Bible's teaching on homosexuality...

I do find it unfair. To specifically target a whole sub group of human beings He himself created and test in such a way is highly unfair in my eyes. Unfortunatly I found a lot of the beliefs and "His" doings to be unfair enough to the point I lost my faith about 9 years ago (another story for a different thread).

But yes I agree that if he does accept gays to the point where they try to share themselves completely with eachother is just unfair. Human beings are sexual creatures He himself made so why disallow those he created to have sex with those He made them like?

 

Alright, let me get going here...

God didn't write the bible. We all know that men did. But of course, they had "Divine Inspiration". The Torah was written first, then when Christ died, they just looked around the village they were in and decided what they liked and didn't like, and just did an updated version of the Torah, called the bible. Muhammad did the same thing by turning the bible into the Qu'arn.

Here is my point. It's mens creation. Men created hell, Gods like a dislikes, etc. None of it is probably true. If you actually believe it what it says, you don't fit into modern society, as the book depicts life in 20 CE.

If you want to be a Christian, you do one thing - Live you life like Christ. That's the whole point. Just be an all around good, forgiving, caring person. Fuck the bible. It means about as much as a belt. Look at a pair of pants your wearing. You can take away the felt and it seems like its falling, but if you just hold it up and add a few stitches, it's still the same old pants with the stitches keeping it intact.

In other words, Christianity may seem not to work without the bible, but without it and just living your life like Christ, your a good Christian person. That's it.

(Sorry for the odd example above. I needed something. xD)

 

I personally think that a lot of what the Bible says (the sections that are exploited by people who want to force an antiquated agenda down the throats of others) is total bullshit. It wasn't written directly by God. It's impossible for all of it to be his word. The Bible was written by men. A lot of the teachings of it are based on the social norms of a society from thousands of years ago. Things have changed since then. The Bible has a good message overall. That does not, however, make up for the fact that its message has been distorted by people over the years. You don't have to believe that it says to be a good Christian. Just be a good person and love your fellow human beings. Don't hate others because a 2000-year-old book tells you so. The world changes. People need to accept this and stop treating others like shit.

 

Catholic ideas have a lot of Papal influence. There are many beliefs in the Catholic Church which have no Biblical basis and are purely built on divine inspiration~. Their stance on homosexuality is one of these beliefs.

The teachings on homosexuality in the most important parts of the Bible (~Jesus's teachings) are ambiguous at best, which is why there are plenty of Christians who are able to meet up their sexuality and their religion. There are even gay bishops in certain denominations; I'm thinking of the Presiding Bishop of the Episcopal Church—Katherine Jefferts Schori—as the best example~~.

And a huge part of most religions is that God cannot be known by humans because he's supposedly superawesome. So if someone says "God likes men who don't cut their sideburns", they're assuming that they can know God as well as describing him unnecessarily in anthropomorphic ways. And while it's true that there is a part of the Old Testament telling men not to round off their sideburns, I find it difficult to imagine that the most understanding entity would judge someone for doing something which is socially acceptable and non-harmful. Just like having a stable same-sex relationship.

 

OP, I too am Catholic, and although I've questioned my faith relentlessly over the last few years, I still have my own personal faith (albeit not exactly rock solid).

If you look into the issue, you'll find that firstly, Jesus didn't say anything directly on the matter. Now, what's always bothered me growing up, is why the Church so often bases beliefs on different aspects of the Bible when surely the most important part is the Gospels? In my mind you don't need anything else out of the Bible. Personally I've got nothing from them, I find them old fashioned and in places, very intolerant. Certainly the God in the Old Testament at times resembles a murderous dictator. Whereas the Gospels, where Jesus teaches about love, tolerance, forgiveness etc appeals to me greatly, and is the only reason I still cling onto my faith.

One of the most famous lines denouncing homosexuality in the Bible is from Leviticus:
"Man shall not lie with man as with women. It is an abomination." (Or something to that effect). What a lot of "Christians" don't use though is other, frankly ridiculous, demands from "God" in Leviticus. If I remember correctly, there are other laws such as not being allowed to eat shellfish, not being able to wear clothes made from two differing fabrics etc. Where is the Church's outrage on these issues? Why do they pick out this line as credible when a lot of others are ignored because they are, to put it mildly, stupid?

The whole point about being Christian is to try and live like Jesus. Forget what the Church says, because the Church is run by men. Personally I think that a true Christian isn't someone who blindly follows what the Church teaches, but what Jesus teaches. From the impression I've gained of Jesus, he wouldn't judge or condemn someone for loving. Maybe the reason he didn't really talk about it was because he didn't see it as a bid deal. He seemed more concerned with greed, suffering, poverty, violence etc. It would be good if the Church could do the same.

Incidentally, there is a passage from Matthew that has caused a lot of debate over what Jesus was talking about. One interpretation is that he accepts homosexuality exists, and doesn't appear to have a problem with it.

From Matthew 19:

after talking about marriage and divorce

The disciples said to him, “If this is the situation between a husband and wife, it is better not to marry.”

11Jesus replied, “Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. 12For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it.”

