Hi everyone I've joined the forum as I wonder if anyone else can identify with my situation and hopefully offer some advice. I know this sounds pathetic, but I am a 33 year old guy who has never experienced any kind of relationship, or even intimacy, with another person male or female. I've had interest over the years, sometimes from some quite attractive girls, but have always identified myself (secretly to myself) as gay, therefore I have been completely terrified and run a mile whenever such things occurred. Basically I have never, ever had sexual feelings for girls/women. Believe me, I've tried over the years, as I desperately wanted to be straight. However, as a young teenager, I had crushes on some girls at school. This was purely an emotional obsession. I haven't had those type of shall we say attachments to any girl since I was around 15. Around the age of puberty, when sexual feelings developed, I found out that I was sexually excited by fantasies, and pictures, of guys. I started masturbating around 14 I guess, and my thoughts have ever since been exclusively about guys. At that age, I used to cut pictures of shirtless young guys from magazines and fantasise about them while masturbating. I wrote fantasy stories featuring myself and boys in my class, in which I dreamt of having intimate relations with them. Since then, through my late teens and twenties, my sexual activity has remained the same, with gay porn something I have used almost daily. I very rarely have any sexual dreams, however, when I have they have always been about guys. I can hear you all thinking now - he's totally gay. And I don't mind being gay. I have completely accepted it and indeed want to embrace it. I have told my family and close friends recently that I'm gay. Nearly everyone has been fine with it (only my mother has taken it badly and she's coming round now, although I think she has just tried to block it out). I don't talk about it really as although I wanted people to know, I still am a private person. Here is the problem - I am terrified that if I meet a guy, even an attractive one, I will "shut down" and not be able to perform so to speak. I have put myself on dating websites and already met one guy for a drink, which went well, although I'm not sure if it will go any further. Ever since being a teenager, when to be honest sexual urges are at their peak, I have shied away from any physical contact, or the possibility of anything happening, with another person (male or female). If a girl became interested in me at school, I would be filled with fear. At univesity, when I should have experimented, I made no attempts to make gay friends, or seek out gay experiences. Again, I was completely scared of getting into a situation I couldn't fulfil (i.e. the "mechanics" wouldn't work). So now I'm 33, and thinking I have to try something. I have thought of paying to see an escort - not even to do anything with them, but just to see if I would get "excited" as it were in their private company, if they were to undress etc, etc. It seems that I have some kind of mental block going on which is making my life hell, because I really do feel lonely and feel there's a big blank space in my life. I worry that years of looking at porn has made my brain unable to function correctly with "reality" as it were. Well that's enough for now, I really look forward to hearing people's views. I wonder if anyone else has been through a similar situation as myself. I guess most gay guys have had real-life experiences with men by their early 20s at least. Am I truly gay, or just a freak?!!! Many thanks to everyone in advance, John
Hi, John, and welcome to EC. First off, there are a lot of people in your situation, including quite a few at EC... people who haven't even considered coming out, haven't had relationships or sexual experiences at all... so you're far from alone. And yes, it seems pretty likely you're gay. You've mentioned using pictures of guys as your fantasy material and writing out fantasies about guys, so it's pretty hard to interpret that as anything other than an attraction toward men. I wouldn't be surprised if your fear is simply an amplification of a fear everyone else has... about meeting new people, and putting yourself out there... which is combined with the fear that, because you're late coming out, that everyone else is already there and you're way behind. But the truth is, as I said, there are plenty of people in your situation. Several of our advisor team (including me) didn't come out until our late 20s or early 30s. The strong aversion to physical contact, though, is a little bit unusual. Do you have any history of experiences in your childhood or early adolescence that might be related to that? Do you find that you have an overall discomfort with physical contact, say hugs from friends or family? Or is it specific to situations that could possibly lead to sexual encounters? I think if you can amplify about that a bit it might be easier to give more clear suggestions
Hello John! I'm very glad you opened up about this, because you're certainly not alone. Many young children (12-13 ish) are nervous about their first boyfriends/girlfriends, simply because they've never done anything of the sort before, but over time, young people grow to be older, and they gain experience each time they put themselves in dating experiences. The exact same goes for men and women of newly (or not so newly, as the case may be) discovered sexual orientation. We simply need practice. Have you ever seen a young teenager worrying about her hair, or stressing herself miserably over a single blemish? It's because of the nerves, the raw, anxiety strumming nerves that people feel when they think about the possibility of being rejected or not knowing what to say. These nerves can make us go nuts, or so nervous that we could only dream of being nuts because it sounds like a better alternative! ;] But sweetie, just like we all shed our pubescent skin and blossom into beautiful creatures capable of love, sexual understanding, and maturity, we will just as surely do the same when we start over from the beginning, this time as our true selves. I wholeheartedly believe that you can succeed in a healthy, constructive relationship. And you are most definitely not a freak, but if you are, then the whole world is. Which may not be all that unlikely ;] Much luck! and much love!
