BBC: Proving you're gay to the Turkish army

Fucked up shit, man.

 

Yea, I read that article earlier. It's really disgusting some of the politics and policies out there concerning the LGBTQ community. The line about only being viable evidence of being gay if you're a bottom floored me. Yet, it's a different country with a different culture, though I don't agree with it.

 

I already flagged this up :/.

http://emptyclosets.com/forum/lgbt-...ertificate-proving-your-sexuality-turkey.html

 

Yeah I've heard about the situation in Turkey. It's pretty much de facto illegal in the eastern portion of the country with honour killings and so. I hope the opposition wins next election there, they are much more secular and progressive than the current leadership.

This is sick though, especially coming from one of the most gay-'friendly' Muslim majority countries.

 

This disgusts me. I can say now that Turkey won't be on my list of places to vacation at.

 

This is insane! LGBT people have been allowed in the military here in Norway since 1979.

We have a mandatory military service too.. a friend of mine just joined the military, and he's gay. The Norwegian state has even had some projects to get rid of homophobia in the military.. the officers and those high up are told NOT to use gay slurs, because it's totally unacceptable, everyone should be treated the same.

 

My head hurts so much after reading that...

 

I read it not long ago before I came to this site. It just shows you that Turkey is still far from being an progressive nation.

 

This sounds more like misogynistic ignorance than homophobia. They probably just have the idea that "feminine" behavior means you can't hold a gun. This is dumb, but it's not the same as being anti-gay. Most mentally healthy women don't act like what they are thinking, but most of them are competent, intelligent and socially appropriate in their behavior. What they were thinking of is called "histrionic personality disorder," and it's just as annoying and silly in men, gay or otherwise, as it is in women. If they would think about this issue for one minute, they would realize that they are doing a major injustice to their women here, and they would change the wording of the policy to reflect what they actually mean.

Actually, it's annoying to try to explain the other side of this to certain butch feminists. Most guys who are obsessed to excess with martial arts and contact sports are highly annoying, and it's something I tend to associate with white trash. Normal, educated guys are a lot more likely to be interested in a hobby or something, most likely the kind of stuff that either sex could enjoy and not be seen as out-of-gender, because it brings them joy to see something come to life in their hands, particularly something beautiful. Any guy I would date would rather try to heal an injured bird than try to shoot a bird out of the sky, and I see this as perfectly masculine. Stereotypical "masculine" behavior--like obsessing over contact sports or hunting--is exactly that: it's a stereotype. Men who show it TOO FREAKING MUCH are generally considered by society to be obscene white trash. Unfortunately, trying to get this across to certain butch feminists is like shouting at a brick wall because they are just as dense and thick-headed as their male counter-parts who have the same kind of mindset. Sorry for the barely relevant rant, but this has been a major headache for me lately.

On the other hand, I don't sympathize much with the guy who was trying to get out of service to his country. I think it's kind of lame that he was using his sexuality as a pretext for avoiding military service. He was in a position to know that his sexuality had no bearing on his ability to serve. He knew that the stereotypes were nonsense. He knew that he wasn't going to start crying and waving his hands when his platoon came under enemy fire, just because of his sexuality. If they were really so non-concerned about his sexual orientation that saying outright, "I'm gay," didn't mean anything to them, he should have just ignored the policy. He's not the kind of person they had in mind when they made the law. But I guess cowards don't make good soldiers, either, so it's just as well.

 

This is absolutely ridiculous. I have been to Turkey recently, Istanbul, and on the surface it seems such a modern and liberal place.

The one part that really stood out to me is this:

"Doctors are coming under immense pressure from their commanders to diagnose homosexuality"

Like we have a disease.

It is a shame that such views are still rife.

 

The part that stood out to me is that they want photos of gay sex! LOL! WTF!? What a bunch of closet freaks!

 

Honestly, this is pretty much the same way the US was before the draft was eliminated in 1973. Even when the US went to an "all-volunteer army", homosexuality was grounds for being unfit for duty or being dishonorably discharged until 2011.

One thing that is different about Turkey is that military service is a big deal. All men must serve in the military for at least a year before they turn 40. If you don't, you can be sent to prison, you won't be allowed to hold a Turkish passport and you may not be able to get a job. Even if you were born in another country, if you want to be a Turkish citizen with a Turkish passport, you must serve in the military.

They intentionally make it nearly impossible for anyone to get out of military service. And anyone who claims to be a homosexual is considered to be a draft-dodger.

 

Oh my goodness! This is just cruel and embarrassing.

 

Yea, that's really messed up. What a bunch of morons to think gay men enjoy wearing women's clothes, etc. Idiots, wow!

 

Wow.... that's so painful just to read...

 

The idea they get their information from a 1968 resource is just insane that shit is so outa date. The ammount of sterotypes they use to judge them is insane ow man, they are just so ethically and morally out of line i believe!!!

 

I love the "disciplinary problems" justification from the retired general. Because countries who have allowed openly LGB (no T yet that I'm aware of) servicemembers clearly saw an immediate decline in military readiness and performance. *eyeroll*

As a veteran of the US military myself, I think you'd be hard-pressed to find a veteran (at least one who isn't in some serious denial) who can't name a person they served with who was LGB. Hell, one of my male coworkers and his "special friend" (also a male servicemember) took me and my husband at the time out for one of the best meals we've ever had (side note: if you've never had Moroccan food, check it out). When talk about repealing DADT got serious, my reaction was, "Yay! We can stop kidding ourselves and acknowledge the LGB people who are serving and have always served."