I am very thankful to have found EC b/c I feel like I'm about to lose my mind and can't talk to anyone. I've been married 19 years to my college sweetheart and have 2 beautiful teenagers. Looking back into my past I knew that i was different from other boys my age in that I found boys attractive. With the stigma there was back then it was something one just kept to themselves. I thought those thoughts had left my mind as I led the life of a typical teenage boy...hanging out, dating girls, sex and this was the norm all through college right up until recently. A couple of years ago I had a mental breakdown due to a tragedy that left me with post traumatic disorder, panic disorder, and depression. I'm better from all of that for the most part. But it did cause me to do a lot of reflection about my life and I've realized that the attraction I've had for the same sex is still there. I still look at a nice looking guy and get that fluttering feeling in my stomach. Things with my wife are less than perfect but I try my best to make it work from my end. Between the confusion I'm feeling about my orientation and my family life I feel like I'm going to go over the edge again. My wife and I have not been intimate in almost a year but she has no idea what I am am going through. Help!
Sounds to me like your Bi-Sexual...Your married with 2 kids so its a tough situation, I dated women had a couple of long term Gf's in my teens and early-mid 20's but was always been attracted to guys the whole time also...It wasn't until my late 20's that I acted on those feelings and these days I'm only involved with men...
Welcome! First, you are far from alone. EC's got quite a few people that either have been, or are currently, in your exact sitaution. Check out this thread, in which several current EC members are talking about issues very similar to yours. My own guess, based on the little you've said, is that the PTSD, panic, and depression, while triggered by the event you describe, is probably, at its root, deeply connected in with the feelings and unrest you have surrounding your sexual orientation. Quite a few people manage to suppress their same-sex attraction feelings, get married, have kids, in the mistaken belief that the problem will simply "go away"... but as you are finding, that pretty much never happens. First suggestion: I'd recommend getting Joe Kort's amazing "Ten Smart Things Gay Men Can Do to Find Real Love" which has almost nothing to do with what the title would lead you to believe... and everything to do with exploring and discovering yourself. Even if you're not identifying as gay, that book will help you explore your feelings, and there are a couple chapters in there specifically dealing with people in your exact situation: men attracted to men who find themselves married with children. It's not a breezy read, but it's very meaningful and powerful. Second: A huge part of coming to terms with not being straight is dealing with the feelings of shame that surround it. And that's something nobody wants to talk about or admit... but shame is something we all have, and the less we talk about it, the more we have it. Shame affects us in many ways; it makes us believe we're unworthy of being loved, accepted, or belonging. And, of course, the idea of being gay, or attracted to men, means all sorts of other rejection. Brené Brown is a researcher who has been studying these issues for 12+ years. She has several TED talks which I think will resonate deeply for you. I recommend starting with "The Power of Vulnerability." You can find them on Youtube. So it makes total sense that with these feelings and ideas coming up, of course you're going to feel edgy, anxious, upset, nervous. I know, because I remember it when I was in the process of coming to terms myself with my sexual orientation, and what those feelings felt like. So EC is a great resource for people like yourself that are thinking about, and working through these sorts of feelings. We have no agenda, except to help you find out what your particular truth is; it doesn't matter if you end up straight, gay, or somewhere in between, what matters is that you find your own truth. Also, I and the rest of the advisor team are here to help. If you want to talk with any of us individually, feel free to send a PM and we'll be happy to help.
Thanks to both You for your replies. It's comforting to know that there are others who know what I'm talking about. I have checked out the other thread Chip and it was helpful to read about others in the same situation even though I wouldn't wish this confusion on anyone. SteelCityGuy suggested that I could be "bi" but I don't think so. I mean, I've not had any desire to be intimate with my wife. She has tried to initiate things but I've always had an excuse-stress from work, my antidepressant meds, etc. She has always been more of the physical person where I have always needed the emotional connection. In our 19 years of marriage I have remained faithful. I feel guilty because I've come to realize that I just can't provide her with the physical aspect of marriage that she longs for. I also feel the shame that was discussed because I've come to realize that I'm living a lie in an effort to keep from tearing my family apart. I have always loved my wife as she has always been my best friend and it kills me to think of the hurt it would cause her (and my children) if things were to come to light. 19 years ago I never thought I would find myself in this situation. I've tried to read a lot on situations similar to mine and I feel like such the cliche' of the middle age man who suddenly opens his eyes one day and realizes that life is half over with and I'll never experience what or who I really am.
