A new way of interpreting sexuality is due to choices.

I don't really buy that. I think that's just a mere coincidence. I don't think any external forces will make you gay/bi/lesbian...it comes from the beginning. #my2cents

 

I agree. I don't think it has anything to do with your environment or any of the choices you make at all. It is a choice to acknowledge who you are and to come out but I don't think that it is a choice to be gay or whatever, and neither do the choices you make in life have any effect on your sexuality

 

For example, I've known (or at least had an idea) that I was gay since I was around 9 years old. In that time, I've had family members die, parents divorce and custody case, trouble with school. I still am the same. No external forces can make me change otherwise.

 

This is possible, I guess.
Though I recall having a crush on my uncles when I was like 5.

 

Yeah. I had a two friends become anorexic and another two start cutting, one was suicidal even, my grandfather died... but that's kinda besides the point.

My gay uncle and his fiance got married, and i had five friends come out to me as either lesbian, bisexual, or bi-curious, but through everything, none of this has affected me. At all. And even though most of that happened before I came to terms with being lesbian, it still didn't affect me in the slightest. It didn't even come to mind.

 

Same here! Just because I read articles about Hitler and pre-war Germany doesn't mean I'm going to turn into a Nazi :lol:

 

Sure, I think it's possible. I feel like I had at least some agency in how queer I became. I think it was a little more than just accepting myself. I don't know how to explain it... It's sorta like I decided I wanted to love as many people as I can...

I can do little more than speculate though. As you say, it's pretty untestable...

 

My point exactly. I'm not going to stop eating or start cutting or kill myself because of my friends. And I'm not going to decide who I am based on them either. I refuse to do that. It's completely irrational. And although my experiences and past choices do influence me in many ways, my sexuality is not one of the things affected.

 

Indeed. Ultimately sexuality is an instinctual attraction to other people.
And instincts tend to be largely if not completely biologically determined.

 

So... kind of a butterfly effect?

 

Pardon me, but I'm not getting your point.
The butterfly effect has to do with time-travel, what has that got to do with this thread?



---------- Post added 24th Jun 2013 at 02:44 PM ----------

Fluid sexuality =/= choosing your sexuality. It's a shift in which gender(s) you're attracted to.
Just like your taste changing as you get older, it's not necisarrily something you choose.

False. As explained above.

No, the science of sexuality tells us that sexuality, whilst possibly fluid, is immutable.

Exactly, hence the inborn argument doesn't exclude fluid sexuality like you claimed earlier.

Not really, since there is evidence of sexuality being biologically determined, even through birth and fluid sexuality doesn't exclude the possibility of sexuality being inborn.

 

Im not sure I agree either.

That is like saying if certain people made certain choices in their life, they could end up less straight then if they hadn't. While i think there is some truth that it could be a miniscule change if you can call it that... for example
young teenagers are at a party - two friends Bob and Charlie end up kissing while playing spin the bottle and Charlie actually liked it - neither was drinking, just lying about it.
Charlie later always wants to play spin the bottle at every party he goes to with the secret intention of kissing a guy to test if he likes it.

Turns out hes bisexual end course

I think things like choices can help you REALIZE your sexuality, but i'm not sure they are testable at all xD also, from my belief, it wouldn't effectively change any of your sexuality. Realizing things and having things actually changed are different. however.... *contradiction coming up lol* Fluid Sexuality has some truth to it from what i've heard. Choices stem from thought processes, morals, beliefs, etc etc. Sexually Fluid can be a class of orientations itself. In that respect, I think people who are born some form of Sexually Fluid didnt choose that, and they dont choose when it "changes" either... Notice the word changes is applying to two different situations.

Idk where I was going with this anymore lol.
Interesting Idea though

 

Can you cite a scientific proponent of inborn sexuality that claims this, because this is the first I've hear of it.

What proponents believe is rather irrelevant to me. The current scientific consensus is that it's immutable.
That is to say, you might experience change in your sexual orientation, but you cannot conciously alter it.

None of which has been succesfully presented so far.

Can you name it or cite a book or webpage on this theory?

How exactly?

You could claim that, but I've yet to see someone present evidence for that claim.

Sorry but that's a leap.
Epigentics isn't the only thing that can determine sexuality. There's also hormones, take for example the effect of the mothers body on the child during pregnancy.

Imo fluid sexuality is pretty much established. Finally, even if neurplasticy plays a part, that's still not something that can be catagorised as a choice.
And like I said earlier, the current scientific consensus is that sexuality is pretty much immutable.

 

If I think back now, I've never been attracted to girls. I've only liked them as close friends, etc. I can't ever see myself sleeping with a girl and having relations with her. Sorry, but that's like asking if my skin colour can change over time. :dry:

 

The problem with theories and hypotheses is that they tend to generalise - like a general theory of relativity that can provide a universal answer.

If there is one observation I would make from reading threads on EC its that there is enormous variation in how individuals experience their sexuality whatever it may be.

Speaking for myself, I have never experienced any fluidity in my gender or sexual identity. I have always felt comfortable as a male, and always found other males (and not females) romantically and physically attractive. This goes back to early childhood.

However, there are many others who do experience fluidity in gender identity and/or sexual orientation that continues throughout their lives.

Trying to find out whether its nurture or nature is a dead end, I think, because it is both. And the mix is different for all of us. What 'made' my sexual orientation is not necessarily the same as what made your sexual orientation. There may be some commonality, but there is probably as much that isn't common.

The human brain is enormously complex so its no surprise we all experience life differently - its what makes humans special.

In some there may be an element of choice. There isn't anything necessarily wrong with that unless it turns out you chose the wrong side to bat on - that can be very confusing. In my case, there was no sense of choice whatsoever.

 

Perhaps. But if someone is finding "solace" in essentially scapegoating their sexuality on an essentially-untestable theory, I'd argue there are more important things to be thought about.

You are ______. BFD. Does it really matter how you "ended up" being _____? It's almost one of those things better off not being known, IMO.

 

I've thought about the whole 'choice' thing at great length, as I am one of those people who will always say 'at the end of the day, you still chose to do x'. And as much as I know I did not choose to be gay. I chose to live my life accordingly. I realised I would not be happy with a woman so why try? I have therefore in my mind, chosen to date men etc. Equally, I could have chosen to live a lie and go on to marry a woman and never be happy but at least society would be more accepting. I actually think this is what many gay men did for years before society became more accepting of us.