Man kicked out of NC Pizza Hut for wearing a dress

Cross-dressing has nothing to do with sexuality.

While I personally wouldn't turn away a paying customer, is this really anything newsworthy to begin with?

 

I'm sorry but paying customer = making a profit. I can never understand why anyone would turn away someone's money, especially when the economy is still trying to recover & EVERYBODY is trying to increase their profit margin. Makes no sense to start saying 'You're money is good, but this person over here, they're money is not worth having.' You'd think, at the very least in a capitalist society, that money would trump people's hang-ups and prejudices. However, that being said, if he started aking a major scene after being asked to leave, then there may be an argument to be made for his being disruptive, which would make it harder to prove he hadn't caused a scene beforehand. Or at least that how I'm sure the lawyers might argue it...

 

A company has the right to argue whatever they deem disruptive(even more if there were complaints). The company had the choice to ignore the current complaints, which would have also been bad for business, or let the man in the dress stay. As I see it, it was a lose/lose situation for the company, even if I disagree on the choice that was made.

 

Since when is sexuality the only worthy thing to talk about? Like it or not, gender identity/expression is also something worth fighting for.

Sucks that things like this still happen. Hopefully one of these days they will just ask the customer who is complaining to leave if he is that uncomfortable with it.

 

True Jayrock77, but if a 'disruption' is defined as just making other people uncomfortable, then they can pretty much start asking anyone who has a complaint against them to leave. Then we're almost back to the days of 'whites only' drinking fountains, only it will start off with 'no overweight clientele as it's aesthetically unpleasing' gyms or even 'no gay or lesbian patrons allowed on account of it offends narrow-minded people's sensibilities' restaurants. It's a slippery slope is all I'm saying & that it requires a certain amount of scrutiny and debate before simply making a decision to prohibit people who makes others uncomfortable...

 

would they have turned away a woman if she was dressed in "drag"? probably not. i hate that double standard. and i think that this murphy guy should sew. it may even be classified as a hate crime.

 

umm ya crossdressing is obviously not a sexual issue, I missed though when the T was taken out of LGBT, when did that happen?

I agree trannydude a guy wearing a dress is a crossdresser and is possibly mentally ill with a transvestic fetish but a woman in guy's pants is just a woman wearing pants, total double standard. I doubt her suing them would get anyone anywhere besides lining the pockets of lawyers but definitely having trans/LGBT groups not eating at pizza hut and making an issue out of it might do something.

 

Did anyone read this little part of the artical? "On Sunday, Pizza Hut representatives tell WECT News that Murphy had visited the restaurant three times and had not purchased anything."

Does that smell of trying to raise an issue to anyone else? Seems like there might be more to this situation then is being reported. If he came in wearing a dress and bought something or was in line and kicked out ok bad on the managers but to come in three times and not buy anything and then been kicked out something just seems off.

As for the mention of a hate crime... I loath that term. If I commit a crime against you its not because I like you. My motive or your gender,skin color,sexual orientation, or your race should have no bearing on the punishment.

 

Two sides to every story imo. And I'm not sure which to believe...

 

I've been to Walmart & bunch of times & never purchased one single thing. It sounds, from Pizza Hut's POV, that if Vishon had spent money they wouldn't have had any issue with the dress wearing later on. Otherwise, why wouldn't they have done something about it sooner if there were multiple previous complaints? Sounds to me like being selectively discriminatory based on both social norms & what is exepected in a consumer society. Plenty of people are more than happy to take money from LGBT folks, especially in a hard economy. It just sounded a lot to me like 'You didn't buy anything or generate revenue for us so we're going to find a way to ban you from our establishment'. I'm sure if Vishon had dropped a considerable amount of money on those previous visits, the dress wouldn't have been an issue because it was a good customer spending a fair amount of money in patronizing that establishment...

