Hey there, I'm a 20 years old Italian girl (I guess you'll have to forgive my English :eusa_doh. I'll go straight to the point: about 3 weeks ago, I sent a screenshot to my mother, I was distracted and really tired, so I didn't think about the fact that I had a picture of my girlfriend and I sharing a little kiss set as a wallpaper (stupid me). My mother wasn't unaware of the fact that I was dating a girl, as one day we had a fight and broke up and I told her everything. She kinda tried to comfort me, but she did it by trying to convince me that being with her was just a mistake I made, because I felt lonely after I split up with my ex-boyfriend; she said things that clearly indicated that she thought she was sick, or even worse, as she was gay. She also told me that she didn't want to hear another word about me dating girls, ever, she didn't want to know anything about that part of my life. So, I didn't tell her when me and my grilfriend got back together. Of course none of what she said was true, as I have been in love with her for a year before she told me that she fell for me too, and I decided to leave my boyfriend so that I could stay with her. She doesn't know I have liked girls long before this. Now, she made a very big deal out of that photo, she told me I lied to her and treated me as if I sent her something really bad and disgusting on purpose, then she said she wouldn't pay for my university anymore and that if I decide to stay with my girlfriend, she'll throw me out of the house. Since I had a boyfriend, she thinks that we're staying together just because we can't find a guy (completely not true, but that's her conception of bisexuality), she accused my girlfriend of using me because of this, and insulted her, (she's 100% gay) and threatens me of telling people about my sexuality, as if I could be ashamed of it! I'm not ashamed of loving someone this much and I sure am serious about all this, but she doesn't seem to understand. She also told me that she spoke to my girlfriend's mother and that she was really angry at us too, but I know for sure that they didn't talk at all as her parents, who have been really supportive to me, told me so in surprise... The final thing she said, was that I disgusted her, and didn't even want my little sister near the clothes that I touched... In this late years, I've never been so close to my family, so I'm not surprised or really hurt about the fact that they don't even try to understand me, just really, really angry. I've always been a good kid, top class student, she used to be proud of me, and now it's like I committed some sort of terrible crime... At this moment, I wouldn't really know how to adjust things between us, not even how to behave or get her to listen to me, as when I speak my words don't seem to really reach her. I sure as hell don't want to leave my girlfriend, and it seems inevitable that our relationship will fall apart... And I am really scared 'cause I don't have a job yet, and even if I left university it's not guaranteed that I'll find one soon enough to be independent...
Maybe, somehow introduce her to just how many people feel the way you do. That we live in an era where it's not about the sex of the person anymore but the personality. Show her a video of the conception of a baby to prove that gender is just a word. That everybody starts out genderless. She said she won't pay for your schooling anymore, you said? Why not see if you can get a student loan instead? Do they have them there? I can totally relate to having a Mom that throws tantrums and threatens to kick you out. Luckily, for me, it's never happened. Maybe, being empathetic would help? Like, "Mom, you seem really upset by this. I'm sorry to upset you. But I would be even more upset if I couldn't be myself. Please, try and show me some compassion. It's just as hard on me as it is you". Something like that. I wish you all the best!
Hey, thanks for the feedback first of all, it really helps hearing advice from someone who has lived this situation, and knowing I'm not alone out here. Even though, I just realised this topic would maybe better fit in Families and relationship... forgive me, I'm new. Yes, I could and will ask for students loan, but I'm not sure it will cover all the costs, since my University is quite far from the town I live in and so I need to pay for my own apartment and food and so on... I tried again to talk to her, today she showed me an article about sexually transmitted diseases, saying like 'you don't think about that risks' and so on. I laughed at it, seriously, I'm aware of that and I'm trying to get into med school as well, so... I told her that have an unprotected sexual intercourse with a man has the same risks (I mean, I don't know of so many straight people who use condoms in oral intercourses after months they've been with each other), and that precautions exists for women (one of the many things she wasn't aware of) and men are at risk as well in this sense, but she kept on saying it's not the same thing. About the fact of telling her how many people are in my situation... Well, she uses it against me. She's saying that being gay or bi is becoming some kind of fashion and that's why everyone now is 'blabbing about weddings, adoption and other bull****'(I'm quoting) and that really hurt me, not even for myself, but because it shows how many people (at leasts here) thinks that gay fighting for their own rights it's just a futile thing. So yeah, she's not being reasonable enough for me to talk to her, as usual my words don't reach her or she changes them and use them against me... she goes on saying that the problem is not my sexual orientation but my girlfriend, as she says she's promiscuous and she sort of casted some kind of evil spell on me, as if I weren't able to think with my own mind... but then she also goes on saying how much gay people disgusts her, and that I am to leave the house as soon as it's possible, that I could ruin my sister, and that she keeps my photo to remind herself why she's angry. I feel like there is no dialogue, it's just me trying to explain something she doesn't want to listen and her insulting me. I think it's her way to oblige me to see I'm making a mistake... but I don't think the problem is really about my girlfriend who's 'using' me, but about the fact that she IS a girl... isn't it? She says we're too insecure to find a boyfriend and so we choose to do this instead. But it's not true of course. When I said 'If you think I need someone by my side so bad, why did I left my boyfriend?' And she said 'I don't know, I don't know' but the answer is obviously 'cause I fell for my girlfriend. And, I mean, even he understood that. When she said I come back home just for the money, I, crying, told her I was coming back to see my family and talk, have a normal relationship, and she just said there can't be a normal relationship if I behave like this. I feel really useless in all this... She obviously doesn't know much about gays, and that's why she doesn't understand, but she wouldn't even let me explain...
