What is the closet, really?

You, for the record, are completely right. If someone asks and you tell them your straight I guess then you'd be in the closet but that isn't happening from what you've said so I don't see how you're in the closet at all. I completely understand. I don't think people would know I was gay if my friends didn't like to tell people so much and it is really annoying. It shouldn't be something that people NEED to know. It is ridiculous. It shouldn't matter at all but some people are just stupid butt heads.

 

I know what you mean, I'm about as out as they come, it's only people who i don't talk to that don't know cause there's never been any cause for it's discusion. Then when they realise cause we're talking about relationships or something I feel that moment where they sort of look at me differently for a sec then we continue. I've had no need to tell these people cause I only infrequently (when i turn up to lectures) talk to them and I'm completely open about it so them not knowing doesn't put me in the closet to them.
I've completely finished coming out, hence why I don't feel the need to go out of my way to tell people, it's just me, but will I always have a toe in the closet when I meet someone new?

 

My general definition of "out" is:

1. those closest to you know.
2. you don't care who else knows.

It's that second bit that can be squirrelly. I have no idea if my mailman knows, or my brother's best friend, or anybody in the peripheries of my life. But the point isn't that they know or that they don't know - it's that I don't care if they know.

Mind you, if I consider anyone my "friend" (on any level beyond "facebook"), I assume they know. If they don't, they obviously don't know me very well.

Lex

 

I TOTALLY AGREE! I hate that gay people have to come out of the closet but straight people don't. It's unfair in my view. But to answer what seems to be the overall question...

The closet is a drak place that is next-to impossible to escape without a network of support like friends, family, or a place like EC.

(!) (!) (!) (!) (!) (!) (!) (!) (!) (!)

 

bironey, I'm with you (and everyone else who has posted on this thread). You know you are *in* the closet when you take steps of any kind of conceal who you are...including passive steps, like mentioning opposite-sex significant others, but (whoops!) failing to mention same-sex significant others. But there is no reason whatsoever that you or anyone should have to announce your sexuality to anyone. As you say, nobody goes around yelling their straightness, so there is no need to yell your bisexuality. As long as you aren't hiding it, and are at peace with how you are expressing it, you aren't closeted...if at some point you find yourself holding back information (even for good safety-related reasons) that might help another figure out that you aren't straight, then you might feel closet walls begin to surround you.

Do realize too, though, that there should be no particular shame attached to being in the closet...it's a valid choice that some make that works for them for a period of time. But it tends to get uncomfortable in there eventually, and the air is a bit fresher out here.

 

I can't stand straight people making comments about this kind of thing. As though they have a solid understanding of what it is like to struggle through the closet syndrome.

I call this indulging in self-flattery.

I read a great article recently about why gay/bi men ought to avoid becoming an accessory for straight girls. It talked about how Sex in the City essentially reduced us to the "dog-in-the-handbag". A status symbol and fashion accessory.

If they hint at that, tell them to get over themselves. Just because you are gay/bi doesn't mean that they are all of the sudden attractive.

I agree, I think that it is smart to avoid using the attraction to say females as "proof" that there is no attraction to males, or vis versa. All that attraction proves is that there is attraction.

I agree with what everyone else has said: a) not going out of your way to hide, lie, or omit anything about gayness, should it come up. b) taking opportunities to make sure important people (to you) understand who you are. I think that these are also signs of self-acceptance, and as you approach a more genuine self-acceptance, you will notice yourself doing these things more naturally.

Not everyone needs to know. Especially when you are in the self-acceptance stage of coming out. In my experience it makes more sense to become comfortable with your sexuality before announcing it to others. If you do no feel comfortable telling someone, don't ever feel the pressure to tell them. Come out and come to terms at your own pace.

 

Just because you choose not to shout your relationship to the heavens doesn't put you in the closet at all. You go by "don't ask don't tell" kind of policy and I like that.

 

So true!
I'm always thinking: "Don't be telling me how to do these things... It's not like you have any idea". Sorry, but with straight people... well, overall I don't think they have any wisdom to give me on that regard. So I don't take their advice.
Those "I'll be there for you" friends that want you to divulge of your life history to them, so they can psycho-analize you and tell you how much they love you "DESPITE" you being gay (your big time flaw), well... it seems to me they need to feel they're being trusted with this kind of information and that they'd be doing you a service. It makes them feel good about themselves.
Puh-lease... Get off your fucking cloud.

Also, I agree with the thread.
I have absolutely NO obligation to come out to anyone.
I don't think my sexual orientation status is anyone's problem but my own.

I wear the rainbow bracelet, I make "that girl is kind of cute/hawt" comments from time to time and I correct people when they say "your boyfriend _____" ("You mean 'girlfriend'").
I don't think I need to introduce myself to new people/long lost acquintances: "I'm a lesbian and my name is Malola". It's not like being a lesbian is my "title".

