General News Jeb! tries to clarify something, digs himself into bigger hole instead

To be fair, I'm not completely certain that he was thinking at all.

 

Oh, dear. I suppose he must have ignored his PR crew. Given he has little conscience to consult, they should really be his first port of call for public events.

Assuming that we're not shocked about the substance of his beliefs, even if he'd used dry, bureaucratic language, that would make more sense. How he could be so stupid as to openly say what he said, especially in the manner that he said it, is difficult to grasp.

 

He probably realized that he fucked up and couldn't really explain it, so he just thought "which minority is the larger one" and then insulted the smallest one.

 

Typical Bush tactic.

Say one thing, invade another.

*drug off into the night*

 

I read this thread title as Jebi at first instead of Jeb!. I'm not surprised about this though. He comes from the same family as the man who said he wanted to "put food on the family"...

 

I don't really see how "anchor babies" is offensive. A lot of Latinos do use their kids to stay in the country. It isn't trying to be racist, it's just a way to try to get around the system. Could someone please clue me in?

 

The fact that western countries have the nerve to paint immigrants as thieves who barge in and steal opportunity when that is literally the legacy of their founders. Westerners never cared for political boundaries until they had finally solidified themselves in the most advantageous geographical locations.

We know that is statistically impossible for other countries to build themselves up to the wealth of the first world. Our global resources would never sustain it. Yet we tell them, and do an even better job of convincing ourselves, that keeping people out is a matter of principle rather than sustaining our economical privilege.

---------- Post added 24th Aug 2015 at 07:50 PM ----------

It is also true that historically a lot of White Americans frequently cracked whips, but that doesn't mean that being referred to by the respective slur, particularly by political leaders, is something that the general public would find appropriate.

Additionally, taking something that we believe happens frequently in one demographic and applying that to the whole of that group is the very definition of stereotyping, which is the primary form of prejudiced thinking that we form in society. It is never justified.

 

I think the term is wholly offensive, because, regardless of our race/ethnicity, or even our orientation, wanting to have a family transcends these arbitrary markers. Those who want a child or a family are no different then others. And for the Republicans---who preach about the importance of the family---to gripe about this shows the extent of their racism.

The current state of the Republican mindset, disgusts me, even to describe.

 

We're all selfish animals competing for resources.

 

But by the same token, the West cannot accept every last migrant because it is simply unsustainable - so although I disagree with the 'xxx jobs for xxx people' mantra, I also realise that there are limits to the number of people any individual country can accept - and many already struggle to accommodate and integrate asylum seekers and immigrants.

Western nations plundered foreign lands, but the individuals in each country are not responsible for that - so the electorate won't be won over easily by guilt trips (however valid), and they ultimately decide by electing and removing people from power.
And Austin is right - anyone else would have done the same thing. Europeans just got there first.

Anyway, Jeb Bush is a dinosaur with no modern relevance.

 

The Europeans did not discover much of anything first, nor did they rise to power first. Westerners have risen to power most recently, which is a very different statement.

Modern westerners are not responsible establishing the system, but they are absolutely responsible for sustaining. I am not simply talking about the crimes committed by the founders; I am talking about the crimes that are being commit every day that allow us to live in this bubble of opulence. There is no need to feel guilty about the past. Our exploiting of the rest of the world has only gotten worse with time.

You will feel guilty about living in a position of privilege if you have an ounce of compassion. Does it mean that you have to wallow in it? Does it mean that you have to support the West opening its doors to all? No. Notice that I didn't even make an argument about immigration. I never said that we should open our doors completely; I only said that the true reason why the concept of immigration has grown so intimidating to westerners is that we realize that the only way to keep maintain the imbalance that so greatly works in our favor is to keep the majority of the human population out and ultimately worse off. Convincing ourselves that this is a matter of principle is simply lying to ourselves.

 

It's not just Western societies either. Europe is even more xemophobic than the United States, though it's not as explicitly racially-charged. That's why England wants to pull out of the EU is because they're freaking out about non-British people being able to move there! Oh no! Immigrants! We're all gonna die!

 

I don't feel guilty about a situation I have no control over nor have any responsibility for. I was simply fortunate enough to be born in a country where living standards are high, crime is low and opportunities are plentiful. I'm extremely grateful, yes, and have sympathy for those living in less favourable conditions, but I don't harbour guilt for that. As you say, the only way to make the lives of people in the rest of the world as good as ours would be by sacrificing our own quality of life - and that isn't happening.