Hi Mina, oh I am so sorry to read about this. Everything you say is true, and everything she thinks is wrong... I know I can't help much but your posting caught my attention because I have Italian relatives. (Love them!!!) And if one of their daughters brought a girl home they would say "Welcome". I mean Benvenuto! (Your English is fine btw, it makes me feel a bit embarrassed about Anglo cultural imperialism.. but I'll get over it.) I hope other people with situations more similar to yours will post also. I am afraid it is almost impossible to talk people out of their beliefs, or rather their feelings. Both for you and for her: she cannot possibly reason you out of love. (Especially since she is wrong.) I hope that omnia vincit amor and she will understand your feelings. At least better than now. But things may never be "the same" again for you and your mom. And if you hope too much for that you will just hurt yourself more. You will have to adapt to a new situation. Unless of course your next lover is a boy. Then she will think you are "repaired". Aaargh! Ciao bella, e tempi migliori
With my Mom, see, it was so much more than hating gays. Over time, hopefully you will get the chance to have her open up and pick apart her brain. Like, with my Mom, when I first experimented with my friend from high school at fifteen, I came home with a hickey and she was like, "Who gave you that?!". And, when I told her it was my best female friend, she was really disgusted and ashamed. But, then, after, I realized things that were going on or had gone on in her life. Like her relationship with my Dad was on the rocks at that time, so she kind of grew to resent him and in turn resented me, since I was part of him. Then, years later, when I lost my virginity to a guy, she told me how she had been raped her first time. Maybe, your Mom is saying all this, not because she means it, but maybe to test whether you're actually serious about being gay? Like she is concerned in a weird way, but if you stop seeing your girlfriend if she stops paying for school, then, she has nothing to deal with. But, if you don't, then, she realizes she really does have something to digest and learn to deal with. But, she wants to make sure, before she really takes it seriously and starts considering your feelings. Right now she's just scared and shocked? Hard to say... Maybe it even comes from a place of past experience, the fear? I've heard that, too, in Italy that women seeing women is very common. Maybe she was the same at your age, and her mother had a similar reaction to her, and she changed according to her mother's standards but it hurt her, so now she's hurting you. Anyway, my Mom came around like ten years later. I had a girlfriend at our place for dinner, and then we had an air mattress in the middle of the living room when she came home from work, and she was trying to make excuses for us, my girlfriend, "We were just watching a movie". And my Mom was like, "Yeah, sure", lol! She also told me once that, in the beginning, she hoped I wasn't gay, for the simple reason that gays seem to have it harder in society and she wanted me to have a good life. I'm a mother, as well(and father, I guess, lol!) I say, if she knew you were in trouble, like you didn't have a place to live or were starving, she wouldn't actually let that happen. What you say when you're upset and what you actually do are two separate things. An example, my Mom was mad when she was cooking one day, because, as she puts it, I was telling her how to cook, and so she threw a can of mushrooms at me and went out to eat with my Dad instead, and left me to clean up the mushrooms! She said I better not be at home when she returned. And I asked my boyfriend to book the flight immediately, because I couldn't take the abuse anymore. But, once everyone calmed down, everyone changed their minds.
Oh, and I forgot to add, you could bring up the fact that, there are still girls that are completely straight out there, so if you were, why would you have sex with a girl just to have sex/because you couldn't find a boyfriend, if you weren't sexually attracted to her in the least? What could you possibly get out of doing that, besides some sort of reputation that you wouldn't want if you were straight? But it doesn't sound to me like she doesn't believe you. It sounds like she's in denial right now. And, maybe, one of her hopes in life was to have a grandchild that was her's by blood, and she doesn't believe in adoption for one reason or another, so that's one of the main reasons for being upset and in denial?