 

Well for one the rep. could just be saying that Vishon didn't purchase anything, which could just be an outright lie to protect pizza hut and the employees. People go to stores all the time and don't purchase anything, some people even hang out at malls all day long everyday and almost never purchase anything. I'm sure if Vishon was in there multiple times purposefully causing scenes and annoying people the store would be able to rifle up some videotape of it, which they haven't or just kicked her out the first time. As for the customers if someone walking into a store in clothes you don't like causes you extreme distress maybe you shouldn't be leaving your home. I'm surprised anyone here would defend Pizza Hut, basically they just said it's ok to be gay/trans (most of these people wouldn't bother to distinguish between the two) as long as you aren't in our hetero faces about it i.e. you don't get married, you don't hold hands and kiss in public, you don't dress or 'act' gay, ect.. Whatever, it's a dress, this is clothing with no offensive or hateful messages on it, it's just fabric how would that possibly in any way offend anyone except for a bigot. People may find it amusing, but to actually kick someone out of a store for looking funny is wrong.

Of course people should be charged for hate crimes, when a person commits a crime they don't like or hate you they love your money. A hate crime is a very specific crime where a person is targeted only because of their race, gender, sexual orientation, religion or any of those things. What happened here is not a crime it's just pizza hut exercising their right to decide who they want in their store just as I can decide to never purchase any of their products ever again. A hate crime is say that girl in halifax last month who had two guys show up at her door screaming things like, "Let us in you tranny faggote", they then shot her with a shotgun and ran away.

 

the security footage from that pizza hunt apperently shows the man not ordering or paying for anything, and repeatedly coming in and trying to start confrentations.

if the above is true, and this man is lieing about having ordered food, then it means this is nothing more than a con artist trying to find a way to make money with litigation.

 

uh I don't know if it says that in the video because I couldn't get it to play on my computer but nowhere does it say in the article that Vishon was, "repeatedly coming in and trying to start confrentations.", it says there was one confrontation after Vishon was kicked out, that's it. It seems to me that Vishon walks around all day in the dress, it's not like she put it on just to go to pizza hut and annoy people. There was also no mention of Vishon suing them or trying to get money from Pizza Hut, of course a store that would kick someone out because of their looks should be conned and sued. Not that that would matter if Vishon is a con artist because people should be able to walk around however they like in any clothing they like and not have to worry about 'causing a disturbance'. Girls in minskirts, people with pink and purple hair, punks with mohawks, goths in trenchcoats, even topless women! If you don't like what they look like don't look at them it's your problem not theirs. In some middle eastern countries they have morality police that go around and make sure people are dressed 'morally', that's what's cool about living in North America you can express yourself in almost any way and you're not going to be fined or stoned to death.

 

Anawim it does say that he or she as I do not know what the person prefers to be called came in repeatedly without buying anything. Now sure in a mall or retail store thats fine. But in a place the sells food why would you do that? It seems as I said the person was looking for something to be said. Should something be said no but if you look for trouble you will find it. You also said two other things one in this post and one in the last that I would like to touch on.

One that a person should be able to wear what they want? Sure to an extent. For example if I walk into a bank in August with a ski mask on should no one be nervous and should security not tell me to remove it? Also should I be able to go to a pride parade with a God hates F**s tee-shirt on? I mean there is a point where what you do or wear is asking for an issue. Right or wrong things have a consequence. Now if they just kicked the person out for wearing a dress sure that's messed up but it seems more then that

The second thing is on hate crimes. Again why should motive increase the sentence? I mean if I kill or beat up a person you can pretty much bet I don't like them. Now why should WHY I dont like them matter? Violence against a person is violence against a person no matter my motive.

 

motive is 'premeditation'. a hate crime is acted out of hate, and hate is the motive that premediates the attack.

 

Ok so we have a charge for premeditated murder and the like but they will also be hit with a hate crime as well. Again that leaves why does the particular motive matter.

 

How was his wearing a dress disruptive? Did it have a loud print or something?

On the other hand, I'm not sure why he didn't buy anything three visits in a row.

