need to vent after gay marriage debate...

i never thought about it that way. hmmmm. we shud just create our own religion. then the law cant deny our practices and then we could have SAME SEX MARRAGE!!! lol.

 

I like the idea of making marriage SOLELY a religious thing. This would immediately invalidate at least half of marriages in America...

Lex

 

Yes we have been around just as long as they have, maybe longer. People are becoming more excepting yes, but they still are holding tight to their customs and VERY set in stone ways and its mostly those people that are running this country. I live in California and they had voted yes on prop 8. but so many people are still fighting against it. I think it might not last. there will always be people that don't approve of wat others do and try to fight against it. we just hav to fight back. right?
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>>>I like the idea of making marriage SOLELY a religious thing. This would immediately invalidate at least half of marriages in America...

Lex
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then wat wud people do to if they want to promise to stay together forever? write a contract? lol not very romantic....

 

The truth is church and state are NOT separate. They're distanced but not apart. Sad to say.

 

Keith Oberman actully says it best on this subject...

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChanTFSmqao[/YOUTUBE]

 

Lol wow. He was like out of breath the whole way through. Talk about into it.

 

I'm glad to see that someone doesn't hate us in the news.

 

Wow, I've never seen anyone on this news like this...not calling us "special interests" and all that. I'm proud of NBC.

 

Thank for sharing that Greg! I have not seen this well said.

 

i thinnk that he says it better then anyone i know i glad there is someone out there standing for us..

 

keith oberman is a beast! couldnt have said it better my self...

 

You should use the term "civil marriage" when debating. Then it becomes a government thing, not a religious thing. People can still believe what they want. Get "married" in their churches with God's blessing but "civil marriage" is for everyone.

 

the problem I have with the idea of anti gay marriage on religous terms is the fact that what a chirstian calls "traditional marriage" is the most modern version of marriage in existance.

infact, what they define as marriage was defined as traditional marriage by the church a full three centuries after the crucifiction of christ.

before that point, it was not uncommon for marriage to be preformed between same gender couples.

Traditional marriage is actually nothing more then a support structure between two people. that was what it was defined as until christianity began to vilify it, and refused to sanction such unions *which there are verified records of them doing it in the three hundred or so years between the crucification, and them beginning to burn homosexuals at the stake*

marriage was a support structure based on the notion that two people together and united are stronger then two people standing alone. gay marriage existed longer then christanity has.

It frustrates me when people claim the excuse of "traditional marriage" becaue it doesnt historically and cultuerally hold up.

 

Yeah, the other day had a similar argument with my dad. He kept saying that civil unions are enough and that legalising gay marriage is giving gays the possibility of a bourgeois life that is not meant for them (blah, just an elegant way of saying 'a marriage is between a man and a woman'). I told him that if he considered himself liberal and non-discriminating he should either be against marriage, or support marriage for everyone regardless of their sexuality, race, etc. He couldn't counter back .

 

I am a part of our state wide equality action and we are attempting to put marriage up for a peoples vote. church and state should be separate. However here are some points that maybe she can relate to. Say she was married to her husband and he died, and someone told her that she had no say in what happened to his body, or his belongings and they were taking her kids away and giving them to someone else because she was not legally their mom (hypothetically). have her imagine that her husband was on life support and she did not get to decide weather to save him or end his suffering it would be up to his parent or immediate family member. what if her children went to school and could not say their parents are married? Imagine if in some states you could be fired from your job or lose their house if someone found out they loved eachother....I am a Christian and I cannot believe anyone who believes in god can look at those things and say god would want that to happen to people/ children...if so that is not a very Christian way of thinking. Thats why we are fighting so hard for marriage not CIVIL UNION , Union does not provide all of these protections under the law but marriage does! It would be much harder to start a new law providing these for civil unions than it is to get gay marriage passed. There are also churches in most areas that accept all people usually universalist unitarian churches maybe if she looked into some of those she may see that not all Christians think this is a sin. But overall she may never come around and that is her choice...sad....but her choice. You know whats right in your heart and the god i believe in will open his arms to all that are good and love themselves and their fellow man. -Jen

 

Ask her if she believes in a marriage between one man and one woman if the two of them are brother and sister. When she says "ewww, no!" ask her why? Then go on to tell her that incest was never condemned in the Bible and, as a matter of fact Abraham and Sarah had an incestuous relationship.

Then bring up another topic, ask her if what she believes should be what is. Whatever she says you could say "What if I believed that two Christians shouldn't get married, would you find that offensive?"

"umm, yes!"
"Well...why? It's my belief? Shouldn't my beliefs be enforced on everyone else?"
"no..."
"Then why do you think your beliefs should?"

Then explain to her that the definition of marriage was ORIGINALLY (meaning from it's origin) a definition that "united two people", usually based on property.

 

First off, Starting our own religion wouldn't help because the supreme court has ruled that government cannot infringe upon religious belief but may regulate religious practices. For example, if we formed a religion that said we must sacrifice babies every Monday at sundown, the courts would rule that illegal even though it was part of our religion. Basically, we need to find another way to argue the religion factor...

I got in a fight over gay marriage with my swimming coach once. He told me that it was an insult to the relationship he had with his wife and that I should go read the bible. I was to pissed-off. Some people are so ignorant I guess.

Winston Churchill, my hero, once said "You have enemies? Good! That means that you stood up for something, sometime in your life." I guess this is a call to action... a few enemies is worth a lot of friends.

 

I like the idea of making the "federal" or legal status of marriages called "civil unions" for everyone. That way if marriage is a religious term then churches can stick with this, and government can get back to the business of not discriminating against people.

That said, it does depress me somewhat that I finally get the gumption to start a relationship with a guy, and he and I can never get married (not that it's gotten anywhere near that point mind you just saying).