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General News #jesuis Ahmed Charlie hebo French muslim dead cop killed gets support

Discussion in 'Current Events, World News, & LGBT News' started by Rosepetal, Jan 9, 2015.

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  1. Rosepetal

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  2. gazwkd

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    Firstly, it would have been better to have posted this in the current running thread on the Paris tragedy.

    Second, the Charlie Hebdo publication attacked everyone, everyone and everything was fair game. I certainly wouldn't single it out as "Islamophobic"
     
  3. Rosepetal

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    I wanted people to see this thread and charile hedbo was racist
     
  4. FrenchKid98

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    Charlie Hebdo is definitely not islamophobic. Charlie Hebdo is a left wing newspaper, and they publish caricatures about everyone, anyone and anything. They could have been considered offensive towards any religions as they were making jokes on all religions. Plus some of the journalists are from Arabic or muslim origins so they are not being racist against their own people.
    They are a satirical newspaper and they want to protect free speech. They joke about anything, of course within the boundaries of French law, which is I believe slightly more restrictive on what you can and can't say in public than US law as we don't have an unconditional rule like the 1st amendment.

    I do not want to be offensive here but I think you didn't grasp and understand the whole story and situation here...
     
  5. Rosepetal

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    in France myslims cannot express themselves At all . No mosques/majids being built ,women can't wear a hijab if they wanted to ,there has been so much pork in restaurants. After this attack was launched,several majids have been attacked. John Stewart is full of satire and I like him ,but charile hedbo I don't agree with joking about people's faith. People need something good to believe in and when someone jokes on someone's believe its hurtful. It's also hurtful they didn't even think about the lives of his coworkers . He didn't think things through . I hate that journalists were killed though . The journalists didn't deserve that and may the terrorists rot I'm muslim and I condemn terrorists.
     
  6. Aldrick

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    A lot of these statements are a major problem.

    Charlie Hebdo was not responsible for that.

    Charlie Hebdo was not responsible for that.

    Charlie Hebdo was not responsible for that.

    Charlie Hebdo was not responsible for that.

    Charlie Hebdo was not responsible for that.

    That is what Charlie Hebdo did--they made satirical jokes and cartoons that offended people. Like this one with former Pope Benedict XVI :

    [​IMG]

    The text bubble reads: "This is my body!" This is a line from the liturgy of the Eucharist, and this is important to Catholics because that is what their little cracker/wafer symbolizes during their mass -- the body of Christ. So as you might imagine, comparing a condom to the body of Christ, for Catholics--who are especially anti-condom--is greatly offensive. That, alone, is setting aside the Pope's image being used in such a manner.

    Self-professed Catholics did not engage in an act of mass murder against Charlie Hebdo.

    This is insanely offensive. It is blaming the victims, and in particular the cartoons and the editors, for the actions of mass murderers. It is literally saying that, if they had chosen to censor themselves, that none of this would have happened.

    No. No. Absolutely not. That is a statement that cannot go unchallenged. The people who are responsible for those deaths are the people who decided to walk in there and pull the trigger. That is the only people who are responsible for those deaths.

    In a free society people should not have to fear that they might be killed if they say offensive things. That is a disgusting thought. The entire concept of Freedom of Speech exists to protect unpopular speech--speech by definition that is offensive to one group or another. Popular speech, acceptable speech, does not require protection because no one is opposed to it.

    There is no reasoning or moral rational that can be used to justify and explain away this act. When you say things like the above, you give these people cover. You implicitly justify their actions even as you condemn them. You say you understand their reasoning and rational, but there is no acceptable reasoning or rational for what they did.

    What they did was wrong. It will always be wrong. There is no justification or good explanation for it. There is simply condemnation.


    ==============


    ...are you even serious? Are there actually people in the Muslim community floating this around as an explanation or justification for what was done? That killing cartoonists is understandable because... people (non-Muslims!)... ate... pork chops at a restaurant? Please tell me that you are the only one who thinks this, and that there are not other people in your community who have not also utterly lost their minds.
     
  7. gazwkd

    gazwkd Guest

    I'm sorry Rosepetal but what you've written is just daft.. if you want to criticise do it constructively.

    To be fair currently you're talking out of your ass.

    Aldrick... that was spot on.. I love you right now, albeit on a platonic level :wink:
     
  8. Rosepetal

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    I am just putting my opinion I laugh at these cartoons but psychotic terrorists don't . France does not understand freedom of speech ,bc the e psychos several mosques have been attacked.
     
  9. Yuber

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    You must certainly never been in France or even read a French newspaper nor study history or laws of France for saying such assumptions.

    First, yes, in certain places women cannot wear a veil. Like public schools and high schools (but authorized at universities), administration facilities (if they work at) or related government jobs.
    It will be the same for the man who want a kippa on his head or a visible cross on his chest.
    All this came from a strange concept called laïcité, and for more than a century, strictly separate the religious from the public space.