A eunuch is generally thought to be a castrated male, but there is debate over it's meaning here. "some are eunuchs because they were born that way". Jesus seems to be saying that not everyone can accept the usual lifestyle of marriage, that there are those who will not follow this path. He mentions those who cannot for religious reasons, and those perhaps for physical reasons. But he also mentions people who were "born that way". Just a thought.

Overall though, faith is a personal thing. Don't feel that you need to appease the church's teachings. If you feel comfortable inside then don't let the bigotry and prejudice trouble you. That is, after all, what Jesus opposed.

 

I find it helpful to think of the world view at the time the bible was written.

When Paul was writing on issues of sex and sexuality with regard to the Romans, he was writing in a world where the idea that people were inately homosexual was unheard of. People who did engage in homosexual behaviour did so out of lust, not because that was there sexual orientation. They slept with their male slaves when their wives were unavailable, for example. So, the passage could be read as do not have sex just out of lust, but only do so out of love - for giving in to lust is a sin.

Yes, some of the teachings of the bible are hard to square with homosexuality. In those years there really was a focus on building a population, and homosexuality would be contrary to those goals.

As has been said before, Christ's most important message was that we love one another - those who hate in the name of Christianity aren't Christian, and they do not follow his teachings.

I've just returned from a trip to Israel, and had the occassion to visit the Holy City and the places where Christ walked. The examples of his teachings are clear - love thy neighbour, be generous unto others, don't seek malice of revenge, help the less fortunate. That's the faith that I support as a proud Christian - and I believe that I can be gay and a good Christian too.

 

Look here is some simple logic:
2 men and 2 women can't make a baby.
less babies means less followers.
less followers = less money and less power.
So, why do you think its in the Bible that being say is wrong?

 

An extract from one of my favourite songs, entitled 'A letter from God to Man':

I'm writing to apologize for all the horrors committed in my name,
Although that was never what I intended,
I feel I should take my share of the blame.
All the good I tried to do was corrupted
when organised religion got into full swing,
What I thought were quite clear messages were taken to unusual extremes.
My teachings taken out of context to meet the agendas of others,
Interpretations taken to many different ways and hidden meanings discovered

Religion became a tool, for the weak to control the strong
With all these new morals and ethics, survival of the fittest was gone
No longer could the biggest man simply take whatever he needed
‘cause damnation was the price if certain rules were not heeded
Some of the deeds committed in my name
just made me wonder were I went wrong.
Back at the start when I created this, the foundation seemed so strong.

It perfectly sums up my opinions on religion and God.
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KnGNOiFll4[/YOUTUBE]

 

fuck what they think god says. have sex anyways! god gave u a sexual urge didnt he? appease it! u think every time a hetero couple have sex they have a kid? NOPE. so tell them to tell it to the straighties that if they plan to have sex they better plan on having a kid. plain and simple.

im soooooo glad im done with religion. does everyone see why its bullshit and causes trouble? believing in God is one thing, but following a religion is another

 

I agree with partietraumatics post but I won't quote it cus it's HUGEEEEE

 

My beliefs:

God did not write the bible. Some over-obssesed people who think they had a revalation did.
And If I go to hell for being a fucking gay then I'd rather be in hell then falsified heaven.

 

One interpretation of Leviticus is that it was actually a guide for healthy living.
Shellfish can often harbour really nasty diseases if they're not grown in sanitary conditions. If they disposed of rubbish and sewerage in the ocean, you couldn't eat the shellfish and if you did, you'd get sick.
The whole prohibition of homosexuality thing could be seen as a way of preventing syphillus or other nasty STIs, which would have also been the reason for monogamy and not committing adultery. It's like a bible age condom!

 

Few questions in regard to the whole "Gays can't create". 1. If a heterosexual couple cannot have a baby, being infertile, they can't create. Does that mean they're VERY bad?
2. An elderly couple can't create life because they no longer have the ability to basically (or at least in most cases). Does that mean they're VERY bad?
and 3. What about priests and nuns? They take an oath of celibacy, and therefore can't create. Does that make them VERY bad?

 

religion doesn't have a problem with being gay. Its the acting upon that, which it doesn't like. So i guess the same would apply to those. Being infertile or taking a vow of celibacy is not a bad thing. However then going on to have sex, without doing it for procreation, would be wrong. Its why Catholicism bans condoms and birth control.

Incidentally, another interesting thing from Leviticus. If a man and a woman have sex while she is on her period, they should be cast out from society and stoned. I don't recall any religious outrage at that

 

The bible is confusing and contradicting so I'd rather not build my life off unstable foundations which are open to interpretation, I'd rather make my own morals...

 

also I would like to point out a verse in the bible although I can't remember where it is but it says "there is nothing that can come between humanity and god" I think it's in acts but I can't remember like I said

 

Yeah the bible is quite contradicting. What about the whole "love thy neighbour as thou wouldst love thyself". But then it has fifty things about stoning people lol. Also sometimes I kinda laugh about the whole "thou shalt not lie with mankind as one does with womankind, it is an abomination". Why might you ask? It can be interpreted simply as sleeping with another man but not in the sexual sense. Like a sleepover (I know this is silly but I like looking at it like this)