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"You should go to the gym..."

Discussion in 'Coming Out Advice' started by ultrabluecheese, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. ultrabluecheese

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    This is more of a rant than anything, but any input would be great! :slight_smile:

    I had an...interesting (as in "annoying") conversation with a fellow student in my Vietnamese class last Wednesday. It's been on my mind for a while, and I felt some strange impulse guiding me to post it here on EC.

    So, there's an older student in my Vietnamese class, whom I shall refer to as Daniel, and we have been talking for about a month-and-a-half at this point. Daniel has served in the Navy for 20-some years (he's in his late thirties, even though he looks much older, to be honest), retired, and is now back in school again--quite commendable! Oh, and he's also gay. So, depending on my mood, I'll wear my rainbow bracelet every so often because I feel like it, so Daniel obviously saw that one day (like a month-and-a-half ago) and noticed.

    Before last Wednesday, Daniel had described me as "unassuming," and I don't know about anyone else. But when someone describes me--or anyone else--as unassuming, my connotations are along the lines of meek, passive, and submissive; in other words, not the best connotations. On Wednesday, I asked him exactly what he meant by calling me unassuming, and he didn't mean it as an insult at all--but immediately started going on about how passive I am. I guess my "I'm-so-fucking-over-this-shit" attitude can be perceived as passive at times. Anyhow, he told me that he was talking about me with one of his friends that past weekend, and he described me as "almost virginal." Then, he proceeds to ask me, "But I don't think you are. Are you?"

    I respond, "I am, but honestly, it's not a big deal to me. It seems like a big deal to everyone else besides me." He then asks, "Have you been in a relationship at all?" And truthfully, no; I haven't. Then, he starts to "analyze" me, or something. He said that he thinks I'm one of those people who has low self-esteem, and when I look at myself in the mirror, I pick at myself.

    To which I replied, "Uh, not really...if anything, I neither destroy nor glorify my body. It is what it is."

    Then, he starts giving me "tips" to boost my self-confidence, which included a lot of things. But I specifically remember him suggesting to me that I should go to the gym and "lose the baby fat" (he poked my body when he said that)--because that, if anything, will make me feel great about myself. But here's the kicker. Right after, he said something ironic that really pissed me off: "I hate how the gay community is just so image- and physically-driven." Which, to some degree, is true. But dude. You JUST told me to go lose some weight. You are in no position to say that because you're embodying that shallowness that you criticized.

    So then, he starts going off about how great it is to be in a relationship--to have that physical & emotional connection with someone, and the companionship. And how much you learn about yourself when you're with someone. BLAH-BLAH-BLAH. SAPPY STUFF. I mean, I'm not gonna dismiss that because I do think people learn a lot about whom they are when they're with another person, romantically or otherwise. But ya know...I'm not going to go out of my friggin' way to make that happen. He then epilogues this entire thing by saying, "I'm only telling you this as an older brother figure."

    Story over. Rant time.

    What especially annoys me about this entire occurrence is that he genuinely led himself to believe that I was this lonely problem case who needed his help--because I certainly couldn't figure any of this out on my own; because without him, I was just another lost cause. The weight thing, I feel, is a personal issue for anyone--skinny, fit, fat, average, whatever. You don't talk about people's weight and bodies, and give them "tips"; I mean, I am very well aware that my body isn't exactly the most fit or thin out there, but I think it's perfectly fine. I have a small belly and an atypical figure (I have an hourglass shape), but y'know what? I like my body because of the very fact that it's different.

    When I exercise, I absolutely refuse to exercise for my looks because I think that's a terrible impetus to work out. I feel good about myself after a workout because I know I'm doing something great for my health and well-being, and if my physical appearance somehow improves with my health, then that's cool, too. But that isn't my goal; I want to be healthy, not to look physically attractive.

    And he basically told me that I must find myself a partner, which bothered me in more ways than one. I won't lie: it would be great to have a relationship right now; to have that companionship and support. But until that day happens (you know, when the heavens shine down on me with cherubs playing harps and angels lifting me to Heaven), I'm perfectly content with being single, because it gives me the time to cultivate myself, and to better myself; ya know, the entire mantra of "defining whom you are" before entering a romantic relationship. Basically, being single gives time to work on nĂºmero uno: me. And here's my thing with relationships. My life isn't going to be put on pause until the day when Prince Charming (or whatever) enters my life; I still have goals to achieve and a life to lead, and my life will still exist before I enter that relationship. I want to have some vague semblance of selfhood before I find myself in a romantic relationship.

    I mean, as recently as my Freshman year of college (I'm a senior now), I--like many others--was at the point at which I desperately wanted a boyfriend for that sense of companionship. But it wasn't until my senior year had started that I had a realization: that I should work on myself before I thrust myself into a complicated relationship with another person. And I have been doing that long before I came to that discovery.

