So now my mom knows I support gay marriage. LGBT rights in general. They don't know I'M gay, but yeah. My dad will know as soon as my mom tells him. I made the foolish, foolish spur of the moment decision to get involved in a debate about Kim Davis's actions, and between the speed of the conversation and my ADHD, I let slip a lot more than I intended. Crap. So my mom had apparently suspected my position for some time, but she still was still upset. She's worried about me, because she's Catholic, and this is for sure gonna lead to more questions as they try to figure out "where I stand" as a Catholic. Which is a problem, because she still thinks I'm a Catholic when I am, in fact, an atheist. So I'm going to have to do my darnedest to defend gay marriage FROM a the Catholic standpoint I disagree with because there is no way I'm telling her I'm an atheist until I've moved out. :bang: I'm sick to my stomach just thinking about how hairy this is gonna get and I just need some support.
I've always supported LGBT rights, even when I was religious (I'm also an atheist who grew up in a religious household), and even before I realized I was bisexual. So supporting LGBT rights doesn't necessarily imply you're atheist or gay, it just means you care about the rights of your fellow human beings. If this does lead to a conversation with your parents where you need to defend your beliefs about gay marriage, you don't need really need to bring your religion or sexuality into it. Just tell them you don't believe it's the government's place to decide who can marry whom, that people shouldn't let their personal religious and moral beliefs dictate the freedoms of others. If a person believes same-sex relationships are wrong within their religion, then they should still recognize that marriage as recognized by the government is an entirely SEPARATE institution from their religion and they should allow other people to live their own personal lives how they see fit.
First off: thanks for replying! Unfortunately it's more gonna come down to my parents telling me I'm not a Catholic in good standing if I disagree with church doctrine on these issues. Which...of course, I'm not Catholic at all so they're right, but that's not something I'm ready to say yet. So the issue is gonna be them respecting my standpoint WITHIN the church and not telling me I'm heretical or whatever. Because in the Catholic church you are basically bound to agree with the pope's rulings on this stuff(though not everybody does, my parents would say they are not 'true catholics' and shouldn't be allowed to remain members).
Well unfortunately that leaves you with three options in terms of your parents knowing about you not being Catholic: tell the truth, lie, or avoid the issue. From your original post I'm guessing the first option is probably not the best for the moment. Option two: I can't really help you with this one because I don't know how you feel about lying about your religious beliefs. However, if directly asked the question of whether you believe in Catholicism, you may have to make a choice between telling them the truth or pretending you're still Catholic. Though for as long as you're dependent on your parents, I do think it's probably better than coming out as atheist if you think your parents might make your life a lot worse for you by doing so. Option three: This is obviously the most preferable of the three options but it hinges on whether anyone actually confronts you about it. If I were you I would continue to defend your beliefs about gay marriage from a non-religious argument, and just keep reiterating that your religion is irrelevant to your stance on gay marriage. This way you could try to redirect the conversation to keep it away from your personal beliefs on religion.
. I can sympathize with what you are going to have to go through! I didn't have super-religious parents, but I did find it important to research what the Bible really says to Christians about homosexuality vs what religious figures say. One site that I found helpful was The "Not All Like That" Christians project. (You can Google it online.) It talks about Christianity from the LGBTQ viewpoint....
I had to go read who Kim Davis was. ...Holy crap. She brought up that she was "acting under God's authority". That's not too far off from saying "God spoke to me". Which, even Christians don't buy that. Like, when a murderer says "God told me to kill them" the Christian jury doesn't go "Oh, well that makes it okay then". They think the murderer is crazy and should be locked up. So she's kind of skirting that same territory. Even if you say it says in the bible "God hates gay people" it doesn't say anything about "God denying marriage licenses". So where did she get this authority? I think that's the best angle you can play with your parents. Ask them "if a murderer said God gave me the authority to kill children" would you say that's okay or would you think they were crazy?" and then follow that up with that this lady is talking about God giving her authority, and that she is crazy. If they say "That's different" just keep bringing it back to "the man who heard God tell him to kill children." Keep the conversation focused on that instead of anything having to do with gay people, or gay rights, or gay marriage, etc. Having said all that, this is a highly manipulative way of dealing with someone, which isn't a big deal in this case because of how they will approach you about it, but on a personal note I think you need to get out of there as soon as you can.
That's a really good point, SkyWinter. In this kind of case, it's not unknown for parents to disown or even throw LGBT kids out of the house :icon_sad: Although, often, they will make an effort to get you counseling, make you see a religious leader, try to get you to "Pray the Gay Away," or try to send you to a camp to 'fix' you. Since there is nothing wrong with you - nothing to fix - none of that would work, of course. But if you Come Out fully to them, you might want to have a backup safe place to go long-term in case the worst possible outcome occurs. Or you could continue to stay officially in the closet until you are old enough to be out on your own. Just some thoughts...
