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Crazy mixed signals from bisexual crush

Discussion in 'Coming Out Advice' started by 4AllEternity, Nov 25, 2012.

  1. 4AllEternity

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    Sorry about the TL;DR post ahead :wink:

    Alright, I've been tempted to post about this for a while, but I've delayed it hoping I could figure it out on my own. I'm just finishing high school (year older than usual final year students, but not the only one), at the beginning of this year I met this guy and this instant chemistry (at least on my end) with him. I've just had this insane affinity for him, and it's even more remarkable since this is the first time I've felt this way about another guy (I've always been comfortable with my bisexuality in regards to purely physical attractions, but I've never "crushed on" another guy before). Anyways, so I knew from the start that he was bi too, since his profile says so. He's been comfortable with it for a year or so now, so it's not like he's still questioning or anything.

    What's been driving me crazy about this relationship is that I keep getting bizarre mixed signals from him. I know he's a good guy, as I've gotten to know him over the last few months as a friend and I can tell he wouldn't mess with someone just for kicks or whatever. He's not shy at all, at least in terms of stating his mind, yet he's introverted as well (he doesn't socialize a lot but when he does he's really outgoing in a genuine way). What's confusing is that my relationship with him seems to elude definition, for example there have been moments when he's made an excuse to touch me, and whenever I've done the same to him he seems enthusiastic (i.e repeating whatever it was he was doing to see if I'd touch him again). We've even kind of hugged a few times after hanging out for a while. He really seems to enjoy it when I compliment him on something (rather than just brushing it off with an "aw shucks" sort of attitude most friends have), and there is a ton of (what seems to me) meaningful "gazing into eyes" that we do on a regular basis. Yet after all of that, I find that he never really makes an effort to contact me or invite me over, yet whenever I initiate contact he's very enthusiastic and quick to reply.

    That's actually one of the most confusing aspects of our relationship; he seems to enjoy the time we spend together, and is never in a rush to leave when we are, but he almost never initiates it himself. One might say in ordinary circumstances "Maybe he's just shy/worried he's bothering me", yet he's often blunt about stating his feelings (he's never been mean, but for example he'll politely turn down walking home with me on a regular basis), and as for the latter, I'm sure it's very clear that I enjoy the time I spend with him.

    We've had some really deep conversations, especially from his perspective, as he's talked about his negative experience with his fathers side of the family, how he was bullied as a kid, how he misses old friends, etc. I haven't had as rough a time as him, but I've been open with my feelings in return.

    His body language always seems to be giving off the whole range of "I like you" signs, such as constantly playing with his hair when he's around me (he stops when we're seperated), he gazes into my eyes when we talk, he angles himself towards me, etc. I know that these signs are easily mistaken or imagined, but they are pretty strong especially considering the other supporting evidence.

    One of the things that I think may shed some light on his behavior is that he had a rough childhood. Nothing extreme like sexual or physical abuse, but a messy divorce between his parents, he lived with his dad (who quickly remarried), and from the sounds of it he was pretty emotionally neglected. He then moved back in with his mom, who seems more emotionally available, but they had a rocky relationship too, and at one point she kicked him out (this was before I knew him, he would have been younger). Now, those facts all seem to be good justification to have difficulty expressing feelings properly and whatnot, but again, the confusing thing is that he's actually been really open about his feelings since I first got to know him. I never see any obvious signs of what you'd expect from someone with shitty parents like that.

    Finally, what brings us to today and my reason to finally post this TL;DR rant was that it was my 18th birthday, and I was really hoping he'd do something special, just so that I'd get some insight into his feelings. He's an artist, and I've always admired his work (and said so), I'd hoped that maybe he'd do something for me. He didn't. He said happy birthday and all, but that was about it. It sounds childish and greedy that I'd let that bother me, but it wasn't really about getting a gift or anything, but just finally knowing if he cared enough to do something like that, as I have for him (I'm not going to be a bitch about it, I'm just disappointed with myself really).

    In summary, he seems to be simultaneously emotionally available and unavailable if that makes any sense. So my question is:
    What should I do? Should I tell him (in a "no-pressure, it's cool if you just want to be friends" kind of way)? Should I back off and see if he makes more of an effort to start things? Should I just wait and see?

