So I was talking with someone today, and the subject of the thing I wrote about being gay and Christian came up. I told him about it and (despite being bi) he started to disagree with me. Not like "ok, I see, but this is what I think." He was "no you're wrong and I'm right." For example, he used the snippet from Romans 1:26 about men and women having "unnatural" same-gender sex due to not glorifying God. When I pointed out that the Greek word translated into natural meant 'one's own natural disposition i.e. innate sexual orientation,' he said nothing, and then said "well the Bible only describes man and woman, not gay." Then, he even said there are Biblical examples of same-gender (not necess. sexual) relationships, but they aren't described as gay. When I pointed out that homosexuality as we know it did not EXIST in Biblical times (which is glaringly true) so there's no way it could be described in the Bible anyway, he got defensive. The entire time we were arguing, I thought "you told me that you're thinking of sneaking around on your wife with a guy you've known for 3 years after trying an open relationship until YOU got jealous of her having other partners, and I'm the one who's going against the Bible?" I guess the most irritating thing is I made it very clear that, in all likelihood, considering Biblical evidence, God is neutral on sexuality - H(h)e doesn't care one way or another so long as one is in a monogamous, loving relationship - and this guy kept saying that because it wasn't described in the Bible, in either a positive or negative light, that makes it wrong. That kind of nonsensical reasoning really upsets me, because it's stuff like that that is used to keep LGBT Christians in the closet (and sometimes drives them to hurt themselves), and turn out LGBT people away from Christianity.
It's a simple case of using the Bible to bolster a previously held belief, rather than taking one's belief from the Bible. He ain't the first, and he won't be the last. Lex
Unfortunately it sounds like your friend is ignorant. For whatever reason he has to find control in whatever he can, and from how it sounds, being right is a control mechanism for him. If I were to guess I would say that he is pretty intelligent, and very opinionated, and his opinion is the only one that matters. In any case, understand that for whatever reason, he needs to have control, so let him have it. If you dis-ingauge the conversation and respond in a way that is non-confrontational, or offensive to him the he has no reason to be angry. If he continues to be angry, ask him why he is angry. Let him explain why he is angry, without snapping back at all, and then recite what he just tole you, then ask is this correct? For example he is angry because you didnt respect his stuff (hypothetical) and he says "you used my things, and Im mad at you for this," you respond "your mad at me because I used your things, correct? Is there anything else?" Often people are angry when they feel like they are not being heard, and if you respond back to him what he has told you, then he will feel heard, and probably realize how silly he is being. If you need resources on the bible and how it can be gay friendly, it might be a good idea for you and your friend to look at this website :CreatedGay.com Best of luck,
You know, in the biblical times the word "gay" did not exist, in the 1400's and upwards the word "gay" was used to describe someone who is happy, joyous and so on. only in the the late 1980's did we as society used the word "gay" as a same sex relationship. That being said, in the bible there are a few references of gayish relationships. Even king David had a sexual relationship with his best friend. The truth is yes God doesn't want people to sleep around or anything like that, whether they are straight, gay, bi, trans or what ever. The point the bible makes is that you have to be truthful to yourself, be devoted to your partner. To live a life of meaning and above all follow His word and accept His son as the only WAY into the kingdom of God. What most people get wrong about homosexuality is that they think it's a choice we have made... if that was indeed so, then by gosh i choose to be straight... but that is not who I am and that is not right. People tried to pin homosexuality to the influences of friends, then family, then gosh knows what else and yet they are all wrong. They even try to pin it to a certain human gene or chromozone or even DNA but that is also wrong. in the bible it states that God made you and knows you even before you were born. If that is the case, then all the homophobic people's "God" is a creator of gays and they who believe God is against homosexuality and whose churches are also against it then truly doesn't know their God. In reality we all serve the one God, whether the church is against homosexuality or not. It is still the same God, still the same God who created heaven and earth, who created all beings in life.... including US!!!! ---------- Post added 16th Aug 2011 at 12:23 AM ---------- Thanks for this... been looking for something like this to put all these homophobic pastors in our community in their places LOL Yeah for gay rights in churches LOL
Hehe thanks guys. I've calmed down a little bit now. The truth is, it bothered me because one of my best friends is exactly the kind of guy that does not need to hear that kind of unGodly (which it is) drivel, so it definitely struck a very sensitive nerve. That, plus I spent weeks doing the research for that note (which is floating around in a thread somewhere on EC) and to hear someone who's LGBT say those kinds of things, at a time when there are so many LGBT people (esp. teens) who are suffering right now because of religious conflict, is really unsettling.
where have you all founds all this greek translation stuff. honestly i only spoeak english. i do not know greek or how things were translated. i wish i knew more about these things but basically not sure where to start. also, you mentioned that homosexuality wasn't present in biblical times like now? how is that so. didn't homosexuals exist then too? what was it like then for the gays? also, poeple usually talk about sodom and gomorrah, how does that play into this? any website links you can direct me to?
Honestly, I did all my research on the sites listed at the resources page here on EC. And what I meant is that homosexuality as we know it was neither defined or even talked about until the 17-1800s. I'm sure it existed, people just didn't see it for what it was. I'd say that times back then were tough for gays (except in ancient Greece/Rome, but that's another conversation). Also, http://emptyclosets.com/forum/support-advice/49316-my-advice-about-being-lgbt-christian-very-long.html is the thread that contains my note. It'd be better to read it than for me to try and piece together stuff from memory.
