gay christians

I'm both Catholic and gay, so. . .

 

I suggest that you watch this > http://emptyclosets.com/forum/blogs/robert/4479-homosexuality-lecture.html

In summary, there is an argument.
This argument says that back in Biblical times, 'homosexuality' was not understood in the same way as it is today. People did not believe that, for example, one man could fall in love with another man. They did not believe that a person could be attracted to the same sex. So, the Bible does not condemn acts of homosexuality as it is understood today, the Bible condemns straight people being perverted with other straight people.

 

I deal with it by thinking that what I do is living my life to the fullest, the way I want to. I guess that I believe in God, but my opinions differ from that of my religion--if heaven were anything like church, then I would rather go to hell. Just saying. I've been condemned for so long that I think that coming to EC and listening to music is my only release. I used to be suicidal and this helps me in my depressive thoughts. I look forward to the day when I can finally move out of my parents house and be who I want to be. I've read the bible, old and new testament of the KJV and my feelings STILL wouldn't go away. I guess what I'm trying to say is live your life in a way that makes you happy to be you. Don't live a lie like so many so-called "Christians" do that condemn homosexuals and make yours and my life miserable.

 

Personally I believe I was born gay, so if God made me this way ...

My boyfriend is extremely religious as is his family, he dealt with a lot of problems growing up going into denial which he is still in somewhat but he told me that he has never been happier since he stopped trying to be a 'perfect christian'.

Many believe homosexuality is a sin, some do not. It's not written in stone just down to interpretation I believe. I hope you're ok

 

Some people try to make a case for it, but it's a rather weak argument either way. In the end, mainstream religions are all about doctrine in addition to scripture, and even if you just look at scripture it's pretty clearly outlined.

I personally forgot about the entire issue myself a long time ago. I suggest you read Marshall Brain's "Why Won't God Heal Amputees?" sometime.

 

I mean I'm gay, Catholic, an Eagle Scout, and I teach religious education, i haven't come out to everyone yet, but the few that i have come out to have been very accepting. I believe that I'm a gay christian to be an example that you can live a good life and believe in God while everyone else thinks you can't...but that's just my take

 

i dont mind gay Christians at all, i use to be one myself, there's nothing wrong with it at all, its just when you decide to buy into the dogma, the religious conformity, and believing that being a christian will allow you a guarantee passage into heaven, that's wrong, Robert has posted some good evidence as to why religion is about doing something even though it may not be the right thing to do.

and when you ask yourself, why do we need a church to do something we as human beings should be doing unconditionally, you can be an individual who thinks for himself rather than use the help of the church to make the decisions for you

 

Umm... here's a question for YOU... What ARE fake christians, and why are they so bad?

 

im christian and gay.... i dont worry.
i worry more about what other people think rather than what god thinks about me

(*hug*)

 

Well God helped me come out to myself and is still helping. I'm my darkest of days when I was taking 3-4 times my regular dosage of anti depressants, a angel appeared by my door. The light illuminating from the object brought me down to a tau state and I was in aw. It was the brightest white light I have ever seen. Even brighter than the lightening bolt that struck the side of my house that same week later. After that I stopped taking anti depressants. I also came to the realization that the Bible was written by man to suit their customs in that day. God may have not said the vile homophobic comments that are found in the Bible.

Don't let the hypocrites bring you down. You are who you are and were made in the image of God. If God thinks you are beautiful, then they let others tell you differently.

 

the homophobic stuff in the new testament of the bible (if that's even possible since there was no homosexuality as we understand it) was written by paul. and we know he wrote a lot of what he wrote in order to "sell" christianity to the roman gentiles.

 

There's a lot more debate over what the Bible says about homosexuality than what "most" Christians think. I suggest reading this post when you have the time: My Advice About Being LGBT and Christian

There is much more to a person than his/her sexuality. That one factor (significant as it is) doesn't have to define your spiritual life. Even if homosexuality is a sin, why should that one factor automatically exclude you from following Jesus? The Bible spends exponentially more time condemning greed and neglect of the poor than it does condemning sexual activity, yet we don't see churches closing their doors on anyone driving a Porsche. Established Christianity is sick with hypocrisy. If you choose to believe in God, then you can trust God to guide your heart in the right direction.

 

Also, there are multiple arguments that none of the six biblical passages used to denounce homosexuality (which, as Robert pointed out, was not even understood the way it actually is) actually talks about homosexuality. Most of them address prostitution and pedophilia.

 

Its something hard to explain without going into many details and examples, but if you want more articles, resources or to talk more about it feel free to PM at any time.

Basically, though, the bible can and has been interpreted in multiple ways through out the years. Right now we are seeing a change on how a lot of people are interpreting what the bible says about homosexuality, and we are seeing people, churches and church officials change their stand on homosexuality and stating that its not a sin and that people were interpreting the bible incorrectly.

To answer your question more directly, gay christians have sex because they believe its not a sin in the eyes of God.

Its a complex subject and the confusion can be very hard to handle, but you are definitely not alone when it comes to dealing with your faith and your sexuality. Just know that you don't have to choose between the two

Here are some of my favorite documentaries/videos that touch on the topic that might interest you.