    I think it should be mentioned that although I do realize that every love feels like it's the last you'll ever have, but I'm fairly certain that he's "the one" (or one of the few "ones" you meet in your life). I've never felt anything remotely like this for anyone else, I just have this powerful emotional connection to him. I find him physically attractive, but moreso I just love his mind, his art and everything about him. I feel safe around him, and I'm usually a pretty introverted guy (I rarely talk about my feelings). So I'm definetly not going to just give up on this. I think the most extreme action I'd take is just try and transition into having close-friend feelings for him.
     
  2. Juggalo

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    I say go for it. Ask him something innocuous, like what shirt of your he thinks is the hottest, and why. You said he was bi, so that would be a great opportunity to get his insight on your appearance and leaves it open for a comment to go further.
     
  3. 4AllEternity

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    Hmm, not a bad idea. The thing is, I know he's fine with the concept of being bi, but I suspect that like me, he hasn't had a same-sex relationship before, and so is a little unsure of how to go about things. Perhaps we've both just fallen into the habit of treating each other like we would a normal guy friend, having no past reference to fall upon? I dunno, but I will try steering the conversation to something a little more physical in a non-creepy way xD

    There's still the mystery of how this can be so hot and cold though, I mean, I'd think that two guys hugging (it wasn't a super-romantic, drawn out/sexy hug or anything, but it sure felt close to me) is indicative of feelings beyond normal friendship, but then on the flipside there's the fact he never seems to initiate things. Of any sort really. He rarely sends me a message out of the blue, but he always jumps on the conversation when I do. Grrr, this is why I've been so crazy for the past few months, I never stay sure of what his feelings are.

    I should mention that he does know I'm bisexual too (and that I'm single), I mentioned it when we got onto the subject a few weeks after I met him. So there should be no confusion there.
     
    #3 4AllEternity, Nov 25, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2012
  4. Lance

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    In my opinion it doesn't really sound like he's interested in you in a romantic way. It seems like you are already aware of this, since a lot of the stuff you've said points to this and you acknowledge that. So in the end, I wouldn't do anything. Just wait and see if he tries to get any closer or take things further. But honestly it doesn't sound like that will be the case. :icon_conf
     
  5. 4AllEternity

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    Well I won't ignore the possibility (which I will admit is far from being unlikely) that he's not into me, the part that gets me is that every now and then we have a really meaningful moment of closeness, and there's the whole touching/hugging thing (which is what I think is distinct from normal friendships). I'm always careful to avoid blowing things out of proportion, but I do get some very distinct attraction signals, the problem is that they're contradicted by other signals. It's like I've simultaneously been friend-zoned and crushed on. He seems to alternate between sending flirty signals to just close-friends signals.

    I can honestly say that although I'll be really dissapointed if it turns out he has no romantic feelings for me whatsoever (as I'm crazy attracted to him), I think it'll be easier just knowing. I can let this crush go (I still do want to be friends though, as we share a lot of similar interests), I just need to know that I did the best I could and that I didn't miss a chance to have a more intimate relationship with him. If we can't be together like that, nothing will change it, but I'd hate to throw away any chances away.

    Part of the problem is that although I feel very secure about my sexuality (I've never "questioned" I just always knew how I was and was never really ashamed of it), I have next to no actual experience with gay romance. I've never really had problems "reading" girls, up until now I've just had female crushes, one of which I actually asked out (it didn't really go anywhere though). Has anyone ever had an experience with a similar kind of person?
     
  6. Juggalo

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    I have a similar situation going on with my best friend.
    I'm not out yet, although I'm pretty positive everyone secretly knows, or thinks I'm bi.
    He is confirmed straight, but is seriously.....can a straight guy be flaming? lmao I don't even know how to describe him.
    He always flirts at me and other men, but with his personality you just can't tell if he is bi, curious, or just silly. Its REALLY frustrating. Especially when he says things like "I wish I had a gay friend to compliment my ass." or "I fart rainbows and you will smell it and it will be fabulous."
    It is so damn confusing lol
     
  7. I had the same type of friend who would never ever initiate anything, but always enthusiastically replied and spent time with me... Until we tried to become something closer and the entire thing broke apart. He and I are both gay, but he had some ... Issues... That put a hamper on our relationship. If I were you, I'd tell your buddy that I like him and want to have a relationship with you. Seriously, you two are comfortable with your sexualities (apparently), and aren't getting any younger. Stop wasting time and find out how he feels about you! Just be prepared in case he doesn't feel the same way back.
     
