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General News Scottish independence campaign lied about prospective oil revenue

Discussion in 'Current Events, World News, & LGBT News' started by 741852963, Mar 21, 2015.

  1. 741852963

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    SNP referendum oil figures '13 times higher than reality' - Telegraph

    BBC News - Nicola Sturgeon: All predictions about oil revenues 'were wrong'

    The Scottish independence campaign main argument was that an independent Scotland could not only sustain itself with oil revenues, but that oil could pave the way to making Scotland dramatically wealthier than at present.

    We now know that the idyllic vision of the future painted by the SNP were not quite as realistic as made out.

    I think regardless of whether this was deliberate deceit or merely a miscalculation it is utterly damning on the campaign. Even in the latter case, how could politicians such as Sturgeon be trusted to establish a new state when they are accidentally losing billions from the books right off the bat?

    I think this news is worrying in that it highlights the situation that came so near to being reality for Scottish and non-Scottish UK residents alike.
     
  2. Foz

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    Oh how good it feels to read this. The SNP, like all nationalist parties, are unlike other parties they are just downright unprofessional. Yes all parties thrown mud, but the manner of the language of the SNP just disgusts me, every interview Salmond was full of cocky arrogance and you could see it in his body language. I accept that everyone in politics twists the truth, but the SNP just downright lied throughout, they said they had legal advice from the EU saying we would not have to apply, then spent taxpayers money in courts trying to stop the fact they lied being published. Then there was the £200,000 spent in the courts to try and stop The Guardian from publishing figures on Salmond's council tax replacement as it resulted in huge increases from everyone. It was a referendum that should never have taken place but people were so eager to believe the lies that he had to say, I'm just astounded that so many people believe him when he says everything is Westminster's fault and would vote for independence without even knowing what currency we would use is just baffling. I asked my friend who was a yes voter about the currency and he said 'it's not that big a deal for me', it's a MASSIVE deal, it is like your boss telling you we can't pay you next month and we don't know when we can.

    But the repeated outright lies that so many believed was mind blowing, every year Government Expenditure Service Scotland shows that Scotland gets more from the UK than it puts in, these figures are black and white and the SNP know this. So either they are falsifying official records (a criminal offence) or they are lying to the public, which one do you think it is? It's not hard to work out! I hear all the time, even now on FB from SNP supporters 'the SNP balance the books' that is an outright lie, the Scottish deficit is 35% higher than the UK one. They spent this whole time campaigning 'Westminster doesn't give us enough' like Oliver Twist asking 'please sir can I have some more' but underspent by £444m million. How can they dare complain about not getting enough when they underspent. They literally CANNOT COUNT!

    There seems to be a notion that oil 'is the icing on top, we don't need it', another lie! We spend every penny of our oil revenue as we need it! They say 'we want an oil fund', but you can't spend and save the same money, it's one or the other. And any industry that makes up 15% of your economy is not 'icing on top', it's vital! The banking sector only makes up 16% of the UK economy and look at the mess that caused when it crashed!

    They kept going on about Norway, without actually understanding the first thing about the country, my dad used to work over there and we went out to see him if a project was delayed and it wasn't exactly 'wow', yes it's beautiful and very very clean, but one pint cost £11 shopping was ridiculously expensive. The Norwegian's live very frugal lives, we used to go into fashion shops where there would be 80% off because the clothes had been on display so long the tops of them were sun bleached from sitting out for so long. You cannot have Nordic levels of public services and Moroccan levels of tax, you cannot spend what you save and you cannot be a large economy without your own currency.

    It was an absolute fantasy which had no economic basis, it was largely idealistic, racist (there was so much anti-english sentiment from SNP supporters) and patriotic. And the idea that if you voted No your are un-patriotic was shocking. You cannot fix inequality and poverty if you have a smaller economy, it cannot be done. The SNP have been sitting on powers since 2007 and not using them, how on earth can they ask for more without using what they already had. The threats of 'we won't pay our debt' were just absolutely atrocious and we've seen how wrong things are going in Greece with a very similar government.

    They spent all the time saying 'the Tories cut this, they cut that' without realising we are doing the best out of almost every country in the world! If they could not do the best for Scotland in the UK, how on earth could they do it as a country on its own.
     
  3. imnotreallysure

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    And to think.. this scoundrel of a party will have over 50 MPs in Westminster. What a treat.
     
  4. 741852963

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    I think he is an opportunist. He waited until there was public dissent caused by a controversial UK government and absolutely ran with it.

    All the "hard done to" talks grinded on me too, Scotland is well-funded and doing fine, especially compared to some parts of the UK. The way Salmond went on you'd imagine some Hunger Games type scenario where Scotland was kept in the dark ages by the rest of the UK who all lived a life of luxury. The truly scary thing was how many US newschannels bought into this with cries of "Free Scotland" and "grant Scotland democracy".

    Very true which is why this news is so shocking and infuriating. Oil was going to be the lifesource of an independent Scotland, the main income (parallels to a banana republic there). For the SNPs figures not to be absolutely 100% watertight on this key economic policy is nothing short of disgraceful. They were literally putting the livelihoods of everyone in Scotland (as well as potentially the rest of the UK if a bailout was needed at a later point) in jeopardy - pure negligence.

    Politicians have been forced to step down over a lot smaller things (personal matters, affairs, calling coppers "plebs") - IMO Nicola Sturgeon should not be allowed to stand as a politician following this.

    Again true, there are vital differences between Norway and the Scotland.

    Norway's oil fund (which Salmond pretty much guaranteed Scotland could copy) was set up at a time when oil prices were high and took years to accrue so there is no evidence Scotland would have anywhere near the same success.

    And besides, whilst Norway does indeed do well on paper it is not without its problems. Personal lending and debt are ubiqutious amongst residents - the citizens aren't all living the life of Riley.

    It was an incredibly racist campaign, and it angered me how the Yes campaign tried to denounce the No campaign as dirty and negative when they spent all the time provoking the No campaigners by dancing around the difficult questions.

    It was absolutely unbelievable when Salmond went on camera to say No voters were just "deferred Yes voters". Literally going against all concepts of democracy - essentially "if you vote yes great, if you vote no you don't know what you are talking about and shouldn't be allowed to vote". Salmond talked a lot about how Westminster was corrupt and out of touch, but based on that it seems any government established by him would be frankly totalitarian!
     
  5. PatrickUK

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    So the figures were incorrect and the plunging world oil price would have ripped a huge hole in the Scottish governments budgetary forecasts? What a surprise! The whole argument for independence was built on quick sand.

    I just hope Scottish voters remember all of the shit that the SNP peddled during the independence campaign on May 7th, especially voters in Gordon.