Hello John, and welcome to EC! :smilewave To jump right to the final two questions: There isn't any doubt in my mind that you're gay, and you're definitely not a freak. What you write sounds pretty similar to where I am right now. I spent most of my years in middle and high school thoroughly convinced I was straight and just not really interested in any of the girls at scool (conveniently disregarding the attraction I felt for guys, as I was really hoping that it was just a phase), and in uni I was pretty much a homebody and never socialised a lot. So by the time I finally did accept that I was really definitely gay, and came out to friends and family, the easy access to people to socialise (and/or experiment with) that one has in school or uni had already disappeared. Basically leaving me in my late 20s with no experience at dating, or even at really close friendships (while in the closet I was rather secretive, meaning I sometimes have the feeling that only now I'm really getting to know my friends). And also quite bad at even fleeting signs of intimacy (Excluding sports, the number of times I've intentionally touched anyone more than to give them a handshake is exactly 3) I don't necessarily think that lack of experience needs to be a source of anxiety, though. Okay, you (and I) are possibly "late" if you look at a statistical average, but who dates a perfect statistical average anyway? :icon_wink And since it seems that there's someone in a similar situation coming on this forum every week or so, I don't even think we fall that much outside of the average either. Also, experience is vastly overrated by those who lack it. Okay, a lot of the potential dating pool has some experience by their late twenties. But everyone still started out without it. And most people I ever talked to seemed to think lack of experience an endearing and cute trait, rather than a turn-off. (as opposed to: "I have spent a lot of time with escorts to gain experience", which I'm not sure anyone takes as a turn-on ) Obviously, there are guys that insist on experience, and prestations in bed that border on the Olympic. But... do you want to date one of those guys? Since you say you already met up with a guy over coffee, it seems you might be searching for a guy to click with, rather than a pure hook-up. And, since you don't have any indication that lack of working parts is a problem for you (except in scenarios you have in your head, but everyone has those), I don't think you should really fear for "not getting it working" when the moment comes. It's a fear a lot of people have (and I admit, I have it too, to some extent), but that only extremely rarely has an grounds in reality. So, personally, I'd say it might be best to continue on the current path. Meet up more with this guy (or others that seem nice and interesting, or join a GLBT group if there are any near where you live). If the topic of previous dating eperience comes up, just be honest (by which I mean up-front, definitely don't be apologetic about it). If they have problems with an inexperienced guy, that's a strike against them, not against you. Just take it one step at a time. Before any equipment check is in order, you still get to pass past holding hands, hugging, kissing... Each of which is a stepping stone in and of itself and should give you a good idea how far you're comfortable with.
You could try local dating sites as a way of meeting like minded individuals. Put yourself out there to people, make conversations and start off as friends. There's nothing better than to experience it with someone whom you like and trust.
Hi John, Well done on biting the bullet and coming out! That was the first step. There is really only one way forward and that is to start being more intimate and human. Maybe start hugging your friends and try and dissuade these negative feelings you have over affection. You've had all these feelings locked away for so long that you haven't had an outlet to express yourself.. I was like this until I came out, and it makes your life much more secretive than it needs to be. You need to let the shame out.. there is no shame and you've made the right choice in coming out and accepting yourself. Pat yourself on the back and find someone you can be expressive to. Just getting these feelings out to another human will work wonders. Put a smile on more often and try and see the world a bit more There is no quick fix for this given your history of little affection. Most important imo is to get out there, and get some ppls around to support you (&&&). Someone to talk to will be invaluable, if there is no friend you feel comfortable with, see a counsellor.. better to get this out than keep it in.