  8. Juggalo

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    He won't even watch regular straight porn though. He found a straight porn in my dvds and was like OMG PENIS and got all embarassed. Like, seriously embarassed, and started talking about lesbians. Either he is way deeper in the closet than me, or he is some sort of homoromantic heterosexual who canjt aknowledge his own feelings.
    Although....I'll post more akward things later, gonna clean for a bit. Might not be back tonight. Lemme know about any developments with your friend, k?
     
  9. 4AllEternity

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    Yep, he definetly has some issues himself. His family has been really shitty to him, mostly just not caring about him, and at one point his mom kicked him out of the house. I'd almost expect that he'd be more messed up considering everything, but he's not. I'm sure that those experiences must have had some effect on him though. I've been friends with guys with similar backgrounds, so I know to give him space and not be needy. I'm just getting frustrated by the positive encouragement whenever I start things, but he never starts things with me. Even more frustrating is when we're talking, he'll say things like "blah blah there's this good store in the city, we should maybe check it out sometime" and I'll be like "That sounds cool! Do you actually want to check it out this weekend or something?", to which he usually just makes an excuse not to. GRRR Why'd you imply that you wanted to then?!

    I'm actually not that terrified to tell him, that's one of the nice things about our relationship as it is, I really feel comfortable around him which is very unusual, since I'm usually very artificial with most people. What worries me though is that telling him may put a load of pressure on him and that if he maybe isn't as interested in a relationship as me, he might get scared off.

    I should also mention that although he's not out publicly at our school (as he never really made an effort to connect with people here), I know that he's not terrified to publicly acknowledge his bisexuality. Maybe he wouldn't be comfortable with lots of PDA, but I highly doubt the reason for all this weirdness is him being uncomfortable showing affection for a guy.

    Sounds similar to my situation in terms of mixed signals, but if he's straight he's straight. Sure, maybe he COULD be gay, but if so, until he acknowledges it he won't be able to have a physical relationship with another guy. Still, sounds like he's at least really close to you as a friend though.

    Yep, I'll keep this thread up to date with what goes on. I'm thinking of trying to steer things back to physical stuff (not sexual comments, but flirty things), as I suspect we've both fallen back on guy-friendship attitude for interacting with each other normally. I'm also going to cut back on my initiating the contact with him. I'm tired of always being the one who says hello (and if I don't, just sitting at home waiting for him to send me a message), and who invites him over. If he wants to see he, he's gonna have to ask me himself.
     
    #9 4AllEternity, Nov 25, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2012
  10. TeePee

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    sounds like what i'm going through right now. I met him about three months ago, we'd known each other for seven years (from school) prior to this. He quickly told me that he was gay and single. I'm really into him and had been sending all the signals, which he ignored (i think). Just a few days ago, i told him i was into him and he just killed that conversation....TRANSLATION...He's not that into me. So my advice, find out, ask him....that would save a lot of time trying to ''figure him out''. BTW, i'm still friends with my crush.
     
  11. 4AllEternity

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    The thing is, we have "gone out" though it was not clearly defined as a date. He got a job, so I took him to the movies to celebrate, we had a really good night, hugged at the end, etc, but yet it was never clearly stated as a date (more of a celebration that he got the job).

    Thinking about all of this stuff, I suspect that perhaps I may be on the verge of being "friend-zoned", as I've been realllly careful about not pushing him, since knowing his background I figured that I should avoid being too pushy so as to not frighten him away. Perhaps I misjudged him and should have been a little more sexual (rather than just affectionate), and a little less available. One of the things I've really gone for is always just being available and really flexible, which I still stand by, but perhaps I took it too far and was too available, if you know what I mean.