 

I am skeptical about him simply because he never placed a order, and just came in three times and heckled people. I think he claimed he was denied service (even though it seems he did not ask for any service to begin with) to try to get attention and sympathy. I still think this is a poorly concieved con job attempt.

I cant seem to remeber what the term for that kind of behavior is, but I think there is a specific term for that kind of scam.

 

Ok I'm starting to get a little annoyed here, if you're saying it's right for Vishon to be discriminated against simply for wearing a dress then you need to go around and tell every woman in north america that it's ok to discriminate against them because they wear a dress. You're implying trans women aren't really women, we're just guys in dresses.

People go to restaurants all the time and just sit there, people go to food courts in malls and just sit around. People even go into restaurants and just order water and sit there. I go to my local mcdonald's all the time get a glass of water and they have a little sitting area so I just sit there and look out the window, no problem. Occasionally if the staff at the till is really uptight they make me pay fifteen cents for the price of the cup for the water. Sometimes I go into restaurants and sit there because it's raining. Women everywhere go into restaurants wearing dresses, does it matter if they purchase anything? This isn't the same as going into a bank dressed like a bank robber cause you know a trans women in a dress is just so threatening and scary. Not only is Vishon's appearance non-threatening but according to the article she was stopped at the door and told she wasn't allowed in the store because she was dressed in 'drag' not because she wasn't purchasing anything or because she looked like a bank robber. Usually banks will tell you to remove your hat, shades or a mask because it's a legitimate security risk, wearing a dress isn't. Neither is being native american or gay a security risk. Can you believe they even let african americans into banks today and let them dress like gangsters, omg! Overweight people are even allowed to wear spandex and go to beaches in swimming suits!

Being transgendered isn't a choice and trans women aren't going to pretend to act like men or 'man up' for other people. Someone like Vishon to me is someone to emulate as she has the courage to walk around dressing and acting as her true gender even with her body frame and masculine features.

I think pizza hut did not legally commit any crime I'm not arguing that they did, they have the right to refuse service. Just as I have the right to tell that god hates F**S guy to get out of my house. I'll just never buy from Pizza Hut ever again and it's still morally wrong what was done. In most western countries what you can and can't wear is determined by the symbols and words on the clothes. For example you can't walk around with a swastika on your jacket in Germany or in Canada you can't promote violence towards any specific protected group. You're not jailed in Canada but you get a fine, will lose your job and will probably be mocked and shamed in local newspapers if you're going around talking hate speech and it has to be really bad hate speech here to get any conviction. Something like being a school teacher and teaching your kids the holocaust didn't happen and jews are evil.

The reason hate crimes exist is because the justice system wants to send out a message that it's more heinous of a crime to target someone only because they are gay or african or whatever. The justice system already does this with almost every crime. We have first, second and third degree murder depending on the motive. It's a much longer sentence to sell crack then it is to sell cocaine even though they're the same drug. It's more dangerous to assault someone with a weapon then without one. It's more heinous to assault someone with the intent to murder them then it is without. It's more 'evil' to assault someone sexually then it is to assault someone without the motive being sexual. We have added sentence times where I live for crimes that are committed by organized criminals. Every day judges make the decision of sentencing time for those convicted of crimes and every day those same judges look at the motive when they decide on the length of the sentence. The idea that motive is important in the conviction and sentencing of criminals is not a new idea.

---------- Post added 19th Jul 2011 at 03:55 PM ----------

She didn't go in three times and heckle people it doesn't say this in the article you've either misread something or we're reading different articles. She went in three times and didn't purchase anything, no mention of heckling or even saying anything to anyone. Vishon's mere presence disturbed the customers. Once again this happens all the time, people go into stores and don't purchase things. Why do you automatically assume there must be some kind of nefarious purpose behind how she's dressed? She wouldn't be able to win a case against Pizza Hut on the grounds of discrimination as transgendered people are not specifically protected from discrimination by law as sexual orientation is.