Ikr? Kim Davis is crazy and I just couldn't resist throwing in a stray comment because they see her as some kind of martyr :rolle: Well good news is for now I've given myself some space to breathe - I told my mom I'm not in a good state of mind to have this conversation right this second, and she backed off and told me she loved me. As much as I dislike lying, I think I am going to do my best to defend my position while keeping them under the impression that I am Catholic. Being in disagreement with Catholic teaching is bad enough under their definitions, I don't want to bring my atheism into it right now. God I'm still shaking - I know it seems extreme but I've always been kind of the perfectly behaved child in their minds. Their enabler, their yes man. Been walking on eggshells for a long time and I was really not ready to be having this discussion with them at all :eek:
That's perfectly natural. Talking about your sexuality, an extremely personal and private thing, to your parents is terrifying to most people and you already have a good idea that they are very likely to react badly. You really need to just Come Out or not Come Out to them on your own timeline and comfort level.
And now my dad just approached me and said he's able to "absolutely and irrefutably prove" that same-sex marriage is wrong under Catholic doctrine. He says it's in the catechism and he's gonna show me tomorrow. If it's in the catechism he's probably gonna tell me flat out I'm not Catholic unless I accept. (Again, I'm not, I'm an atheist but I'm not gonna go there unless ABSOLUTELY neccesary) I guess I'll just have to tell him I still consider myself Catholic regardless of what he believes I am. Thanks for being here guys - sorry if I'm oversharing but I don't have a support system irl and this is treading a really narrow little line here.
Welllll... I'm not catholic. I don't know a whole lot about Catholicism. I mean technically I'm christian, because I go to a christian church and pray to God, but that said, I'm not opposed to people being atheists. I'm not that devout I guess, haha... In my opinion, it seems that the bible can be interpreted in a lot of different ways though. There was a while when everyone was convinced that God hated blacks, too. And that according to God, women were inferior. And yet, the world is changing. If you did believe in God (As it looks like you have to pretend to.) would you believe that he hated gays? Like I said, I'm definitely not a Catholic. I know they have some pretty strict rules that I can't really even imagine. I think that there are ways to tie in religion to LGTB rights. Doesn't God love all his children? I don't feel like God would want some people to be punished for the way they were born, for something they can't help. Just my opinion. I don't know your parents, and I don't entirely know your situation. Do your parents care more about religion then they do you? If so, then that's not great parenting, though it sounds very religious. The best thing I can suggest you do to win your parents over might be to ask for help. You don't have to tell them that you're gay, though you can tell them that you're having a hard time right now. It might even help them to understand if you "ask God" for help, I don't know. People are often more understanding if you open up to them though. Do you mind if I spout a couple ignorant thoughts on religion? Bear with me. Or, pardon my ranting, you don't have to read this. If your parents think that "God" currently accepts you, then what about that is going to change if you come out? Doesn't the big man know this stuff already? I mean, I don't know. That's something that's always confused me about religion. If God knows you, then he would probably know someone was gay before they knew it themselves. Right? So why would he make someone be gay? If God doesn't make mistakes, then that means there's a reason for gay people. Right? Probably so the world could be more accepting. Forgive me, I'm quite ignorant about religion. The concept of God hating gays doesn't quite make sense to me though. Just because the bible lists off a few instances where God didn't favor those who were gay shouldn't imply that it's all gays, right? I mean, how many times have people shouted "I hate lawyers!" and then they maybe meet a lawyer that they might like. No one should really be able to generalize anything. Even God. I'm pretty sure there are a lot of people who believe humans are naturally evil. In that case, if we're generalizing, we all go to hell. Great. So yeah, in a nutshell, I'm not a catholic. XD Religion is a complicated thing. I can understand why some people choose atheism.
Hey I'm with you. That's an excellent argument for gay marriage from a Christian standpoint. Sadly Catholics are probably one of the more closed-minded groups you could be in. "The Church says it's wrong" is infallible in their view. No freedom of thought, no disagreement. After that their brains shut off and they just keep repeating, "the Church says it's wrong" and you're not Catholic if you challenge that. It's really quite infuriating. Oh and thumbs up for fellow Potterhead, love the signature :icon_bigg
I'm an an atheist as well, but I do know some religious reasons (Christianity/Catholicism specifically) for supporting gay marriage- The part of the Bible that Christians seem to love so much is the New Testament. In this book, there is nothing about stoning gays or anything about gays at all. Jesus was the one who all about love, peace, and just harmony in general. He would've wanted all people to be treated well, no matter their sexual orientation.
The attitude of your parents makes me want to scream with frustration - it's like they're still stuck in the Dark Ages. But you're an intelligent young person who thinks for themselves and understands how to look after yourself. I know it's not easy to keep your opinions to yourself just to maintain the peace in the household. But as you rightly say, it's best not to rock the boat. I just hope that if they find out who you really are, that they then have the generosity of true Christians to accept you just the way you are. I think you're a very brave and impressive young person. But I think that of so many teenagers on this forum - you're all fighting hard for your place in the world and it's great to see.