Dear SoLost, You are definitely not alone. I too thought my gay thoughts were fleeting and went down the expected path of dating, marriage (but no children). I've been married for 27 years and finally admitted to myself that I'm gay a couple of months ago. Since then I've come out to a number of friends, my brother, have started working with a therapist, and with all of the support from EC and friends, was able to come out to my wife a couple of weeks ago. It was by far the most painful (but also the most meaningful) discussion I've ever had to have. My wife and I are still working through the consequences (which are many), but we are progressing. For me, finally coming out to myself and then to others has been truly transformational. I finally feel like who I was meant to be. I don't know why I was born gay, and I don't know why I didn't realize it sooner, nor why I went down the path I did, complicating the lives of others. None of it was intentional. I love my wife greatly and would never want to do anything to hurt her. But the fact of it is that I'm gay. Some people also thought that I must be bi since I had married a woman - but on introspection, I am 100% Grade A Gay. Woman don't attract me at all. No reflection on my wife as a woman - I just am gay - so NO woman would be able to catch my eye. It's a heartbreaking situation all around - and in an ideal world, this would never happen. We'd all figure out our sexuality early in life, be proud of it, embrace it, and live a happy well-adjusted life seeking out the partners that can truly make us happy (and us them). I hope someday that world will exist. Every time I see a young person realize their sexuality early on, and proudly announce it to the world, I rejoice. EC is a huge positive force in making this easier for people. In the meantime, we (I) have very messy, very unfair, very emotional, very consequential situations to work through. It's a terrible choice to make: live an authentic life, being true to who you are - and completely upend the lives of people you truly love, or 'suck it up', live up to your marriage vows, supress who you are, and live out our remaining years continuing this ever-increasingly damaging and draining lifestyle. None of us should ever have to make this choice - yet we must. Each of us needs to figure out the right path for us and our families. EC is a truly remarkable place. People here truly care. I could never have done what I've done without the help of so many members. Let us know how we can help, what issues you struggle with, how you are feeling... We'll help in any and every way we can to help you figure out what is right for you, and then to help you with going down the path you choose. I echo Chip's recommendation on Brene Brown - The Gifts of Imperfection, her book, was a great read and impressed upon me the value of making yourself vulnerable (and BOY have I been vulnerable through this!) Other members whose posts might be helpful are 55, NomadicDave, JimL, Kneedragger, Tom100, Tracker57, bwhopper and many others. You are not alone, by any stretch. Though it has been difficult, I am happy being gay. It feels right. I'm proud to be who I am - who I was meant to be. Not the easiest situation to embrace - but a very honest one. And that feels great. Let us know how we can help, (*hug*) Maxx
Hello Solost, I was married to two women, a total of 18 years. You really are not alone - I too got married for the wrong reasons, knowing full-well that I was gay. I too have suffered a breakdown and taken time to recover. You must keep talking on here and you'll soon realize that whatever question you have, there is someone here with a possible solution. Believe in yourself and be strong. (*hug*)
I can second that. Hard to describe how I feel. Happy is probably n ot quite right. Free is probably closer. I've spent most of my life since my teenage year in varying degres of depression. I've only had one sexual relationship with a woman, which ended several years ago. It just never felt 'right'. I don't doubt that I loved her, in some way, but it always felt that something was missing. Looking back, it was always her who initiated sex - never me. I won't say I didn't enjoy it though. A few weeks ago I finally admitted to myself that I'm gay, something I'd been refusing to acknowledge since I was about 13 or 14, when I realised I was paying more attention to lads than girls. Spending all that time trying to 'force' myself to be straight just made me unhappy. I hope things get sorted for you, I'm sure that you'll find much of the support you need on these forums - they've helped me immensely.
So Lost What helped me a lot was spending a day reading posts by Maxx and all comments, including their threads, made by each and every respondent. This gave me a much broader perspective on my situation, in fact, someone else was exactly where I was. What a relief to know there were a number of men here on EC that were married and had the same fears and questions. While this is your journey EC is a wonderful and supportive place to begin. Welcome Dave
I thank all of you for your reading my posts and trying to help me make sense of everything I'm experiencing right now. After reading many of the posts and threads of others my worries seem so small in comparison. Don't get me wrong, I know I've got a long and difficult road ahead of me but I feel fortunate that I have not had to experience the pain that others have. My heart truly breaks for them and what they've gone through. I guess now I have some reading to do with the titles suggested earlier as well as continuing to post. Again I can't thank you enough for your support and encouragement. You all have been awesome in providing me with the shoulders that I've desperately needed to lean on!
