with no kickbacks) ?
     
  6. Hefiel

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    I had some assumptions as to what inspired you to make this thread, and the part in bold confirmed my beliefs. You're falling for Mainstream Media and Republican propaganda. The left is not in a war against Christianity, nor are they trying to take people's guns away.

    I strongly encourage you to read up on information and opinions from the opposite side of the wall (The left), as well as learn a bit more about other governments around the world which, mostly in industrialized countries, are far more on the Left than the US to better understand the leftist perspective. As far as the US goes, the party that is referred as the "left" is arguably more conservatives than conservative parties in other countries. They're just a bit more on the left in regards to social issues.
     
    #6 Hefiel, May 15, 2013
    Last edited: May 15, 2013
  7. Mike92

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    Not me - I'm a moderate.

    Many conservatives are practically nuts, while liberals are living in a dream world.

    Mix the two together and you get the dysfunction that's occurring in Washington today.
     
  8. Byron

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    I personally subscribe to the philosophy that both major political parties here in the United States have become so polarized as to be illogical, irrational, and not to be trusted. To put it simply, I don't like politics, and I don't trust politicians.
     
  9. Mike92

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    I would argue that this is a major contributing factor in America's shitty politicians and dysfunction.
     
  10. vhrebels

    vhrebels Guest

    [/QUOTE] I had some assumptions as to what inspired you to make this thread, and the part in bold confirmed my beliefs. You're falling for Mainstream Media and Republican propaganda. The left is not in a war against Christianity, nor are they trying to take people's guns away.[/QUOTE]

    I don't believe that there is a war singling out Christianity specifically. One of my best friends is a Muslim, and he is not aloud to make any public professions about his faith at school because if he did, one of the "liberal" teachers would shut him down. I think this is totally unacceptable. People should be able to speak and worship whenever and wherever they want. People shouldn't be afraid to speak their mind. But it seems like to me, the more liberal teachers do not allow any religion of any kind in the classroom, wether that is Islam or Christianity.
     
  11. Pret Allez

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    I reject the fundamental assumption that leftist philosophy is monolithically in favor of increasing the size of government. That ignores a rich, anti-authoritarian tradition that's been expressed all over the world.

    I'd prefer to say that the queer community gravitates toward anti-authoritarian philosophies.
     
  12. Hefiel

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    (In bold) This isn't an issue of political beliefs, but of bigotry if it is limited strictly to Islam but Christianity is allowed. If neither is allowed, then it is a non-issue.

    With that out of the way, I don't see an issue with keeping religion out of the classroom. There's the Sunday 'school' for that.
     
  13. Byron

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    I believe that you misunderstand, I follow local, national, and to an extent international politics. I understand the political process here in the United States, that does not mean that I agree with the way that it works.

    I would much rather prefer it if our elected officials would spend more time doing their job than they do playing at the game of politics. I am especially tired of the political game-play at the federal level, we don't even have a federal budget for goodness sake. I have more faith in my state government than the "charlie foxtrot" that is Washington.
     
  14. Mike92

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    Yeah, that won't be changing any time soon.
     
  15. AlamoCity

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    Because the right is generally "anti-gay."

    But seriously, while I usually vote "left," when it comes to individual referenda and constitutional amendments I sometimes vote to the "right." Also, many LGBTs who would vote on the "right" had it not been for being gay, sometimes vote Libertarian or Independent. If GOP (right-wing) parties eliminate social issues from the agenda, I'm sure many LGBTs may switch parties.
     
  16. Just Jess

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    So I kinda geek out on politics. My intro to the internet was in my hard core militant atheist phase, and it wasn't long before I found out you could talk about sports and politics here too.

    I really try to not waste so much time on it any more though. I could sum up my entire political position right here real fast: I'm pro pot, pro gay, pro internet anonymity and privacy, and anti whatever the RIAA is doing this week. That's really it.