And the point I was making is that if it wasn't Europeans, it would be someone else. Humans are greedy - and selfish. Europeans aren't the first to benefit at the expense of someone else. You're right - they were simply the ones to do it most recently.

 

Why should I feel guilty for being born into a good nation? It's like saying I should be guilty that white people were slave owners, or that I'm from Germany and Germans caused the Holocaust. None of it is something I can control, the only thing we can do is try to make it better for others. Sure, I can and do have compassion for those harmed by such events, but it is not my fault it happened and certainly shouldn't be only my responsibility to clean up afterwards. No one should have their ancestor's mistakes held against them, although society as a whole can help the marginalized groups affected by events.
Which leads to my stance on immigration. I say we tighten up the border, making it harder for illegals to get into the country. For all aliens here, I think there should be a path to citizenship, I'm sure many of the ones here would like to contribute to America. But we can't just let in whoever, there has to be proper documentation so that everyone who wants to help the country pays taxes and follow our rules. You can't get our benefits of you don't follow our rules.

 

When I read the title of this I thought you meant Jeb as in the guy who works at mojamg and made minecraft...

Anyway, he is either an idiot, a racist or arrogant, or all three, and I think the latter of the four is the most likely. Why did he even think saying anything that might be racially insensetive be a good idea, especially when your running for president.

 

Until businesses quit funding illegal immigrants to come over here and work for them, this isn't going to be resolved. Since they aren't citizens, they aren't guaranteed minimum wage or safe working conditions, and if they complain, well, go back to ___, somebody else will take your place. On top of that, for about what it'd cost to pay 1 American citizen, businesses can have 3 or 4 illegals do the same thing, while turning more of a profit. Also -- and here's the kicker -- since they aren't citizens, they have no paper trail and thus no taxes to be paid. It's a win-win... if you're already winning, that is.

But good luck getting them to play 'by the rules', because they're the ones that need the lower taxes and better protection. And this is okay, because capitalism encourages folks to take opportunities and cut corners, to be as successful as possible. To go against that, well, it'd be [insert fear mongering label here].

 

Bush is a dumbass; I am ashamed to have had him as my Governor.

 

At no point did I say that one should be guilty about historical events; however, you should absolutely feel a certain degree of discomfort with the fact that your very way of life is dependent upon inequality that subjugates and imprisons other human beings in an environment that offers significant less comfort, opportunity, and prosperity.

It is honestly so disappointing that even the mention of the words privilege, guilt, or inequality results in everyone rushing to claim that the state of the world is not their fault and why should they feel bad? Everything has to be about how the human species is greedy and how we couldn't change things if we wanted to. Or I have nothing to do with the problem.

I am a minority in three different aspects of my identity. I don't feel that my life has been quite a breeze, but I live in the single most exploitative first world country of this era. As a child of medical professionals, I have lived comfortably for much of my life. I don't hate myself for the ways in which I am privileged, but I also don't run to assert that claim that I should feel no remorse about it. As morally passionate as I am about global inequality, I recognize that I also wish to maintain my economic status. You don't have to feel terrible about benefiting from inequality, whether it is global or simply domestic. However, making that argument that we should always dance around reality in order to ensure that we are never made uncomfortable about it is ridiculous.

Why do we always have to strive to convince the world that we are innocent human beings who are never bias or prejudice, who are never corrupted by negative influences, who are never guilty of capitalizing on inequality, etc, etc? No one is demonizing you. If all you can think about when people point out the ruthlessness and apathy of this world that we live in is "Well, I don't want to have to feel bad about it" then that say something about the degree of empathy that you foster towards others. You don't want to give up your privilege? Neither do I; but I am not going to act as though innocent for doing so. Can we not just acknowledge these things and leave it at that? Has it really come to this?

 

Right, I did forget to mention that, thanks for correcting me. I realize that corporations take advantage of illegals, and of course that needs to be put to a stop as well. The very fact that these people are still getting a better chance at a good life even after exploitation is depressing. Which means that in an ideal world, these businesses would have harsher laws cracking down on them and Latinos could file for citizenship.