Welcome to EC SoLost44! I'm so happy you've found this site. It was a life saver for me! If you read any of the threads by those who are supporting Maxx through his transformation, then you've stumbled on mine. Just a quick synopsis: married as a "good Catholic" virgin at age 20, 3 adult children, came out at the end of last year to my wife and many others this year, divorced in February, and now learning to be the guy I was born to be. Your worries are in no way small compared to anybody here. We are/have all been in hell! There's no way around it. There is absolutely nothing I can add to Maxx's masterful reply to you! He has come so far in a short time here, and although his struggles continue, he's facing them head-on! I believe with the help of EC, you can also find the right path for you. Feel free to write on my wall if you want. I'd love to hear from you. However, you'll be amazed by how this thread will continue to blossom as long as you keep updating it. I encourage you wholeheartedly to find a counselor you trust to help you sort things out. If you can find one specializing in LGBT issues, so much the better. Down the road, depending on your decisions, I hope your wife and kids will join you there or with a counselor of their choosing. Best of luck! (*hug*) 55
Counseling sounds most appropriate as it helped me in the past with the PTSD/anxiety/depression I will begin my search for a therapist soon.
I guess you could say that today started the period of "Enlightenment" for me. Following the advice given by Maxx, 55, and others I worked my way through the first half of Brene' Brown's book THE GIFT OF IMPERFECTION. As I begin this journey it has forced me to look deep within myself as I try to figure things out. I imagine (or at least hope) that in some fashion it is normal to question oneself as to "how did you not know!!!" Truth of the matter is that I'm beginning to think that "I knew" all along after reading Brown's discussion on the feeling of shame. Shame has been apart of my persona since I was about 8 years old and too trusting of a stranger. Although it took years to move beyond that and to accept that it was not my fault, shame had already taken ahold of me. Even though I learned to forgive whomever that individual was. However, I don't think I ever worked past that shame. Just as Brown described in her book-I did everything I knew of to win the approval of others (sometimes in vain) in an effort to compensate for the lack of selfworth that I felt. I think that this just set the pattern of me denying what I really felt about myself. It was always what others thought of me that seemed to matter most. As I stated earlier in this post I can't help but wonder if there were signs that I missed about myself and the answer is 'yes' I'm sure that I'm not the only one to have this thought but I am beginning to see that the signs were all there, I just wasn't ready or willing to take that leap of faith and see them. It's kind of ironic when I think about it. When my wife and I were in college and just friends at the time, we befriended a lesbian couple who made the comment that they thought I was gay but just didn't know it! If only I knew what hey did 20+ years ago!
Hi solost44, I also wanted to say - hello, and welcome to EC. A real life saver. Just starting the dialogue and being finally able to express yourself as you really want, will make a huge difference. I found it wasn't immediate, but as the days passed and I posted more it slowly sunk in that I'm ok - it's not just me alone in this sea of fear and anxiety. So keep posting. There's some great people here. You've already had some great replies from Chip and Maxx - and maybe you have read my thread. For me, right now, life has improved dramatically. True, the first few days were Hell, but the openness I now have with my wife and with the pretense gone we are able to relax and enjoy our relationship in a way I don't think we ever did. The guilt and shame that sits in some part of your head holds you back from being openly loving I believe and seeps its way through all parts of your relationship. I always found sex, though often enjoyable, a bit stressful as I couldn't react naturally. It is amazing how we can convince ourselves for so many years that it was just this or just that and will be better next time. A big factor in my situation was remaining faithful to my wife - when the time comes you will be asked the direct question and being able to truthfully answer that nothing else has happened is a huge factor in what happens next (imo). I think my wife would have packed a bag and left right there if I had had to admit to any infidelity. And that would not have been a good place to move forward from. I'm no saint mind you - I had contemplated trying something, needing to know how it feels. But thankfully it never happened. I can't say if our marriage will survive long term (my kids are up and away adults, so not such a huge issue for me as for you), but I can say that I feel liberated and ironically my wife does too. She new, as women just seem to, that something was not quite right. I know it can seem an insurmountably hill right now, but keep talking and take strength from us here and one day you will be able to do it. Best, Tom
SoLost, it sounds like you are making great progress! Yes, through reading Brown I came to understand that shame underlies a lot of this - and once I realized that I'm gay and that being gay is 100% okay (I'm not 'broken' or 'defective') - and not something that makes me any less worthy in life - it was a revelation. And once I started to move beyond the shame, and started to cut myself some slack on the associated guilt (as I would for anyone else but me previously), things started to improve dramatically. I, too, have always prized the happiness of others much more than my own - and have finally come to terms that I'm important too. My happiness matters! Who knew! Not to the exclusion of everyone else of course, but my happiness does matter! I can't help others unless I'm coming from a place of self-worth and I refuse to continue to define my worth by what others think of me (or what I think they think of me). These life lessons seem so basic, so obvious now in hindsight that it is hard to believe I didn't understand them long ago - but better late than never! Why don't they teach this stuff in school! We are here for you throughout this journey, and I'm so proud of you for your progress so far! (*hug*) Maxx
So I finished Brenes' book and am grasping the concepts she discussed. Am I feeling vulnerable~~~oh hell yes! As I'm trying to internalize everything I am frequently having to stop myself from trying to over analyze things and generate some road map of where I am headed. I guess in a nutshell it's because I feel like I have no sense of direction right now. Being a husband, father, and straight are what I have known for so many years that this feeling of uncertainty is just throwing my internal compass completely out of whack. I've looked for the logical roadmap by researching Cass and the stages of coming out but still feel like I'm wandering all over the place. Is what I'm experiencing a normal reaction to this process? I realize each persons journey is unique to them but sweet Jesus help me out here. Does it sound like my panic disorder is a little ramped up? I also have noticed that as I adjusted my profile settings (felt the need to personalize a few things as I'm getting comfortable with being part of the EC family) that the one thing I haven't been able to change is my orientation yet. I mean what gives? I definitely enjoyed the Men's swimming and water polo events on the Olympics yesterday so I think the obvious is pretty clear but... I just can seem to pull that trigger and change my status.
