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Help. I'm way back here, behind the rain coats.

Discussion in 'Coming Out Advice' started by Bame, Mar 31, 2010.

  1. Bame

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    Hello Readers,

    I come to you a confused 28 year old looking for feedback. I’ve never discussed before what I’m about to write here with anyone. I’m not even comfortable thinking these thoughts, honestly. Tonight, for some reason I’ve mustered up the courage to at least anonymously post some feelings I’m having in hopes of getting some support. Empty Closets seems like a good place to do it.

    Throughout my life, I’ve had several influences putting negative connotations on homosexuality (as I’m sure you all have). From childhood teasing (due to me being a successful child model), to my father’s poor reaction to my aunt coming out, to my best friends homophobia, it seems I can’t escape it.

    People have mistaken me as being gay almost my entire life. Maybe it had something to do with my gentle nature, or the way I dressed, or my mannerisms. I never quite figured it out. I’ve also fought this label by attempting to act more masculine. I shaved my head, grew out a goatee. The way I dress, the way I walk, the way I talk now has all been influenced by me trying to avoid that stereotype. It’s sad really.

    Now looking back, it may have also had something to do with the fact that I’ve always fought for equality. I befriended most of the gays that were “out” in high school. One of my best friends to this day is one of them. On several occasions, I would find myself standing up for them in confrontations when they didn’t have the strength to stand up for themselves. Today, I think perhaps I was standing up for something inside myself as well.

    Now that I’m 28, I’m becoming more open to the idea that I’m not entirely straight. Up until this point, I’ve only ever had relationships with women. I’ve only ever watched straight porn, and honestly the idea of butt sex with a guy disgusts me. Though, deep down, something inside of me really wants to be close to a man. I have reoccurring dreams where I’m in a relationship with a man, and I’m at ease/happy/content. Something about understanding the male psyche better than a females is really appealing, and maybe that’s where that sense of ease comes from. Though there’s also the curiosity of what it would be like to pleasure a man sexually and vise versa.

    I just moved to a new area, and no one knows me here. I feel like this is my chance to spread my wings a little. My biggest fear is not only discrimination, but that I may also be labelled in my new town before I really know what I’m getting myself into. I don’t know where or how to explore these feelings. All I can think of is craigslist, but all of the personals found there seem to be much too fast paced/dirty. I really don’t know how to proceed. All I know is that I’m almost 30, and I think I’m just now beginning to be honest with myself. I don’t want to waste anymore time.

    Any thoughts are much appreciated.
     
  2. QuilsQ

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    First of all, welcome to EC!! :slight_smile: Second, I think you are should begin the coming out process only when you feel ready to do so. Follow your feelings and instincts at all times. If something doesn't feel right, take a step back and try to explore that a little bit more. There is no rush in coming out. Take your time. Also you should try talking to a few EC members and try to get to know them.
     
  3. RaeofLite

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    Welcome to EC. :slight_smile: You came to the right place to simply be yourself and if you aren't sure who that is, to help you on your journey to find it.

    And believe it or not, there was a point when I couldn't watch two woman kiss (like on The Lword). Not because it was disgusting, infact it was often beautiful but because of how it made me feel... and I was terrified of that and what it meant for my future. I've since squashed my internal homophobia to almost nothing but it's taken time.

    But you're welcome here. Feel free to message me any time. :slight_smile:
     
  4. Mirko

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    Hi there, and welcome to Empty Closets! I'm glad you have joined and have started to talk about your sexual identity. Acknowledging that you have conflicting feelings is already a big step towards self-acceptance. What you have accomplished tonight is already huge. That is something to be proud off. (*hug*)

    As you know, parents' reactions to coming outs in the family or even in the wider society often times are based on their own fears, misunderstanding of what it means to be LGBT, their personal views, cultural influences as well as wider societal influences. Similarly when it comes to homophobia among friends. While this is the case, a lot of parents, and friends do change however. Yes, sometimes it can take a while before they fully come to understand what it means and realize that their lives aren't affected by someone coming out or saying "I am gay." Education and patience are key.