 

i can understand this almost completely. although i guess i wouldnt be considered completely out as i havent told my parents but im open to anyone who asks, but i dont go out of my way to make it known. just feels like people would assume that im going too far out of the way to make a point of it. especially since i have no segways as i never really notice peoples attractivness to be commented on or anything comparable. as what was said people dont go around going "hey im kevin, im straight" so why should anyone expect different from anyone else of any other orientation.

 

Jsyt tell your 'best friend'

 

I feel the exact same way. I believe society sometimes preassures us to do things we don't want. We should just ignore societal values and just be true to ourselves. If what you are doing feels right to you, then there is no reason why you should go and announce to the world your sexuality.

 

Wow, a lot of interesting points made on this thread.
I remember that when I was only dating the opposite sex I never once had to announce that choice to anyone.
As for being in the closet--there are many different reasons some of us may need to make that choice, and not all of them stem from internal homophobia. Simple economic reality does play a strong role these days. Good jobs are hard to come by, especially for older people who have made a career change later in life. If there is a very strong chance you will lose your job by coming out, and you need that job to pay for housing, and plan for retirement, unless someone is willing to hand you a greasy wad of cash, it seems unfair for them to judge why you may have to stay in the closet.
That said, being in the closet is/can be uncomfortable for many reasons, not least of which is the judgements of others about why you refuse to "swell the gay ranks".
If I won two million dollars in a lottery tomorrow--I'd make a different choice.

 

I still live in the closet, but the door is not locked. You can come closer and, if I don't have any reason to fear you, I'll let you open the door by yourself. Otherwise I'll struggle from the inside to not let you see anything you don't deserve to.

 

I'm definitely not an expert on the definition of being closeted....except to say that I definitely am! But I'm still getting comfortable with my sexuality so I'm not ready to talk about it with anyone else yet. I just wanted to echo that frustration about having to come out....when I believed I was straight, no one expected me to announce it. I didn't expect that of myself either...now I find myself wondering and pressuring myself to make a decision or step toward it. I also get what you mean about being known by just a label and what straight people are thinking. Because all my friends/family have always believed I'm straight, I know what they say about gay/bi people. They do say, "That one lesbian chick," as if someone's sexuality defines them. No one ever thinks about heterosexuality as a label. I've had friends tell me they feel uncomfortable around people of the same sex who are gay or act differently around them because they "don't want to send the wrong signals." As if a gay person is automatically attracted to EVERY member of the same sex. So frustrating to hear these things! It doesn't sound as if you're in the closet at all. And, in my opinion, everyone has to define what in/out of the closet means for them personally. Some people like to announce it, while others are open to talking about it but are more subtle. I think it just depends on personality in general.

 

The closet is a concept I fail at. Miserably. :lol:

 

Closets are these extremely tiny little rooms that people put coats and clothes in. Unless you are a little kid playing hide and seek, it's rather uncomfy keeping yourself in there.

 

I never understood how bisexual people can even be in the closet.

You aren't lying by saying you are straight, because you are straight, you are also gay. Being straight by definition is holding attraction to the opposite sex, which you do. So you are straight.

What you are in the closet about is the gay side of you, and I really don't consider you in the closet based off what you have said. You seem pretty open. Your friends sister is just a bitch, but I don't think you need anyone to tell you that.

I don't think it is necessary for you to tell everyone either, there is no need to announce it. So you are absolutely right in that sense.

The closet is almost a strictly homosexual thing anyways, because it entails lying entirely about who you are, and who you are attracted to. You are only half lying, and half telling the truth when you say you are hetero; so you are in no way wrong for going about things the way you are because you shouldn't be obligated to tell people that instantly, especially when you are still being honest about a whole lot of other stuff.

The closet is being strictly to yourself and yourself only GAY. I am not even in the closet technically because my parents know, I won't tell anyone else, no way in hell, but two people on this planet know, and two those people I am not in the closet, therefore being in the closet require you to be the only person who has an affirmed idea of what your sexuality is.

You are just more or less on your way out I guess, or are just more conservative with how you view yourself, and how you view your personal life. Which is perfectly fine.

So, your friends sister was wrong, she doesn't even know what a closet it.

 

A bit off-topic, but this is simply not true.

Bisexuals and every other sexuality can in fact be in the closet. It is definitely not a thing that only homosexuals experience. Bisexuals aren't "half gay and half straight", they are bisexuals. If they have to lie about that single fact to anyone, then by definition they are in the closet.

Now, there are different levels of "outness" that everyone chooses to be in. Some people are completely out, some people are only out to friends and family, some people are only out to friends, and some people are out to a combination of whatever they feel comfortable with.

Also, keep in mind this thread was made a year ago