Absolutely. I felt just the same. When facing such a huge, life changing event I don't think it's possible to have a clear view up front of where you're going to go. Maybe some can, but I certainly couldn't. All I can say is take the first step and work from there - so long as you are sure you want to do it. There's no going back on this one! I started off with my profile as bi, probably for the same reasons that you are hesitating, but changed it later on. I know what I am and that's that. Keep talking - that helps such a lot. Best, Tom
SoLost, yes, your reaction is similar to what I had - it all seemed a little overwhelming and I wanted to know exactly where I'd be 6 months from now. Over time I realized this is a process, not an event - and I surrendered to the realization I was better off taking things slowly, a day at a time. Once I dropped the anxiety of having to know exactly how things were going to turn out, I became far happier. I'm still not sure of the ultimate outcome, but somehow I have this abiding calm that it's going to work out fine - for both me and my wife. Not to say there won't be rough times ahead - but I know ultimately the outcome will be fine. As Tom said, keep the communication going! Maxx
Tom, thanks for your insight. I think things were so overwhelming for me yesterday that I felt like I was just expecting things to be a little easier than they actually are. Maybe it was a case of expecting too much of myself too fast. In hindsight I get it-I'm trying to do something quickly that I've suppressed my whole life. I just need to keep things in perspective.* Last night I decided to use journaling to help me work out my thoughts (this has always been helpful in the past). Anyway I found myself hesitating yet again to even write that I am attracted to men let alone gay. *I read somewhere about the IT GETS BETTER campaign on YouTube and thought it may be helpful to check out. *It was absolutely inspiring to view these brave individuals (youngsters and adults) sharing their stories. *So much so that it gave me the courage to finish that journal entry and to finally admit to myself what I have been hiding my whole life, that I am gay. *It was a difficult and emotional given my circumstances, but I was able to do it! * Where things go from here I don't know. Like so many other married men here at EC I have so much to consider regarding my wife and children. I know I will get there at some point. *For now though, I'm just going to take the time to adjust to finally accepting myself for who I am.* I am truly convinced that without the support and encouragement from EC that I would never have reached this point on my own so my thanks to all.* ---------- Post added 31st Jul 2012 at 02:19 PM ---------- Maxx Just read your post after submitting mine. A big thanks to you as well!
This whole process is strange, unreal, confusing and very very scary. So yes, take your time if you can and don't feel pressured. I think your journal idea is a good one. Looking back, I did feel pressured, by circumstance, by my own mind - couldn't stop thinking about it all the time - and my wife, who has always had an amazing perception, knew something was up and pushed me into a position where I just could not step back from coming out. I didn't feel really ready for it in many ways - although I guess we never truly are - and perhaps it is better to deal with it in a timescale that we are happy with, but there also comes a point I feel where you just have to get on with it. The real heavy work starts after the event. You will be bombarded with lots of questions, so read up as much as you can. Being able to stay calm an answer effectively will make it all just a little easier for both of you (calm in this case is relative of course!). It's tough, really tough. Especially for someone like you with younger kids. I've been to Hell and back, several times with this, although right now, my relationship with my wife is better than it has ever been. A whole lot of issues have been discussed that I am sure would never have been if I hadn't taken this step and it has the potential to make us a much better couple. So take heart from that at least. Where it leaves us (or me) as gay men, I don't yet know, but I hope, if not a husband at the end of this, then at the very least to remain a loyal and caring friend to my wife. There is hope in the blackness. Best, Tom