It sounds like she's going through different stages of grief, but at the same time she's struggling with how to think of you in terms of her strong homophobic beliefs (being lgbt is corrupting on some fundamental level) and in terms of being duped and redeemable. I wouldn't engage with her. I think your actions could show her over time (especially once she gets over a lot of the shock) that you are the same person, and being bi is just once part of who you are, not some all consuming corrupting force. She hasn't seen lgbt as normal people with normal human relationships until now. Nothing has changed with you, you are still you. Once she is given time she may come to the realization that you are the same person. I would not engage her, and if she engages you and does not listen to your explanations, then I think you should try to leave the conversation. It's maybe not necessarily that she's unable to really listen, but that her views of lgbt people are soooo off mark your explanations are really complicating her world view and endangering her belief system. I'm really sorry and frustrated for you this sounds extremely stressful. None of this is your fault!
Hey, firstly I'd like to thank you all again for your support (I discovered this place is actually great) and even if you can't offer me 'material help' as you say beenthrdonetht, it really means a lot to me that you just bother answering me. I'm starting to understand that if I keep talking about all this, with people reassuring me and listening to me, it just gets better. So, that's my advice for every troubled person out there, talk about it, 'cause if you don't, you risk becoming depressed, as I know from direct experience, and then it's really difficult to get out, or see things with the right perspective (*hug*) I keep posting 'cause I thought you deserve updates now :lol: anyway... let's start with what I learnt from your answers. I actually am thinking that that may be right, even though it doesn't justify her disgust and the insults... What makes me mad, though, and I told her, is that if I don't leave my gf, I have to deal with all this, and if I do, I just prove her right about the fact that I'm just doing this for the hell of it. Which, as you say, is nonsense, as gay people have such a difficult path ahead of them! But, extraordinairily, she thinks exactly the opposite. I have been bullied when I was younger, 'cause I was and somehow still am really shy, and nerdy. She thinks that I use the gay thing as a shield, 'cause she says gays are protected, that bullies stay away from them, expecially straight guys, 'cause lesbians disgusts them... Well. I saw some bullies and jerks around here. They don't stop in front of anything, they use any point of weakness, even a handicap. As for gays... once in a while you hear the news here about some gay boy who committed suicide because of the bullies... I don't think we're less vulnerable. My gf and I have been harrassed more than once by stranger men who went pervy about us holding hands, even though she wouldn't believe me. Choosing to be free in this sense is not always the easiest choice... So why should I do all this plus fighting her just for the sex? Wouldn't it be easier just to be with a boy? But as you say, she's in denial. She did some things when she was my age. She kissed and made out with some of her female friends just to laugh. And that gets on my nerves, 'cause it's exactly the reason why she calls me names. Except for the fact, obviously, that I am not doing it just to fool around. I recently discovered she blocked me again (as she did initially) on whatsapp, only to remove the block some hour after I saw it and post a phrase against me, which translated sounds about like 'life can sometimes be too cruel. Feelings change, and people. The things you discover by chance hurt more than those you expected'. I mean... why does she have to act like a 14 years old about this? This is serious, for me... why can't we normally talk? Why can't she say to me what hurts her, instead of telling me she feels like vomiting when she thinks of me, so that we can work through it together? And what did she expect of me? How can her feelings about me be changed, I am her daughter! Believe me, I tried saing ALL of these things to her, she just wouldn't answer or change the subject. It's been a while now, I wish she starts settling down a little bit, as you say... But, one week she doesn't talk to me, the next one is perfectly fine and normal, and the next one again she stops considering me alive at all. She told me I'm dead to her, and that she doesn't want to hear from me anymore, ever, even though she would have never imagined to say these things... I know things aren't gonna be the same again, unfortunately... I'm not even sure, to be honest, if I want them to... I'm trying to give her time, and act normally. I agree with you rainyday. She may be scared, she doesn't know much, or even the right things about lgbt. I would love to tell her anyway. I think she lacks some perspective. She has been talking, from what I may reckon, just with people who have the exact same vision as she has, and refuses to listen, or can't understand, a different opinion. And I'm not talking only about me. She could read arcticles, write in forums for other parents' opinion, or simply ask my girlfriend, my friends, my girlfriend's mum, a thing that she threatens but never does, even though I wish she would. I mean, they practically live next door, what does she fear? She keeps asking as a provocation if her parents knows about us, and I say yes they do, 'cause it's true. I spoke to them, so I got also the 'parents' perspective... her mother has been clear to me. It was hard on her. But she accepted her daughter choices, or better feelings, as long as she doesn't stay with someone who hurts her, and puts University and career before everything. Which makes sense even for a straight daughter. She told me to give my mother some time to settle down, but she was really surprised about her latest behaviour. She works with troubled families so she knows what she says, and she told me to try and get some support by some association in case things get worse... 