    It is quite normal to try to conform to societies' standards, and I certainly have done that until realizing that wait a second, this is not who I am, and I need to change that. Changing that and saying that 'I really need to bring down the wall that I built around me,' can actually be quite a liberating experience and it could definitely help you in figuring your sexual identity out and also in picking up on your involvement within the LGBT community, be it be fighting for equality, standing up for others, and helping others. I would agree that perhaps a part of you wanted to stand up for others because somewhere within you, you knew that you are also standing up for yourself.

    Often times our feelings are battling within us against the internal homophobia that has built up over months and years, that in some respect, we can see ourselves with a man, but certain sexual acts go against these feelings. That said, we are all comfortable with different things or are very selective on what we find acceptable and what we don't find acceptable. It is possible that some of your ideas or repulsions will fade after you have overcome some of your internal homophobia. At the same time you might still feel the same way about certain things, but that's okay!

    In figuring out your sexual identity, you already have a number of important clues. You want to be close to a man, perhaps you see yourself in a relationship with a man, and it makes you feel right. These are clues worth exploring and trying to understand deeper. As you know, we can have different levels of physical and emotional attractions to both males and females. And that is something that is worth exploring as well.

    Having the connections and having friends who are LGBT is actually really good and fantastic, and it can be a tremendous help when you feel that you are ready to embark on your coming out journey. You have a best friend, to whom you can relate and who can relate to you. Once you are ready, talk to your best friend.

    In exploring your feelings and trying to understand your sexual identity, try to talk to people. Try to start building a support network. I think being in a new area will perhaps give you a bit of a 'secure' feeling in that you can safely go to LGBT friendly places without having the fear of bumping into someone that you might know.

    A good way to start in exploring your sexual identity more and also in becoming comfortable with the gay scene is perhaps by trying to join a LGBT support group or a PFLAG chapter in your area. Perhaps try to do some searches online and see if you can find a support group that is a safe place, that respects confidentiality and also offers some regular social events that will allow you to get to know people, and perhaps start creating a support network on which you can rely on and draw support on if and when you need it.

    Hope this helps a bit!

    P.s. never worry about taking up time. This is what EC is here for.
     
  5. Bame

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    I’m already glad that I decided to post tonight. Thanks to those that replied already. I feel better just putting what I did into words, and the warm responses just reinforce my initial impression that there is a really good community here at EC.

    Mirko, thank you especially for taking the time to write out as much as you did. I welled up a little while reading your post for some reason. Perhaps because I didn’t expect someone to understand so well what I’m embarking upon. It feels good..

    I think I will take your advice and try to find a LGBT support group in my area. I can already tell that’s going to be a better option than trying to jump into craigslist personals.

    More later. (for now I'm just going to ponder on what was said)
     
  6. Chip

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    Hi, Bame, welcome to EC, and congratulations on having the courage to take these first steps for yourself.

    Mirko's already given some great advice. All of the messages we get -- and not just from parents who may be less than enlightened on homosexuality -- tend to reinforce the notion that there's something wrong with being gay. And when we hear that message enough, it can really, deeply implant the idea that it would be So Awful To Be Gay that our unconscious does our best to "protect us" from the truth... whether that truth is that we are gay, or somewhere on the continuum between straight and gay.

    Another element that plays into being authentic with ourselves is how our psyche handles information that doesn't fit into our schema, or model, of who we are. When we start to get information (in this case, to think about, and process feelings) that conflicts with what we've known, or thought we've known, about ourselves, there's a natural rejection, or denial that we go through; the new information doesn't seem to match the old, so it's easier to throw it away with denial than to readjust our view of ourselves to accommodate the new knowledge.

    And in a way, accepting oneself as gay (or otherwise, as not straight) means, in a way, accepting a loss... the loss of our "straight" identity, and all that we perceive comes with that "normalcy." So again, our psyche has a way of processing this loss in stages to make it easier for us to accept and accommodate it. The stages of loss are denial-anger-bargaining-grief-acceptance. Denial is self-explanatory; anger can be "why am I stuck with this BS" or "why did God do this to me" or "wtf is wrong with me" or something else. Bargaining is often "Well, i'll be gay now, but I'll end up with a girl later in life" or "well, maybe I'm only bi" or "Maybe when I find the right girl I'll feel the connection" or something like that; it serves as a bridge to accepting our "new" self. Then grief is essentially mourning the loss of the "old" self, which gives way to acceptance of who we are.

