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General News Trump steals the spotlight off the debate

Discussion in 'Current Events, World News, & LGBT News' started by Typhoon, Jan 28, 2016.

  1. Typhoon

    Typhoon Guest

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    And I quote from Trump's twitter:

    An unbelievable night in Iowa with our great Veterans! We raised $6,000,000.00 while the politicians talked! #GOPDebate
    7,255 retweets 16,584 likes
    Reply Retweet 7.3K
    Like 17K

    The short version: Trump soared explosively, Cruz was squished in the exact moment he coudn't afford to get squished and Rubio got slightly more support as fire was trained on Ted Cruz. You have to hand it to the sly fox, he knew this would happen. So did Fox (cwutididthar) who practically begged him to join the debate on live TV.

    Republican debate: knives out onstage as Trump steals spotlight offstage

    Donald Trump won the debate - Vox
     
  2. Aussie792

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    In a rare example this election, a smidgeon of actual policy was discussed without being rudely shouted down during this debate. This article is a nice summary of how Trump's absence changed the debate for the better, albeit from a generally left-wing publication.

    That Trump ran away from hard questions is a little cowardly, but I'm so glad he did. And it's all well and good raising money for veterans, but when you're president you actually have to answer questions and engage with opponents. Politicians must talk; discussion and debate are just about their most important tools, so I find it ridiculous to applaud Trump's decision to skive off that duty.
     
  3. Typhoon

    Typhoon Guest

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    What Trump did is neither ridiculous nor cowardly at all, although the media tried hard to influence undecided voters in this manner. Even if he wasn't going to get nobbled by Megyn Kelly he effectively pulled attention away from all the other candidates. With the videos he releases every day he gives an impression of what he's going to do and why. What he did was basically show off the fact that he could put people off from watching the debate, raise money for veterans (for which most people are super proud of).


    He has since soared in popularity and finally managed to cast aside Ted Cruz. Discussion and debate may be important, but in Trump's case him not going to the debate is in theory insane but as suspected it was a genius move. You're forgetting that Trump, like Littlefinger from GoT, likes to win. He is not an ordinary politician and unlike Cruz, he is charismatic. He did exactly the one thing that would have guaranteed him a win and it paid off far better than he imagined.
     
    #3 Typhoon, Jan 29, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2016
  4. Eye Shine

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    IMO i don't care what Trump does, because if he becomes president all the progress the LGBT community made under the Obama administration will disappear. He just hates to much and even more than the typical Republican.
     
  5. Aussie792

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    I don't think it's insane at all. I think it's calculated, intelligent, rational and just unacceptable.

    I have yet to see him engage in a sustained policy debate in which he matched or bested his fellow candidates. That's so much more important than raising money at that particular point of time. Anyone can do that and it's not related to his candidacy. That is why I consider it opportunistic and cowardly; he made a cheap bid for popularity without engaging in the substantive matters of the debate, which is something on which you can judge a politician's value. He's extremely weak on substance during policy debates, rather like Cruz, but to completely avoid it was a step too far, even if the debate's quality increased as a result of his absence.

    And I'm not forgetting anything. I just don't care at all about his genius in public relations. It's a deplorable and shallow way to get the win he wants without any of the tough work. Managing your own spin isn't that much of a challenge; being able to address issues spontaneously and demonstrating strong knowledge and clear communication of the policies he would introduce are much more significant things than a scripted fundraiser and a handful of tweets. I think to be impressed by that manipulativeness is appalling. It proves nothing about his qualities as a leader, apart from a willingness to run away from what doesn't make him look good.

    Simply put, he's great at campaigning but doesn't take his obligations seriously enough. It's just not good enough to brush away the substance of government by insulting it with airy claims of Washington's elitism and the media's bias. Those things don't mean much without taking them head-on with rational argument and open, non-bullying engagement. It may win him popularity, but I cannot value that popularity if it has such an insubstantial and deliberately anti-intellectual basis.

    By the way, this might be a bit incoherent; I'm a little tipsy at the moment.
     