    This brings me to another question, assuming I am "friend-zoned", what are some ways of breaking out of that when it comes to same-sex relationships? I know what it feels like and how to get out of it with girls, but I'm at a loss of how to make my intentions clear, and furthermore, how to get him to re-think his image of me. I think at this point I can still do that, since we've only been friends for a couple of months, so any idea he has of me might not be cast in stone yet.
     
  12. 4AllEternity

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    Alrighty, an update:

    I've decided to completely change my gameplan; to stop being so available all the time and ALWAYS asking him to places (if he wants to see me he'll have to ask), to focus on being more attractive in terms of skills (he's very productive in a few hobbies, art, music, etc, whereas I am interested and talented if I do say so myself, but I spend less time on them. Especially since I fell for him), and finally, to give a subtle sexual dimension to our relationship. That last part is key, as I believe one of the main reason things may have cooled between us is that I've not been flirting at all (more of just complimenting him), which may prevent him from ever thinking of me as someone more than a friend. I'm not going to be all weird and start making dick jokes or anything, but I really need to step up the flirting, and rather than always saying "Your arts so nice!" go for the occasional compliment about HIM (i.e "I love how you've styled your hair today, it's cute"). Other things I plan on doing is breaking the touch barrier, although we've found excuses to touch each other (i.e hug goodbye, etc), we haven't actually gotten past the slight awkwardness of doing it spontaneously.

    So on to todays events: in short it went really well. Things started slow, he seemed really tired. We said hello, chatted a little about things he's been working on, then kind of did our own thing. This time I held back on constantly making small talk and while being receptive to conversation did not make my usual huge efforts to start one. We went through our classes, and we spent lunch working in the library. I again focused on actually doing work and letting him start conversations, at this point things warmed up and he showed me how his idea for a game worked. We talked really enthusiastically with each other, lotsa smiles and holding eye contact, etc.

    After lunch we split up for our final class, walked home separately, and here I am. Before, I'd have jumped online the moment I got home so I could talk to him right when he got home, but now I plan on waiting a few hours (maybe do some homework, etc) before going on.

    I really have high hopes that this complete change in my "strategy" will work. I've decided that if even after all of this I still can't get closer to him, I'm going to just accept that we'll only be friends. I think that the attitude I'm adopting is the best that I can give (be less desperate for attention, be more attractive as a successful person, be a tad more sexual to bump myself out of the friendzone), and if it doesn't work, nothing will. I will of course keep this thread up to date, and continue to ask questions :slight_smile:
     
  13. Hoofbeats

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    Sounds like a good plan. I tend to get overly responsive (not clingy, but in that direction) with people that I am interested in. Instead of denying this, I took note of it, and I work on not letting it happen so much now. As for doing so in a romantic sense, my friend made a great term for it: Feigning Disinterest. You basically act a tad less interested.. more flippant..

    Not sure how this would go hand-in-hand with developing a more-sexual relationship though.. it is just a thought. You don't want to forego the closeness of friendship for what could possibly be an incompatible romantic possibility. If you were 21, I would advise having a few drinks together, as I have found that tends to loosen peoples' lips and make them talk a bit more, especially if they are reserved; but underage drinking is not good.
     
  14. 4AllEternity

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    Well I'm not planning on taking it too far, I'm not going to be an asshole about it (i.e ignoring him, "negging", etc). Like you said, I'm just going to be less "easy"/available for his every whim. I basically want to encourage him to have to step a little out of his comfort zone, think about my feelings more, as I've been a little too understanding.

    If this doesn't work out, I'll definetly be friends with him still. I view this as my final attempt. I've re-evaluated how I've been behaving around him, and made as much corrections as I can while remaining honest about who I am. If this doesn't work, I think I'll withdraw a little and give myself time to get over him, then we can be just friends :slight_smile:.

    As for drinking, I have of course experimented with alcohol being 18 :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes: I'm not particularly interested in drinking just for the heck of it, I tent to like savouring quality drinks as a treat :grin: He on the other hand, just doesn't like alcohol period, though he has experimented with weed unlike me (he's not a junkie or anything, I'm fine if he smokes a little. That's his own choice. If it were to become an obsession, or he was doing it all the time around me, then I'd re-evaluate whether I really liked him or not :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:).
     