    And they are plenty of mosques in France, just search in google the Grand Mosque of Paris, Marseille, Lyon or Strasbourg for a good example (and some have been built with public fund because even the Laïcité, we also believe it is a liberty to exercise a religion out of the public space).

    Then for pork in restaurants. Seriously? France is the country of gastronomy and many national dishes like cassoulet contains pork, (even if you can easily found typical French cuisine have been accommodated to be halal). But also they are plentiful of halal restaurants (even a fast-food chain offer halal dishes).
    If I go to a muslim country, do I complain for not found any pork in restaurants if I want my ham and eggs?

    And for Charlie Hebdo being racist, I read yesterday and article on Le Monde (yes, French newspaper), wrote by a Charlie Hebdo journalist. Her name; Zineb El Rhazoui. She tell us how she fled Morocco to freely express herself and was welcomed to be part of the redaction. She also mention that they have been a lot of refugees from Arab countries demanding for a visa that can have help from the redaction. Racist people don’t do that usually.
     
  10. Rawrzilla

    Rawrzilla Guest

    This is disgusting. Don't use someone else's tragedy as your soap box to push your own agenda.
     
  11. Eleanor Rigby

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    Charlie Hebdo IS not a racist newspaper. It never has been, and never will be.
    The cartoonists and journalists at Charlie Hebdo were tackling extremism in every shape and form, political or religious.
    In fact, those terrorists killed the people who were the most vigilant about the rising of the french extremist political party, le Front National. By killing them, they did the worst disservice to every french muslim : they spread distrust against the muslim community of France and they silenced the voices who were warning us against racists of every sorts.
    Just have a look at this drawing from Charb (cartoonist and director of the publication who died in wednesday assault).
    It says : Muslisms against terrorism : we too are nasty french people.

    And, I'm sorry you don't agree with joking about people's faith, but this is in French satirical papers DNA. France is a lay country but in fact, lay is an approximation here, because it doesn't fully covers what is the concept of Laïcité . Laïcité means that the French State doesn't recognize the authority of any religion or religious organization. The French Republic guaranties the freedom for it's citizens to practice (or not) their religion, but it also guaranties the freedom of speech which includes joking about religions.
     

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  12. Rosepetal

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    that's ur opinion but I just look at it like France isn't the United states .
     
  13. Chiroptera

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    People may believe in something, and everyone is free to do that, or not. No one "needs" to believe in anything.

    Killing people is unjustifiable, unless the person has killed or threatened someone first, which is not the case.
     
  14. LibertyValance

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    You do realize that along with English philosophers like John Locke, that French Philosophers such as Jean Jacques Rousseau, Montesquieu and Voltaire had an enormous influence of the founding fathers of the United States? Much of the basis of the US constitution came from the writings of these European philosophers. In many ways France and the United States are very similar, just that the revolution in the States went much better than the revolution in France. But both societies have been shaped a great deal by the ideas of these philosophers who placed much emphasis on individual liberties, including freedom of the press (expression), freedom of religion and the separation of the church and state.
     
    #14 LibertyValance, Jan 10, 2015
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2015
  15. Eleanor Rigby

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    Can you explain what do you mean by this please ? Because, I don't get it. I am fully aware that France isn't the United States, but I really don't see how this is making any of your previous comments relevant.
     
  16. Rosepetal

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    Muslims have full rights in the United states and in France they don't . I do condemn those terrorists though bc guns should not have been used . If people were angry about charile hedbo then make a cartoon and mock him.
     
  17. Eleanor Rigby

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    First, let me remind you that all citizens in France have the same rights. So, if they are rights that Muslims don't have, nobody else have them either, I hardly see how this can count as discrimination.
    Can you tell me which right Muslims do have in the US that they don't have in France ?
     
  18. SomeLeviathan

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    "not allowing same sex marriage isn't discrimination. Straight people can't marry someone of the same gender either!!"
     
  19. FrenchKid98

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    This the most idiotic thing I have ever heard...
    Like someone already said, there are a lot of mosques in France.

    Btw I do care about the Muslim policeman. As much as any of the other victims.

    At this point, seeing how idiotic that statement was I don't really need to add anything but I have two other things to say.

    About the hijab law: I am pretty sure this law was repelled in the end but anyway it was NEVER applied. And it was made during at time where a (non extreme) right wing party was in power so that explains it.

    Now the pork in restaurants... I sincerely hope you're joking. That's all I gotta say.

    And for anyone or you Rosepetal who might be tempted to say I'm racist or whatever: I am not, I could not care less which religion you have faith in. I am an atheist. And I most definitely do NOT blame muslims for the attacks, contrary to some people. Those terrorists were crazy extremists who believe in something far from normal Islam. Similar to the KKK with christians.
     
  20. Harve

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    I'm disappointed we don't have better and more sensible Muslim posters on this forum because we could really do with some louder Muslim voices heard in the world right now (that we actually pay attention to).
     
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