    BUT, this week I'm out of school :slight_smile:

    To answer your original question, the "French divide" (left/right conservative/liberal) is typically more of a city mouse/country mouse divide. The kinds of economic solutions the left promotes are things where a small amount of resources could be used more efficiently to solve a lot of problems and leave everyone resource richer, like say public transportation. More resources means keeping more people alive and happy. On the right, you're looking at small specialized groups of people. Left policies usually leave these groups of people in the cold. A policy promoting public transportation instead of cars across the board, for instance, could really hurt a lot of people who lived in a city where a lot of resources come in through trucks, that supports a lot of farms people drive to and from.

    And that's really how the French divide is supposed to work. You have the left looking at groups of people, and you have the right looking at human beings. And in theory that means that if you have one doctor and 99 sick people, you should end up with 100 happy people. Of course that trick never works in reality.

    Soooooo, one thing about cities is, if you have a lot of people packed in tightly, you really have to ignore a lot of the differences between you in order to get along. Which means cities have to be more LGBT accepting. And they already lean left. And there you go.

    As to the "why aren't there more libertarians" question. The french divide was here first. Political power also has to come from somewhere. I mean in order for you to even hear about someone running for office, you've gotta be established right? So that power comes from Republicans and Democrats. That's the big problem people have. The Libertarian party has kind of a revolving door that Republicans can go through, just like the Green party has with the Democrats. A lot of people just plain don't see a lot of difference between the Libertarians and the Republicans.

    But I think you Libertarians really have a golden opportunity with the internet. Because the city mouse/country mouse divide is really going away. People are working telecommute jobs that are both in Silicon Valley and an apartment in a tiny city with cheap food and rent. And there is no way a major political party can make them happy.

    As for me, I'm kinda mellowing out - I used to be very very anti-authoritarian - and finding slow ways to make peace with the powers that be. It's a long and slow process. The result is that I vocally support as loud as I can people pushing a few issues, and with LGBT stuff, that means siding with the left.

    If the Libertarian party really wanted my support, it would have to prove itself. Your base is the internet and anyone left out when city and rural issues within the U.S. are the only ones on the table. SOPA/PIPA/CISPA/WHATEVER is your chance.
     
    #16 Just Jess, May 15, 2013
    Last edited: May 15, 2013
  17. PurpleRain

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    Government will do exactly what you tell it to if you get enough people to support it. It really doesn't matter who you vote for. Do you think those politicians would risk their steady six-figure salaries to keep people they don't know or care about from getting married? No. Government is the solution to the problem of government. I wish people would realize that. It's important to take a stand because they're controlled by the people. It's just intimidating because big business has so much control and they have so much power but if a million people march to make a difference things will change. If there's a chance that someone will lose office, it'll change. That's fact it's just that not enough people care or understand... :/
     
  18. Argentwing

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    Because the right hates gays and the left doesn't, generally speaking. Plus, the right is big on keeping things the way they always have been. Gay rights sort of flies in the face of that even if bigotry were not in the equation.

    With that said I'm pretty moderate, taking opinions from both sides and in the middle. Goes pretty nicely with my chosen label :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:
     
  19. Just Jess

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    I wanted to add, because some of that may have seemed a little bit "love letter" to the right. I intentionally left something out of this paragraph...

    ...because, just facing it, we all know how we're all treated outside of cities. It's not the Democrats that are trying to make it illegal for me to use a bathroom in Arizona.
     
  20. That1Guy

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    Why does the LGBT gravitate towards the left? Well what's considered the left? With how far right the "right wing" in this country are, it seems that being a moderate or even center-right gets you labeled as a leftist, liberal, socialist, etc.

    For me personally, I could never identify with the "right" in this country - even if they didn't bible thump, propose discriminatory laws aimed towards gay people and minorities, take idiotic stances on things like science, global warming, and evolution, and instead only focused on economics, I still wouldn't support them. There is so much corruption, propaganda, hypocrisy, homophobia, racism, and flat out stupidity surrounding them that they'd truly have to completely change for me to ever consider voting for them.

    Anyways, I would personally consider myself socially liberal and fiscally moderate; I want to like the libertarian party but for me personally, they seem way to extreme when it comes to economic and other issues.