  15. 4AllEternity

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    Here's another update for today:

    Things have been going really well. I'm making sure not to get overexcited, as that was what caused my problems in the first place (my idea of our relationship was wayyyyy ahead of his). Anyways, he came in today excited about having made a lot of progress with an idea of his. Old me would have been gibbering congratulations and compliments and everything, but this time I kept my cool (somewhat). I of course complimented his work, but didn't overdo it. I told him about some stuff I was doing too. We kind of played footsie with our knees (i.e knees touching and keeping them there), which I know could really mean nothing. Still, good signs though! I made sure not to be too clingy and spent time working as well.

    Next class we didn't talk a whole lot, as that's just the nature of the class (more lecturing than independent work). At lunch he "sort of asked me" to do homework together (i.e stating the assumption that I would be staying with him and that we should work on it, and no, he's not using me for grades because he has a better mark than I do in that class), and rather than jump on it like I used too, I made as if to consider whether I was able to stay, and told him I could stay for 3 quarters of the spare, but I'd be leaving to grab some food after that.

    We sat really close to each other (like reaaaly close), again knees were touching, stuff like that. We did the homework together, then talked about stuff (his programming project, mine, etc), the conversation felt pretty flirty to me. Nearing the end of the period, I eventually worked up the courage to casually say I thought the hoody he was wearing looked good on him, and that I thought it was cute, which he kind of smiled at and said it was his favorite. I took that opportunity to bail while things were still good (closing on a good note yah know :grin:), we said goodbye, he gave me a funny look which could have been reluctance. After that I went to my last class and then home, and again, I didn't leap online immediately, but instead chilled and did my own thing for an hour before eventually coming online.

    The moment I got online he sent me a message telling me an idea he just had, and to make a long story short most of the night went like this: he would initiate the conversation, and I would engage him, but not force it. I asked him how his work was coming maybe twice, and a few hours apart.

    TL;DR It's insane the difference my change in approach has made. He initiates conversations way more, and seems more interested. I also feel a lot better, less obsessed with him. It's reassuring to have given myself back a level of control of my own feelings, rather than always waiting for him to reassure me with approval. I still like him of course, but I find myself thinking about my own stuff a lot more and getting more work done. This is day two of the new me, so it'll be awesome to see if things keep improving at this rate!

    I'm still going to be patient though, and I am not going to invite him over or ask him out somewhere until he asks me. I've invited him over a ton of times and just recently took him and a bunch of friends out to the movies for my birthday (we just had a good time, no gifts or anything). So I think I've been fair about taking the initiative, I'd say it's his turn. I'm not going to make any predictions about when or if he even will ask me, I just know that it's his turn to do the asking, and I won't make a move until he does.

    I'll keep you guys updated!
     
    #15 4AllEternity, Nov 27, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2012
  16. 4AllEternity

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    Well it's been a little while, so I'm gonna update on the situation, I know it's kind of long, but I'm confused again and could use some unbiased advice:

    Things have been getting frustrating again. I finished a personal programming project of mine that I'd been working on for a little while, I was very excited about it. When I sent him a copy of it, he basically was emotionless about it. He'd seemed interested when I told him I'd send it when I finished, but when I did finish and send it off, he basically said nothing. Seriously. Asked a couple of questions, but literally no congratualations, or even a "this is cool!" (FYI he is a programmer too). I was kind of aghast because it was very clearly important to me, and I've always acknowledged and complimented his work (and no, I don't shower compliments on him at every opportunity, but every time he's put a lot of effort into something, I've congratulated him), and to me, I'd expect that even if his feelings for me are just of friendship, that he'd still compliment or even acknowledge my efforts. It's just common courtesy :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes: The weird thing is that he's not always like that, in fact on other occasions he's been very enthusiastic about my work. He just seems to veer up and down in his enthusiasm.