'cause my mother suffered from a severe depression some years ago and sometimes she still acts a little bit crazy, you know, you never know how she's gonna react, maybe one day she is normally talking and joking with you, and the next is insulting you... Whether she is influenced by other problems of hers, I wouldn't know for sure, it may be, and I could be some kind of a scapegoat. Yeah. It is stressful. But I also discovered I have so many people willing to help me, or even just listen to me... it really moved me. And that's a good thing... even though she said to me that strangers don't say anything to me 'cause they don't really care about me. Maybe it's also a little about the fact that she's jealous... that I am somehow chosing my girlfriend over her? Except I'm not: I'm choosing myself, my freedom, my feelings, my life, which is definitely worth fighting for and guys I really hope things work out somehow for me, so that this tread can be a support for other people in my situation
Hiya I'm really sorry to hear about what you're going through. I feel like your mother doesn't understand that this is just a part of who you are. Maybe you should take a break or something away from your home. It doesn't have to be like get out of the country. Just take some nice quiet walks. I'm sorry I don't really know what to say about this situation. ^^' When I was questioning my gender identity and when I thought I was trans, my dad thought that going for a short haircut would make it hard for any guy to date me because I guess he thinks I look like a "stereotypical lesbian" He thought that it'd be better if I just date girls because they aren't gonna be like guys and I'm like excuse me I'll date whoever I want regardless. Of course after questioning I realized that I was just a cisfemale but of course the only thing that stayed the same which is my orientation.
Hi! I'm not in the exact same situation, but I've read your story and I'd like to share my experience with my mother with you. My mother is a very sensitive person, but also very judgemental. I love her very much and I've accepted her being like this. She had a very bad childhood and has a terrible relationship with her mother. I'm quite sure that my grandmother is a narcissistic sociopath, she's manipulative and quite a good actress when it comes to influence people the way she wants. I don't think she has conscience really. My mother grew up and swore not to be someone like my grandmother ever. She's not, but she's very protective of our family and is codependant. She has this irrational fear towards anything that might differ from the accepted norms of society (she fears what other might think), and she's also kind of a martyr. She's able to throw a tantrum when she fears something and when she doesn't like what I'm doing. She tries to manipulate me sometimes to feel bad about what I'm about to do. She says that I don't think about how bad it is what I'm doing to her. She states things about me (to me) that are not even true. And newly she used my past mistakes just a few days ago to make me feel bad. In my opinion the truth is that she feels very alone, and thinks that if I leave the family (like move out), I'm going to leave forever. She has these irrational fears. I wasn't the best teenager and my relationship was not the best with my mother at that time to say the least, but I've changed since then, and repaired my relationship with her. A few days ago she tried to point out if I'm acting like the way I'm acting, I'm going to abandon her. She also tried to state that I was in a bad mood when I wasn't (I was just being honest and she didn't like it). I guess she tried to understand in her way what's happening to me right now. I'm trying to make healthy boundaries in my life, because I don't feel too good being at home, and am planning to move out (what my mother doesn't know yet). I had a lot of talks with her in the past half year and I've become kind of a personal therapist to her, which is not healthy, because all my days were about listening to her problems and complainings, which resulted in her feeling better and me becoming emotionally drained out and ending up with zero energy to concentrate on my life. I learned a lot of sad things about her life, but I also realised that she won't feel better if she doesn't want to face her real problems and try to solve them. I don't think I'm the problem here, but she should have some very serious talks with her mother or she should try to move on at least, which is also extremely hard. I believe that when mothers act like this, the real problem is something that is out of our (the daughters) reach. In your case I don't think that the problem is you and your girlfriend and I'm very sorry that your mother puts you through this, it must be extremely hard. I hope this helps somehow, I know it's not the same situation, but there might be some kind of analogy regarding the troubled childhood or the irrational fears and bad behaviour. What I'd like to stress here is that it is very important that we shouldn't become codependant as well, and there are things that are just beyond us. Maybe you should use one of these comebacks when your mother tries to judge you: - I'm sorry that you have this wrong perception of me. or - I'm sorry that you have this opinion, though you have every right to have it, so have I. I love you regardless of our differences. Please, let's talk about this again when you've calmed down. I really hope this helps a little. Saluti