For The Bible Tells Me So:
Its an amazing documentary that shows 4 very religious families and how they handled their children coming out to them. It also touches a some passages of the bible and their interpretation. Worth a watch and you can get it from Netflix (14 day trial if you don't have it )

[YOUTUBE]HpJAucyX7RE[/YOUTUBE]

Through My Eyes:
This one is a little less "professional", but its very touching. It interviews many people who are gay and christian. They tell their story without touching on scripture or interpretation. Its solely intended to connect to emotionally and understand were many young gay christians come from. This one is a bit harder to get your hands on since they only sell it, but its worth it.
[YOUTUBE]PyIFcMHHTRg[/YOUTUBE]

And last to finish this long message, a video from one of the people that I have the out-most respect for. Freaking amazing person. There is also a documentary coming out soon called "Love free or die" about his life which sounds like its going to be really good.

Gene Robinson:
[YOUTUBE]mPZ5eUrNF24[/YOUTUBE]

 

Here are three BIG points that other LGBT Christians reiterated to me when I was searching. Each has helped me to reconcile my faith with my sexuality.

1. Regarding the “importance” of The Bible itself. The Bible itself says "All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness." (2 Timothy 3:16) But like many other things in Christianity this is translated to mean different things to different people. Some believe that this quote means that we should literally accept everything written (fundamentalist Christians) and some believe that the book is “useful” for teaching and training about God & life (mainstream Christians).

2. There –IS- wide spread disagreement on all of the passages regarding "homosexuality" in the Bible, mainly due to the fact that there is no one word for "homosexuality" in the Greek language, thus it is translated differently. Conservatives Biblical theologians, suggest that all 6 instances of homosexuality in the Bible condemn it in all forms. While, Liberal theologians, suggest that the 6 instances don't refer to "consensual" homosexual relations, but rather, rape, bestiality, masturbation etc.

Example 1: Leviticus 20:13
“If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them.”
- The Hebrew word "to'ebah" is generally translated as "abomination." Many leading scholars interpret these passages as referring only to male Jews who engaged in same-sex behavior in Pagan temples. The term would better be translated as "ritually improper" or "involving foreign religious cult practice." Elsewhere in the Hebrew Scriptures, the same word is used to ban wearing of clothing made up from two materials (like cotton-polyester in today's world), or having a tattoo, eating shrimp, eating pork, seeding lawns with a mixture of grass types, etc. It is also important to note that none of the passages invoking "T'ebah" are valid for Christians or non-Jews today, according to St. Paul's Gospel in the New Testament.

Example 2: Romans 1:26-27
“For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.”
- St. Paul directed this book to Christians in Rome -- a city known for its sexual debauchery. Earlier verses in Romans 1 describe how some former Christians, presumably all heterosexuals, had reverted to Paganism.
- They once more worshiped idols, and engaged in ritual sex orgies. In the original Greek, the phrase translated "vile affections" does not refer to passion or lust. it appears to refer to the "frenzied state of mind that many ancient mystery cults induced in worshipers by means of wine, drugs and music."
- The "women did change" (or "exchanged" or "abandoned") their normal sexual activity, which had been with a man or men. They engaged in sexual activities with members of the same sex, in violation of their heterosexual orientation.
- In the original Greek, the phrase "para physin" is often translated as "against nature" or "unnatural" or "immoral." It actually means "Deviating from the ordinary order either in a good or a bad sense, as something that goes beyond the ordinary realm of experience."

Example 3: 1 Corithians 6:9-10
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
- The Greek "makakoi" does not mean actually mean effeminate. It can refer to a range of behaviours: people with loose morals, cowards, lazy men, etc.
- The exact meaning of "arsenokoitai" has been lost. In one ancient manuscript, the Hebrew "quadesh" (temple prostitute) is translated into Greek as "arsenokoitai." Others suggest that it refers to gigolos; still others suggest it means masturbators or men who sexually abuse boys.

3. The Bible is a set of Covenants (Old Testament [Jewish], New Testament [Christian]) or 'Laws God set for His people', and while this is a common misconception – ALL Christians believe that God has changed these laws as people progressed through time.

A couple of quick examples:

Example 1. In the Old Testament (Covenant), God told the people to sacrifice animals to Him, in the New Testament (Covenant), God tells the people that His son Jesus is the ultimate and final living sacrifice for all, and animal sacrifices should stop.

Example 2. In the Old Testament, the Books of Leviticus and Deuteronomy set forth many laws which seem unsustainable and harsh (One example, is the Jewish dietary laws, no shellfish, pork, no wearing mixed fabrics and stoning for various crimes etc). However, in the New Testament, Jesus revokes many of these 'Jewish' laws when he begins to, for the first time, welcome non-Jewish/Gentile followers.

As we read the Gospels, we see that Jesus endorsed many of the old laws, but he did not follow others, nor did He require His disciples to do so. In later New Testament books, Paul and the other apostles affirm many of these laws to be good but indicate that Christians need not observe others.