    So anyways, I was pretty hurt and angry, though I didn't say anything about it. The next day (monday) I went to school and expected him to be just as aloof as he seemingly was the night before, but he was pretty warm and bubbly. Still, it took me a bit to warm up again, but later I ended up asking him if he wanted to grab something from the convenience store near the school, which we did do. We talked a bunch shared some candy, I bought us both a drink, and he pulled one of his signature mixed messages moves, tasted the drink, said the flavor was boring and told me to try it. I'm not going to read a lot into this, but I at least have this thing about sharing drinks (as in drinking from the same straw). I dunno if it's just me, but I wouldn't normally be comfortable doing that with someone else, though of course with him it was fine :wink: He kind of smiled weirdly, but again, I know that there's no point in over-analyzing something like this.

    Anyways, so I've been trying to avoid asking him over all the time, to try and get him to start initiating more himself. So the next day I decided I would go home for lunch rather than hang out all the time. When I told him that was where I was going, he just kind of invited himself along: "I have nothing better to do". Gee thanks :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes: That line didn't bode very well, but surprisingly things were really great! It was raining, so he pulled out his umbrella. We walked together under it and I kind of huddled up beside him, he didn't pull away and kind of smiled like he was enjoying the closeness just as much as I was :slight_smile:. When we got to my place, we ended up eating pizza and talking for something like 2 and a half hours. Without stopping. No games, tv or anything. Just the two of us. I wasn't forcing the conversation either, he was in no rush to get back to school and we actually were late because he kept talking. On the way out I put my arm around his shoulder and gave him a squeeze really briefly, which seemed to make him happy since he was grinning and bubbly all the way back to school.

    I've noticed this thing he does that really pisses me off, he asks me something like "How'd your day go?"/"Sssssup!" and then when I respond, he says nothing and changes his status to away. He's done that exact same thing yesterday and today when I came online, and he consistently comes back later and either says nothing or makes a two word comment about it. No, I don't take 5 minutes to reply, no I don't start barraging him with messages, I really can't see any justification for it. It's like he's fucking with me, but it totally doesn't seem like something he'd do. I've known him for months and never actually seen a mean/manipulative side to him, though he's been incredibly honest about his feelings (jealousy issues). He's also done that annoying thing where he says something like "We've got to check out <insert TV show here> sometime", and when I say "Yeah, I'd be up to it this weekend/<insert day here>" he makes an excuse not to. Garrrr why'd you imply you wanted to then!?

    When we're actually together I still get a lot of flirty signals from him, like lot's of held eye-contact, and whenever I touch him in a meaningful way (i.e quick hug) he seems really happy and never shies away from it. Whenever I'm around he's always preening; playing with his hair, his hoody, etc. Body language is the same, open, facing me, etc, etc.

    I just don't get him. I know he has no problem talking to people and talking about his feelings, he's pretty much the opposite of shy, yet he rarely ever initiates any close contact with me, but seems to really like it when I do with him. There were a couple of times a while ago when I put my arm around him, he put his around me, but he never actually starts it.

    Could the reason behind all of this madness be that he just isn't as sure how to go about a relationship with a guy, or is scared to express his feelings?

    Anyways, I've been really stressed lately because of this. I know that I love him. This isn't just some crush that I can just toss away. It's very real, we share so much interests, and my feelings aren't just lustful. If he was uncomfortable with a sexual side to a relationship, I would be just fine with that. What I dream about is just being able to cuddle and do other romantic crap like that :3
     
  17. 4AllEternity

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    Ok, well good news today: when he mentioned "I should show you this show sometime" for like the 3rd time in weeks (but he never actually asked me over), I asked him if he wanted to show me this weekend. When I asked the first time he mentioned it (about 2 weeks ago), he made a non-commital "I dunno when" (it never happened), despite directly saying he wanted to show me. This time however, he didn't hesitate to say sure, and I wasn't being pushy about it either. We haven't hung out at his place for a few weeks, but when we used to he usually had me over for nearly the entire day. I tried to never overstay my welcome, always asking him whether he was done for the night when I got any signals that he was getting tired. Despite that I suspected that perhaps the reason he hadn't asked me over since was that he didn't really like spending huge chunks of time (like 12PM to 10PM) hanging out, so this time I just told him that I didn't mind only coming over for only a few hours later in the day if he'd rather that, but he insisted on hanging out for most of the day, and furthermore, he's seemingly planned it out so that we can watch this series together over the next few Sundays, work permitting of course.