  6. Plattyrex

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    He shouldn't have done this. The president cannot refuse to speak because they can't take criticism, even if a lot of it is baseless and moronic. I can't believe I'm saying this, but if Trump did attend this debate I probably would have been on his side, as much of Kelly's criticism is just that; baseless and moronic. It is a bit mind boggling that she has such trouble finding legitimate criticism for Trump, so maybe she doesn't see a lot of the legitimate reasons to dislike the guy. Regardless, Trump lost any high ground he had hear when he skipped this debate. If he cannot handle biased unfounded scrutiny from a Fox News reporter, than he will do very poorly when it comes to foreign relations, ad if you put that next to all of the guy's other problems it seems like he would make an abysmal president.
     
  7. Typhoon

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    That's what the media is saying but that isn't even remotely true. Like I said Trump only cares about winning, he doesn't care about what happens after that. It's like saying ''I want that chair'' and doing everything possible to get to the chair without planning ahead.

    Trump isn't your average politician and he knew that by attending the debate he would gain support, but not as much support in the event that he didn't attend. Not only that he could finally send the ''Cruzship'' :lol: packing and remove all threat to him.

    It had nothing with not being able to handle criticism. He has other things on his mind, like attracting more votes, something which he's also doing quite well.

    Yeah but it's Trump, it has to be expected.

    Like I pointed out he's doing anything to get votes - this was his ''trump'' card - the vets Americans are so proud of. Anyone can do that, but none of the other candidates were doing that, especially not during the debate.

    It wasn't actually but debating with Rubio and Cruz (not mentioning a certain bush), or firing at Kelly is about as politically exciting as a dead goldfish.

    He only cares for the votes right now. Obligations and correct procedure aren't his thing.
     
  8. Chip

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    Trump is a narcissist (at least, this is the assessment of a bunch of psychologists who have analyzed his behavior.) He's also incredibly shrewd, manipulative and calculating, more so than any politician in recent memory. All of his statements, moves, behavior, actions... everything... are designed to manipulate the audience he's going after.

    But here's what a lot of people miss: He is a very long term friend of the Clintons. Up until last year, he's repeatedly said he has no problems with gays or lesbians. He's never shown any particular dislike for minorities. And he's been a Democrat and supported Democratic policy.

    A lot of very thoughtful and well-informed pundits believe that Trump is simply trolling the Republican Party, saying whatever he needs to say to stand out from the pack, and get the amazingly ignorant, bigoted, fearful sector of the Republican Party (a pretty large group) to support him. This idea is supported by the fact that Trump had a lengthy meeting with Bill Clinton a week or two before he announced his candidacy.

    I seriously, seriously doubt he believes more than 10 or 20% of what he's been saying over the last year. It's basically a more extreme version of Mitt Romney, who is on record as saying he's perfectly comfortable lying his ass off in order to make the deal happen, then, after the fact, just say "Oh, well, sorry I said that, but it's not what I intend to do."

    It's quite scary to think of electing the Trump that is currently running. But it's also quite possible that Trump is simply trolling the Republican Party to help a democrat get elected, or that he really wants to win and, if elected, will follow the beliefs he's always had. He's never given a shit what anyone says about him, and he isn't really beholden to anyone, so it's hard to know what he'd actually do.

    Of course... it's always possible that he will win *and* be as much of a wingnut as he's making himself out to be. But I doubt it.
     
  9. Plattyrex

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    This is still my train of thought. What he is saying now is so ridiculously inconsistent with how he used to be that I am quicker to believe he's a plant to get Hilary elected than anything else. Hilary has clearly demonstrated in the past that she isn't capable of winning an election, and I would say she's pretty desperate at this point. I don't view this as a positive thing, and I think the very idea is more morally disgusting and corrupt on both parties fronts than the notion that Trump legitimately believes the things he says, but it seems the most plausible explanation. A scandal to this extent is not something most people would even attempt, but I certainly wouldn't place it as being too immoral for Clinton's, and one way or another Trump is clearly not a very good person himself.
     
    #9 Plattyrex, Jan 29, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2016