Hi to everyone and thank you all so much for your replies, which have been really helpful and given me a lot of confidence that I'm not so different from everyone else. To Chip: you ask "Do you find that you have an overall discomfort with physical contact, say hugs from friends or family? Or is it specific to situations that could possibly lead to sexual encounters? Well, these feelings go back to before I had sexual feelings, as I'll attempt to explain: I guess if I look back to my childhood, I never got a lot of affection from my father. Not to say he's indifferent or abusive or anything like that, but he's just not the hugging type. I sincerely cannot remember a single time in my life that I have hugged or embraced my father. I'm sure it happened when I was a baby/small child but not really from school age onwards. On the other hand I have had a close (probably too close) relationship with my mother - sadly I would probably refer to myself as a bit of a "mummy's boy". I regularly hugged my mother from childhood. But she is quite a controlling, dominate person and I guess I always feared her approbation from childhood. I remember as a child of 10 or so, when boys and girls start to have (very innocent) relationships - holding hands etc and being "boyfriend and girlfriend" for a few days or so - I remember that I was absolutely TERRIFIED (I have to emphasise this!) of getting into such a situation, possibly because of the "what will mum say?" feeling. I also remember at age 13 or something a girl at school said to me "my friend wants to know if you'll go out with her" at which I went into a complete terrified panic and stammered "No!" and ran away. I just don't know why this is, I guess there's something psychological going on. I remember it was around the age of 14 that my sexual feelings began. (Never, ever have they been directed towards females). I remember I became best friends with a boy, we were really close for a few months. I remember that during the school holidays I went to stay at his house for a few days, and he slept on the floor on a camp bed while I slept in his bed right next to him. During the night I remember getting such an intense sexual arousal and just wanting him to get into the bed with me... of course I didn't say anything. To Filip: thanks for your very helpful advice. Your experiences do correlate closely with mine. I was exactly like you at uni. I went home most weekends, kept myself to myself mostly, and avoided social situations generally. I did make a few friends but generally was happiest on my own. I remember very clearly being completely obsessed with one totally gorgeous guy in one of my seminars, but of course was terrified of speaking to him so never did and just admired him from afar. I was disappointed when that semester ended as I didn't get to gaze at him any more! You're totally right that I am currently seeking to meet guys who I can get to know slowly as friends, as I'm not interested in casual hookups. I do worry myself silly that if a sexual experience was to happen, I will be filled with such panic that I won't be able to perform. I know I watch too much porn, as it's my only outlet, and the guys are always hard the moment they get naked. I guess it doesn't always happen like that, I guess a lot of kissing and exploration can take place before guys start to get hard - but maybe I'm totally wrong??? I'm totally naive about things you see. I don't think there's any problem with my "equipment" as I can get hard at home, on my own, on a daily basis - the problem is entirely psychological. To ukeye: thanks for your advice too, I have considered going to my doctor and asking to see a counsellor. I have also wondered if hypnosis could be useful but don't know. Thanks to you all again so much for your advice, John
Hi there John, I think the suggestion for therapy is a good one. But realistically, I think you might just have normal anxiety about sex and sexual situations; it's hard for many (if not most?) people to "preform" when they are scared witless. As for your mom and that situation, it could be that her attitudes towards sexuality filtered down somewhat... If I can ask, was she positive about sexuality, or the type that would send you off to Bible Camp for so much as making oogly eyes at someone else? If she was the more rigid sort-- like my Catholic mother-- then it could be that you learned that sex was something dirty and something to be ashamed of rather than something natural. It's an attitude one can also pick up from society, especially for GLBT&co people I think. Oh, we're horrible nasty people, ew. That sort of thing. Experience is a case-by-case basis; like others have said, some people find it endearing. I do! It's kind of cool these days, being someone's "first". And besides! If you want some "experience" without having sex, maybe it would be best to go a less illegal route... a gay strip club. I don't know if there are any in your area, but a quick Google search should find something, and you can always hire gay strippers! It might be overwhelming if one has social anxiety, but it's a less expensive and legal way to see if half-naked men do it for you in real life. I hope things work out in your favor and you figure things out in a safe, comfortable way.