    The other cute thing was that some guy was kind of jokingly making fun of my dropping a course (I was fine with it, I know him), and then he (my crush) "came to my rescue" (despite that I was clearly not bothered), and practically bit the other guys head off. I've never had anyone stand up for me like that, it was very sweet :slight_smile:

    Anyways, I'm happy, but still confused. I think that my feelings are very, very obvious. I'm not clingy or anything, but I'm always giving out "signals" around him, hugging him every now and then (when it's a comfortable situation for both of us), touching his arm when I talk to him, I've always said kind words about his art and other projects, I'm not shy at all talking to him, I'll look him in the eyes, etc. I am a very outgoing person with all of my friends, but it's very obviously different with him. I don't hug them, or flirt, nor do I spend nearly as much time with them as I do with him. Lately we're practically twins at school, almost always around each other (by mutual choice, he waits for me, I wait for him).

    Perhaps I think I'm more obvious than I really am? I do know that due to his past, what with emotional neglect from his father when he was living with him, and from being seperated from really close friends when he moved, that he'd be cautious about expressing deep feelings. That I can understand, he's been hurt before so maybe he has trouble being as open as I am. That doesn't explain why he doesn't make much of an effort to be with me outside school though, yet when I ask him he usually will say yes.
     
  18. 4AllEternity

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    Another update: I think I'm starting to unravel the mystery of the incredibly mixed signals.

    Last night we talked, he was really upset and worried about making a bad impression with his manager at his new job. We talked about that a lot, he really opened up about his past and his feelings about interacting with people. He expressed a deep worry about being thought poorly of by his manager, not because of a personal interest in her (she's middleaged), but just by people in general. This runs contrary to the "I don't care what they think" attitude he usually has. Again, I'm not going to jump to conclusions, but this is starting to look like the reason behind the bizarre hot and cold relationship we've had so far (times of a really close, trusting connection to times of barely talking). He's basically expressed a fear of being judged by people, which if that's a chronic issue for him, would also mean that he has a fear of rejection. All of this would be backed up by the fact that he was emotionally neglected as a child (never directly abused, but from his descriptions, his Dad who he lived with, was very emotionally unavailable). If this is true, perhaps the reason he never seems to initiate with me (or anyone else, he doesn't seem to be the active friend in most of his relationships, more passive), for two reasons: That if he expresses his feelings he could be dissapointed, and that if he acts needy I'll be pushed away. Of course, asking someone over isn't really needy, but sometimes the mind is irrational like that.

    Of course, this is just hypothetical based upon me connecting the dots, so I'm not going to let myself get all excited (i.e OMG HE LOVES ME HE'S JUST TOO AFRAID TO SAY IT), because it could just as easily be something else. However, it does make interacting with him easier, as I can understand him a lot better now.

    Has anyone else had experience with an avoidant-type crush like this? What did you do, and how did it go? I still have hope that it could work out, since he still does talk about his feelings, unlike some avoidants who absolutely can't trust others with their feelings.
     
  19. MichaelB

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    First I just want to say it's been really interesting reading your story. I can't help much, because I'm awful at anything like this, so my musings would be pointless :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes: haha, but yeah. It's a really endearing read :grin:



    But I just want to say, I think you could be right with his emotional issues. I know it sounds rather cringey to say, but I'm sort of the same way as him I suppose. I come across as really emotionally distant and detached to practically everyone, even people I'm close too. I recently had a really weird conversation with one of my closest friends saying he felt like I didn't care that he had recently moved away (went to uni), when it actual fact I really miss him. :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

    If he is anything like me, my advice to you is, you're gunna have to be more forward. If I was in this situation, I would have to rely on the person to make any advancement because I'm too... I don't know, scared isn't the right word, but I suppose I would be too worried about rejection.

    Don't over do it and come across clingy (which it seems like you've done a good job at avoiding so far :thumbsup:), but maybe up it a notch and see his reaction?
     
  20. TroubledRyan

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    This was literally.. everything I was going to say. I think he is completly right on this, you have to be forward. Also, I loved reading this, please keep us updated!