Hello SkyAbove, actually I think there are some similarities between your mum's background and mine's. I don't know how much her childhood can influence her right now, but she sure didn't have an easy life. My grandfather was an alcoholic, he used to beat my grandmother and even though he never really hurt his children, they saw him doing scary things when drunk. He died when she was 13. My grandma find a new fiancé a couple of years later, and abandoned her children for a period to elope with him. She doesn't have the best of relationships with her mother, and same as yours she doesn't want to be like her, even though right now it kinda feels like she is. My grandma was a terrible grandma to me, and she tends to judge a lot and always put the accent on your mistakes, forgetting her own. Plus, she is really mentally closed about sexuality (as my mom is being right now) and tend to picture it as a disgustig thing. My mother was quite a teenager: she did all the things I never did, until at only 17 years old she finally found my dad, whom my grandma didn't approve. They moved together 2-3 months after they met so that they would somehow 'escape' her. As I said, I'm not a psychologist, of course there may be a connection... Yes, she tries to make me feel guilty too, and yes, she used to confide in me too and that's why I know so much about her. On one hand, it's good that she told me about her experiences as we bonded and she helped me not to make dangerous mistakes when I was a teenager (not so long ago but anyway ), on the other hand I always had to hear, for, like, 16 years, her complaining about my dad and making plans to leave him. That, luckily, never occoured, as I think they love each other and yes, I admit that, like pointed out before, she is that kind of person that gives ultimatum without respecting them (and I hope that's my case), but still, for a kid it's not healthy to hear such things, in my opinion. I often felt like I was the adult. I'm also the eldest daughter, so I can perfectly understand all of this can be all new to her. She probably knows that I won't do like she want me to, and she feels like I'm abandoning her, too.. I don't know. I'm going back home tomorrow, I guess I will get a proper vision of how things evolved after I saw her. But anyway, that's why I'd like to talk to her... I tried the first comeback, I think I tried something alike the second the first time (I was too shocked, and right now I can't remember) but I think I'll give it a shot again when we both are calm and relaxed. Mao, hell yeah we'll date whoever we want Thanks, a million times, again
I belive childhood has much to do with who you might become in later life. I'm not a psychologyst either, though. This might be weird but I guess it's similar to that when someone dies suddenly but they have unfinished business, so they can't move on and are stuck here as ghosts. Memories can't leave them alone, but they feel too weak to solve the problem. I didn't say in the former post, but my grandfather was an alcoholic too. I don't know if he abused my mother or not, but their home wasn't happy or calm. He was a short tempered man. And on the other hand my grandmother did abuse her emotionally. My mother married my father at 19 years old, who is a really nice person and a strong figure in the family, and I think they love each other too. I don't think that our mothers did the right thing when they told us about what happened to them in such a detail. We can't solve their problems unfortunately, and we are their daughters even if we are adults now. During these talks I felt too that I was being the adult, and she was being that little hurt girl, who is still afraid and is looking for guidance. I wish I could help her, but not even these talks let her wounds heal, on the contrary... I think time will tell your mother, that you're not going to leave her, and you're not turning into anything bad. If you're being kind to her and loving, then she can calm down and she'll might be at peace with the idea of you having a girlfriend. Maybe she needs reassurance and is just as freaked out as you must've been when she found out what's going on. But if she sees that you are determined and confident about this, and still there to her as well (but boundaries are essential as I had to realise too), she should come around. I hope today goes well to you, and you can make progress with her. Be strong
Hey, so I actually waited a little for the situation to change at least slightly but it didn't, or maybe grew even worst. These weeks I found out that my mother put in a closet all of my postcards which I had glued to my wardrobe (some of them were mine, others sent by friends), two boxes of small bottles of perfume I bought as a gift in France and were exposed in her bedroom, the hand-made stuffed cat she made for me when I was 3, and an ornament I made for her in kindergarden, whit the shape of my hand on it. I heard her crying on the phone but she doesn't let any openings for me to talk to her. Seems like she's hiding all the objects that remember her I'm her daughter... the only ones that are still in their place are my degrees on the kitchen wall. This is really hard, guys, the more it goes on the more I feel the desire to escape in any way possible. I know this hasn't gone on for a long time or anything but I think I'm going depressed again, and that's no good sign... P.S. I really think this should be moved to the Family and relationship section but I don't really know how to do it or to contact someone who can do it
