If homosexuality is hardwired from birth...

It's kind of like growing facial hair: some people can't grow any, some people grow a little, and some people can grow it really easily. However which group you belong to doesn't become apparent until puberty (or later). Obviously this trait is from birth, but everyone is born without facial hair.

The reason why most people will 'feel' heterosexual in their youth (and I use 'feel' very loosely here) is because that is what we are exposed to. 99.99% of everything we are shown to do with romance throughout our lives is between a male and a female, so it's to be expected that this will be emulated in children because it is all they know.

I don't believe that people that haven't gone through puberty really have any observable sexual orientation at all, so they'll just pick up the behaviour that they see others doing

It's similar to how boys typically like guns and trucks and that sort of things while girls like dolls and dressing up. It's not because they are predisposed to liking those things, it's because they were exposed to those things more than they were the other and probably encouraged to like those things while discouraged from liking the other.

 

The idea that sexual orientation is hardwired from birth and never changes is overplayed for political reasons.* They're stupid reasons that make no logical sense,** but pack an emotional punch. But the idea breaks down on several accounts the most important of which is that human minds are malleable in virtually every respect.

Chip*** will disagree with me, but I believe that for many people, sexual orientation, and gender identity, are not fixed, not permanent. They may be for some people, but not everyone. I was certainly straighter when I was younger, but that doesn't change the fact that right now it's all about men for me. And if I later find women attractive again, that won't mean I wasn't gay in my early twenties. People are not fixed in their natures or habits. Change happens, and that's okay.

*Basically it's believed that if we can convince people that sexual orientation is a fixed thing (i.e. not a choice) that that will convince people it's okay

**The fact that a desire is not chosen in no way impacts the legitimacy of acting on said desire.

***I think, might've been someone else who brought up studies indicating sexual orientation was fixed. I personally doubt the studies as they conflict with my, and several others', lived experiences and there's a long history of social science erasing the narratives of minorities.

 

this is why i'm questioning myself. yeah, i was attracted to girls and guys as a kid and looking at myself now, i can't exactly identify myself and how i feel. i'm also scared to do so too. in the last 4 years, i've caught myself having crushes towards more guys than women but at the same time, i've noticed myself getting sexually aroused by some women where i want to have sex with them and don't want to have a romantic bond with them. how the hell do you identify that? the way these guys label sexual orientation, it's impossible to say that i'm exclusively attracted to either sex. i don't feel comfortable with the bisexual label believe it or not.. i feel that i tend to get crushes on guys more than girls despite me still feeling sexually aroused to women. do you call that gay, straight or bisexual?

 

I feel it's like thi: you've spent years having buttered toast in the the morning, then one day, you try jam instead. And not only is it nice, it's doubly interesting because you've been stuck with butter for so long. And the jam makes the butter seem...duller. (No offense to the women)

 

Their is something about these conversations that kind of annoys me ... I know their is alot of people wjo want to know why their gay ( and their is nothing wrong with that) but really it always reminds me of a study done about why women are better at fishing and it no reason was found. But the only reason the study ws done was because women arent meant to be I think we are gay simply because we and thats really all that matters

 

Personally, I think that until puberty, children are essentially asexual. However, heterosexuality is around them everywhere, so they presume themselves to be heterosexual. Then once they hit puberty they either actually become properly heterosexual or otherwise.

 

I was pretty big into the booby magazines too when I was younger. This was especially true of me because I grew up in an earlier time when porn access was extremely limited. I remember staying up late on several occasions in order to catch a peek at (poorly unscrambled) softcore straight porn. It being a "forbidden pleasure" made it extra-exciting, and it took me years to notice that I was far more interested in the exceptionally rare views of the guy's bare ass than in the breasts which were on display about half the time.

I also think most people simply take time to really find out "what does it for them". At the outset, with the hormones raging, it's more often that "any sex is good sex", and since straight sex is the most common, that's probably the kind that'll be viewed and enjoyed. As time goes on, a guy might find he actually prefers smaller-breasted women...or actual stories...or bondage...or guys.

Lex

 

Hi,well i beleive i was born gay,simply because i never had feelings for the opposite sex.If i could have got those hetro feelings it would have made me feel more normal and i think i may have persued a relationship with a girl just to hide my overwelming feelings for the opposite sex.Alot of people will try to make straight relationships work just to fit in with what seems to be expected of them,after all most parents,grandparents etc will say things to there kids when young which set there goals for later in life.If your told things from a young age,such as"when you get older and have kids of your own" it tends to take alot of going against what has been put in your mind as normal.

As far as your "homo" feelings not showing up until 14 or so,i look at it like i now realise that i was born to get arthrittis in my hands,just as my mother and grandmother has,this is something i have no choice about,but just like mum and grandma,my hands were fine until about forty,but it is still in me somewhere because they are going the same way as i watched my mums go twenty odd years ago.It is obviously set in my wiring to have painfull hands,even though they were fine for about forty years.

I do think that bisexual people may find it harder to express there natural "homo" side because they have natural "hetro" feelings that need to be put aside which can then put them in that "differant and looked down on" category,it is far easier to just try to be "normal" and hide the "gay" side.

 

looking at my situation past and present, this makes perfect sense. i was also struggling with figuring my sexuality as a kid because i was well aware of certain things around me.

 

I've read--meaning, I don't know if it's true--that sexuality doesn't enter the picture until a few years before puberty and then it's in flux until after puberty. Even then, it can supposedly change during mid-life. I don't know if it's true, though. I've always liked girls.

 

Well being 14- almost 15 - myself I understand what you mean. I used to be completely obsessed with my little 'boy crushes' until about age 12 when I started to question my sexuality. I think that it must be something to do with puberty and I completely agree with the point about little kids being asexual and assuming ther hetro. I don't think that I actually considered what it would be like to kiss a guy in real life- it was just a nice idea in my head. So although it may have only been apparent later on I think there must have been a certain degree of gayness in there.

Also- from your profile- it says that you're "80%" gay, so doesn't that mean you're still attracted to some girls? This could have meant that it took you longer to feel 'different' because you could have assumed you were hetro for a while.

^ This. XD

 

The most recent research I'm aware of provides strong evidence that sexuality is determined by physiological factors that lie at the crossroads of Neuroendocrinology, genetics and epigenetics.

Jsmurf the study you mentioned (assuming we're talking about the same one) implied that the previous presence of a male baby in a given uterus, increased the likelihood of the mother also producing female sex hormones during the stage of fetal development and sexual differentiation in which neural structures having to do with sexual attraction are formed. These structures don't just govern our sexual orientation but also part of our physiological responses to sex hormones at later times, and puberty is nothing if not a years long hormone bath. All of this would make your status as a younger brother potentially causative.

It is pure speculation on my part, but it could be that your sexual "shift" was in whole or in part the result of a primed response to internal hormone production, set in place due to your pre-birth environment, which was in turn caused by your (mother's) DNA.

Reasons for why the mother's body reacted in this way were not forthcoming although there was some speculation that this might be some mild form of immune response. However, In another study it was found that women from lineages more likely to produce this hormonal response were also more fertile.

P.S.
If anyone wants links and citations I think I can dig them up, but its a lot of work and I'd hate to do it if no one is interested.

P.P.S.
It should be noted that none of the studies I mentioned here included female children or lesbians. So while we could assume some distaff version takes place for lesbians, that wouldn't be a scientific assertion.