    I have a fantastic relationship with my siblings and immediate family. I've continued studying Spanish as a third language. I started ballet during my Sophomore year and have been practicing it ever since. I got myself involved in leading adult literacy courses and educating children of immigrants through free tutoring programs. I volunteer as a tutor/mentor for students in underserved communities. I spontaneously decided to pick up Italian and German just because I wanted to learn more languages. I'm currently learning how to play the cello without any formal education, and while I'm terrible, I know that I can get better with some time. I'm working toward a B.A. in English Literature and couldn't possibly be more happy with my major and degree.

    I realize that that list came off a little arrogant and gaudy, but I really don't intend it to come off that way. The point is that because I'm single, I have the time and opportunity to pursue such a diverse range of interests. Because I'm single, I can improve myself and be a better person, and I can satisfy whatever silly whim I have. My life continues to go on even if I'm not in a relationship, and I won't be waiting for that relationship in order to finally start it; I'm leading a good life with or without it.

    Anyway...then, to be presumptuous enough assume some "older brother" figure when he knows nothing about me? Dude, get the hell out of here, seriously. I have four older brothers, and the last thing I need--or want--is another one, because you're not helping me; instead, you're just being a toolbag doucheface who creates these fictitious narratives about people whom you hardly know beyond the scope of class.

    To be fair, I am omitting the parts when he excessively compliments my personality. He said that I have a great personality, which is what counts most in any relationship (wow, I never heard of that one! STOP THE PRESSES EVERYBODY; WE HAVE AN INNOVATOR RIGHT HERE!). And you know, he's right. I do have an amazing personality, and for me, that's all that matters because that supercedes any bearing that my "flawed" physicality possesses. I lead with my smarts and my wit, and I'd rather identify myself with my intellect and humor because I know that those traits draw in the genuine, authentic people I want to have in my life.

    Also, after he told me to lose weight, I went and had an 800-1000 calorie meal because I'm worth it.

    Well, that was quite the manifesto for me to type out, and if you actually read it all, I gotta give you a huge "thank you" for putting up with the ungodly length! :slight_smile:
     
    #1 ultrabluecheese, Oct 10, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2012
  2. squally89

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    This guy sounds like a dick (when I read the first half)
    This guy sounds like he's either hitting on you or just trying to piss you off so you will be thinking about him.
    Analyzing someone like he did takes effort, thought process and ultimately some form of care (although he could be bored with his life and just want to judge everyone with his standard of "life experience"). Perhaps you should observe if he does that to everyone (who talks to their friends about other people? Unless I care about this person, right?).

    Ultimately, is this person making a positive contribution to your life? I know it's not all black and white, but if he isn't you should disengage your interaction with him because of the way he makes you feel.
     
  3. ameliawesome

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    hahahahaha i honestly love this post. you sound like a very strong, stable, confident person, there are not a lot of people like that, and it baffles those who are not like that.

    "he genuinely led himself to believe that I was this lonely problem case who needed his help" - yup, that's pretty much all it is.

    "you're just being a toolbag doucheface who creates these fictitious narratives about people whom you hardly know beyond the scope of class" - so many people like this in the world. at least they're kind of funny, in an irritating sort of way.
     
  4. TheEdend

    TheEdend Guest

    And I thought I could rant :eusa_clap :lol:

    I wouldn't say the guy was a total prick, but he was def overstepping his boundaries.

    My only suggestion, and you are free to not pay attention to it, is to let people know when they are overstepping and becoming annoying. If he does it again just tell him "Look you are probably trying to help, but you are coming off as a prick right now" Okay, maybe not as aggressive, but something to that effect.

    Most people won't stop unless you let them know their opinion is unwanted.
     
  5. Caudex

    Caudex Guest

    Geez, how much time did you spend on that? I guess if you followed his advice, you wouldn't have had time to write that.
    Just kidding. But seriously. That is a long rant.
     
  6. feet01

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    Well, there are a lot of people who try to "help" us but they are annoying us:
    Oh, you should do this and that, not this way but that way...

    I think you're response to him was excellent.:thumbsup:

    And, then, why should you do something that someone asks you to do just to please them and you
    don't feel like doin' it?:icon_wink
     
  7. Lexington

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    Well, since you told all of US this instead of HIM, one might argue that he was correct on at least one point - that's rather passive behavior right there. :slight_smile: But obviously, you know where your head is at. And if you feel so inclined, that you've decided that one good turn deserves another. And you've decided to start picking apart everything that's wrong with him, so he can get himself a much better quality of man...which obviously he's needing pretty badly. Hey, you're being helpful, right? Keeping it real? :slight_smile:

    Lex
     
  8. AAASAS

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    You sound like you know what your talking about. The guy obviously is a little full of himself and feels the need to help others by insulting them. Not really the best choice.