    Not everyone goes through all the stages in the same way, and not always consecutively; sometimes we move back and forth between diffferent stages. But understanding how that all works often makes it easier.

    I can't more emphatically say that Craigslist is a really bad idea; ditto any of the other hookup sites. If you're just processing your feelings, the last thing you need is to be having random hookups, and probably with people who are, more often than not, less than emotionally healthy.

    So checking out the gay-lesbian center or other resources in your area is a great start. Finding friends on Myspace (yes, it's out of date, but people still use it, and it's easier to find friends on Myspace than it is on Facebook) who share your interests and hobbies, but happen to be gay or bi is another good start.

    Another suggestion I'd make is... take your time. Explore and just see how you feel. There's no timetable in which you have to do this, and no particular conclusion you have to come to; just arrive at what feels right for you.

    And the last suggestion I'd make is to get a copy of a truly amazing book, deceptively named "10 Smart Things Gay Men Can Do to Find Real Love", by Joe Kort. Rather than being about relationships, it is much more about our journey as men to accept ourselves; the issues of internalized homophobia and how it affects us, the difficulty with connecting to others because of that, and how we can understand and change.

    Please stick around here, post anywhere you feel inclined to do so, ask any questions you want (there are no dumb ones) and enjoy the community. There are a lot of amazing people here and I think you'll find it a great resource for support.

    Also, feel free to PM me or any of the staff if you'd like to talk to someone individually and just discuss what's going on for you.

    And please keep us updated! :slight_smile:
     
  7. adam88

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    Hi and welcome to EC. :smilewave

    Last November I was exactly where you were. I'm nearly your age and it took me this long to work out that I'm not totally straight as well, so don't fear, you're not alone. I know where you're coming from with the whole internal homophobia thing. I never once thought that I could be "one of them". "They" were gay. Society teaches that gay=bad.

    On reason I think that it took me so long is that bisexuality is not very commonly discussed, at least as far as guys are concerned. Thus, I'd compare myself to the coming out stories of gay guys and find absolutely no connection. Therefore I was straight, as there are only two sexual orientations. :dry:

    In any case, I got better. It helps that my first thought upon figuring this out was "well, that answers a lot of questions". :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:
     
  8. Bame

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    @ Chip:

    Thanks for the awesome post. I appreciate the book recommendation and how you broke down the stages for me. It makes sense.. the stages that is. I’m fairly certain I’m still dealing with the denial stage, so I guess I have a ways to go.

    When explaining the bargaining step, you used the example “Maybe I’m only bi”. Is bisexuality only a phase? A transition from straight to gay? This is the most confusing thing to me, for I’ve always been into woman, and still am. I get aroused more easily at the thought of a woman naked than I do a man. I watch straight porn, and naturally focus on the female. With men, I’m more mentally attracted to them, verses sexually. I feel that I could be happier in a long term partnership with a man, because I understand them better. I will admit though, there’s a small curiosity inside me that gets me turned on at the thought of experimenting with a man (a very specific type of man).

    @ Adam88:

    I’m glad I’m not alone. Thanks for posting a little of your story..

    So, you’re bisexual? Does this mean you peruse both sexes? In an ideal world, I would love to do this, comfortably and confidently.. but I don’t think it can work that way. I once watched an episode of Sex and the City where Carrie dated a bisexual guy, and it didn’t work out because she couldn’t accept him. That scene has always kind of stuck with me, that one can’t teeter in the middle. I’d love to hear more about what it's like being bisexual, if you wouldn't mind sharing.
     
  9. adam88

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    I'm at work now so can't say much but I'll give you a more thorough answer when I get home. I'd say "feel free to PM me" but I don't think you can with your post count.