Lol, seems the similarity extends to parents too. That does sound like my own mom a lot. I don't realy think I can ever remember my parents showing any emotion, or even talking about it. Things like sex are never discussed at all. And I definitely worried a lot about getting her approval (didn't help she was a teacher at the school I went to, so she was never far away). Still, I don't think that needs to necessarily be a bad thing. Different families have different "styles", and I don't think more or less hugging make you a better or worse person. In a way, the most important thing is that you can take some distance, analyse it and see things you want to change. I still think you're putting the cart before the horse. "If sex happens" is still a big step. If you're taking things slow enough, you're unlikely to suddenly find yourself in bed without seeeing it coming. Also, if you know the guy well ahead of time, it won't be "I must impress him with my superior skill!" but more like "Let's totally take this further!". Also, yes, I do think you'll probably have ample time to do kissing and touching for quite a bit beforehand. Talking to a doctor or councilor might be of use, yes. Though I think you might want to look for one dealing with general anxiety, rather than one dealing with sex problems. The latter kind might be hard-pressed to find a solution to a problem you don't have now, and quite probably won't have in the future either. Personally, I'm not really in favour of escorts or strip clubs or the like. Those have about as much to do with sex as porn does. I.E. they might be fun to pass the time, but still are totally different from "the real thing"
Hi John, Filip Both of your stories seem to mirror mine. My mum has always been very close to the point of me feeling smothered by her presence. I think my mother smothers me with attention because my older brother left home fairly young due to a few arguments/diagreements with my father and never returned, since then he's always been distant and now he's married has a whole new family. I rarely hear from him and feel I have nothing in common. I too never seemed to get a lot of affection from my father and he was not one for hugs. Congratulations on being able to come out to your family and close friends. I'm still working on this but I'm right on the verge of telling a few of my close friends. My famliy will have to wait for me to prepare a bit more - fortunately I feel distant to them because the smothering pushed me away. Despite this my mother still calls for a "whats up" sort of check each week. When I was depressed I'm sure they were scared about what I was going through and they didn't want to say or do the wrong thing incase it made things worse. Fortunately I'm passed that now and can look towards the future and things improving. I've been reading EC for a little bit and see so many stories with similarity to my own and found it so reassuring that what I'm going through is not unique or special but far more common than I would have thought. This has made me feel better about myself which can only help the process. Good luck and all the best. -Zeek
Thanks to everyone for your replies. Regarding my mother and her attitudes to sex. I was certainly brought up to think that (any kind of) sex was dirty; therefore I believe I formed an aversion to any kind of relationship that might possibly become sexual. I really think this 'mental block' is at the root of all my problems. I'm really trying to overcome these issues. I hope that by meeting new people I will find someone who is sympathetic to my neuroses. I'm currently in a bit of a vicious circle if you like. In trying to keep reassuring myself that it's all in my head, I keep needing to masturbate. Because when I'm in the act, all my problems are temporarily kept at bay, and I feel like it would be no problem at all to make love to a man. I'm watching porn all the time as I can rarely get excited any more by just looking at pictures of hot guys shirtless. (When I was a teenager, I'm sure in common with most gay guys, it only took one look at a hot male torso in a magazine and I was off. Now, such pictures hardly ever do it for me any more). The more I masturbate, the less my sexual drive seems to be and the more anxious I become that I won't be able to get an erection next time. I did have an experience the other day which slightly reassured me. As I was sitting on the top deck of a bus, waiting for the bus to leave the station, I looked out of the window to the waiting area below. The was a young guy (approx. 20) with a tight t-shirt and shorts. He had amazing legs which he kept flexing by resting his feet on the seating. As I watched him, transfixed, I did get excited "down below". This did reassure me that I really must be gay and if I can only conquer my anxiety issues, I could have a happy fulfilling relationship with a guy.
Hello everyone Well it is 8 months on and I'm back here, hoping to get some more advice from all you guys. To recap from my earlier posts, I am (now) a 34 year old guy, always been single, for most of the past 20 years I have recognised my homosexuality but stayed firmly in the closet. For most of those 20 years I was desperate to avoid any situation which might draw attention to my sexuality. I find it difficult to explain, but I have never felt a really powerful drive to explore my sexuality, until recently. Although I've always noticed good looking guys, I rarely have developed crushes on them. Maybe I can count five in the last ten years - guys I've known who I felt really attracted to and couldn't help but dream and fantasise about. My sexual experiences until recently were confined to solitary experience. For many years this would be fantasies and erotic images of hot guys, then over the last 5 years or so (I feel sorry to say) more and more (gay) porn videos, especially since the advent of fast broadband connection. What has happened over the last year is that I gradually became more and more stressed out to the point where I felt I had to come out and try to move on and accept myself, which I felt I had done. I'm comfortable with being gay (at least on a conscious level). I have had some experiences with men in recent months, but the problem I have now is that basically I hardly have any libido. During the last year or so, I have gradually noticed that my sex drive, especially my desire to masturbate, has declined to the point where I only do it once or twice a month, and even then I don't enjoy it much. Erotic images of hot men simply no longer arouse me - and casting my mind back, this has been going on more or less since I came out - so almost a year. I can still (usually) get aroused watching porn, but I've tried to significantly cut it down, and a number of times I find even porn doesn't turn me on anymore. It seems odd that at almost the moment I decided to come out, I have either lost my sexuality or lost my libido! Is this a coincidence? It's so frustrating! I now want to be an out gay man but I simply have no sexual urges any longer! Thinking back I cannot recall if my sexual urges were starting to decline BEFORE I came out, or if it's all started since then. Any comments gratefully received - do I need to see a doctor or therapist I wonder? Happy to respond to any questions. Many thanks, John