    No one cares about belly fat, and yes you should not be working out for aesthetic reasons, you should work out for yourself, and only if you feel to do so. I honestly only ever work out when I am depressed, I don't even do it for the image, it just makes you in a better mood.

    If your fine with yourself than fuck him. Obviously you are just more conservative, and don't need to change anything, to call someone unassuming kind of is douchey, and to suggest being a virgin too. I would've told him to fuck off or snapped his wrist after that comment.
     
  9. justinf

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    :lol: This has to be the best thread I have ever read.

    I know a couple of people like this -- although not as bad is this one -- and yeah, they can be extremely annoying! :tantrum:

    Honestly, I wouldn't even take the time to explain the same things you told us here to him, because he sounds like the kind of person that would just turn in all around and make it seem like you're saying it because you *are* insecure and need to convince yourself.
     
    #9 justinf, Oct 10, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2012
  10. ultrabluecheese

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    Thanks, everyone, for responding to my lengthy rant thread! And I'm certainly glad that some people found this little event--and my reaction to it--rather entertaining. :slight_smile:

    To answer all the responses in one post...

    Honestly, I wouldn't completely rule out the possibility of Daniel hitting on me. Even though he's in a committed relationship, he has, on several occasions, complimented me on my appearances, but like the socially awkward person I am, I gave him the benefit of the doubt I thought he was just being nice. Also, because he's in a committed relationship. But I try not to jump to that conclusion because I feel a little arrogant when I think that. :lol:

    All my conversations with Daniel have been incredibly one-sided: on his side. While waiting for class--or during any time of the day, really--I prefer to keep to myself because I don't require that much social stimulation. I can honestly get on well enough with or without Daniel forcing conversation. Part of me does feel, though, that he definitely is trying to assert some sense of dominance over me--as well as the other students--because he's much older than us. So, he tends to ramble on about his life experience and about the things he's done while also emphasizing that none of us have really experienced life yet, and that a few of us are barely starting to enter the "real world."

    I'll give him that point, because to some degree it's true; a lot of us haven't really had "real world" experience, but at the same time, it feels as though he's completely discounting us everything we have been through. Truthfully, he doesn't know any of us at all, and yet, he creates these opinions even though he isn't really aware of whom we know, what we've gone through, or how we've dealt with things. At times, it comes off almost as an insecurity because while he does stick out like a sore thumb, he compensates for the things he's seen and the things he's done--even though he only comes off as pretentious and condescending.

    The thing about Daniel, though, is that I kind of believe that he genuinely thought he was coming from a sincere place when he was giving me this (unsolicited) advice. So, I was sort of put off-guard and didn't really know how to respond until very much after the fact. Perhaps I am passive, considering that I'm writing this to y'all instead of saying it directly to him. If he does try to give me his advice again, though, I'll be sure to let him know that he's overstepping his bounds. Whether or not that'll come out politely is a separate issue. :lol: Also, if things suddenly escalate, I'm not opposed to the idea of just telling him to stop associating with me entirely.

    From the looks of it, though, it seems like he's been unknowingly exacerbating the situation. During a speech, I told the class that I was also studying German and Italian independently, and he--for a reason that I just cannot fathom--thought it would be appropriate to say that knowing more languages might help my "nonexistent dating history." I'm currently at the point where everything about him--his face, his voice, his presence, his very existence--can send me from 0 to 1000 instantly. I really don't understand how my dating life (or lack thereof) is of any concern to him, or how it has become a topic that he can tease me about.

    I mean, I'll admit it: it would be great to have a boyfriend. And there are moments when I do falter quite a bit and feel an indescribable loneliness, and I really do wonder if there is a reason why I haven't even stepped close to the romantic territory. But at the same time, I'm well aware of the fact that a romantic relationship isn't going to remedy everything in my life, and it shouldn't suddenly make me love myself because I have to come to that conclusion on my own time and on my own terms.
     
  11. Owen

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    All of the things you had written gave me an unfavorable impression of this guy, but interrupting your speech to bring up your dating history? That's beyond uncalled-for.

    As others have said, you seem to have your head in the right place when it comes to this. Daniel might be trying to neg you as a way of trying to flirt with you. Or he might be giving you advice that he feels he needs to take himself. Either way, you really don't owe him much in the way of courtesy at this point. Frankly, from the sound of things, I think it's time you told him (in so many words) to piss off. Of course, that's a decision you'll have to make.
     
  12. Lexington

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    I've run into people like this on occasion - who say inappropriate things at inappropriate times. In a group setting once, I mentioned something about my exercising, and this guy interrupted to say "You should push harder on the aerobic stuff. That'll get rid of more of those extra pounds you need to lose, and you'll look a lot better." you know, being helpful. I stopped cold, looked at him with a mixture of confusion and incredulity, and finally said "Does ANYONE like you?" It may have been a bit harsh, but everyone laughed, and I think he got the message. :slight_smile:

    Lex