    Short answer: Bi does not equal "want to have sex with everything". Sex and the City isn't exactly accurate in its portrayal of romance, either.

    Also, I don't "teeter in the middle", I "overlook everything". :wink:
     
  10. RaeofLite

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    :grin:

    You should like one of my guy friends who's bisexual. The "smooth operator".. :lol: :slight_smile:
     
  11. adam88

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    :grin: I may not ooze confidence all the time but once in a while I'll surprise people. :slight_smile:
     
  12. adam88

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    Okay! I'm back!

    Don't be so quick to label yourself (ie. be open!), but you're sounding a lot like me. I too find women sexier in general. With guys, it was only mental/romantic association at first, then I started seeing what turned me on...

    Now I see cute guys all the time. :grin:

    You're welcome. :slight_smile:

    Yes. I ruled out gay years ago, and straight last November. I've put a lot of thought into it and bi is the only thing that fit.

    Peruse? As in look at? Yup. :grin: As in date, simultaneously? No way. Some bisexuals are into polyamory (mutual carrying on of multiple sexual/romantic relationships, some do one of each sex, others don't care), those tend to be the most visible and stereotyped.

    And as I said before, I don't teeter. :grin: I stand strong, knowing this nice, well-built fence will hold me above everyone's heads.

    As I said, I didn't even come out to myself before last November so I don't really have much experience with it. I'd be happy to try to answer any questions you have, however. :slight_smile:
     
  13. Bame

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    Oops, Peruse was a typo. I meant to say Pursue.

    I'm all about monogamy in relationships.

    I'm wondering if one could really be successful tapping into both markets when dating though. Do you think straight women and gay men could really be comfortable with the fact that you've dated both sexes, and that you're still interested in both?

    I for one in certain relationships have become jealous in the past. For example, if my girlfriend has other guy friends, some of which are attractive and may not respect our relationship, it makes me weary. In most relationships I've been in, to set my partners mind at ease, I make sure not to be too close to any other female friends. But in a situation where both sexes are appealing, what is one supposed to do? I just see it causing a lot of issues. (thus the Sex and the City episode)

    Have you encountered any problems, switching back and forth, dating both sexes?
     
  14. adam88

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    Heh. My dating life has been, say, spartan. :icon_sad: The future's looking up, though! Also, the way I look at it if the other person has issues with bisexuality, that's their issues and not yours. All you can do is educate them and try to set a good example.

    Oh, how much easier dating would be if everyone was bi.
     
  15. kw12

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    I can't say I have much to add to this thread - but I really appreciated the thread title (both for the accuracy and the hilarity).

    My story is that I'm completely aware of my sexuality and am capable of thinking about it, but never talking about it or acting on it. I'm currently in therapy to work through this process (I go to therapy under the guise of career-counseling), but thought I'd look for different sources of help/support as well.

    In the sense that change is difficult, I'm comfortable with not acting, that seems to be the easiest route. However, I'm not content. Among other things I'm trying to find the catalyst to start this process moving.

    And, to you, Bame, good luck!
     
  16. malachite

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    First thing: Its NOT sad that you wanted to change how you look because people treated you in a way that you didn’t like, it IS sad that you were treated poorly.
    I can relate your situation I was 28 when I finally came out, after years of hiding and feeling ashamed and being scared shitless. I had only had sex with women at that point in my life too and watched straight porn and butt sex still makes me squeamish, and I know I’m not the only here either.
    When you were surrounded by people who shined a negative light on gays, its not wonder you retreated further into the closet, anyone would, so don’t beat yourself up over it.
    I can also relate to the fact that you think you’ve wasted time, I felt the same way. The only regret I have about coming out is that I didn’t do it sooner; however, there is not a time clock on these things, though we seem to be hard wired to think we have. Don’t rush yourself on this, take time to accept your gayness, you don’t want to rush into anything and end up getting hurt.
    If you don’t want to be a labeled or a stereotype then don’t be one, just be you, and if someone labels you as the gay guy then tell them back the hell off.

    Anywhoooo those are my thoughts do with them what you will.

    Good luck out there:thumbsup: