Supreme Court Showdown: GLAD v. DOMA

Is there any news when the actual review is going to start?

This and Prop 8, both headed to the Supreme Court. It seems like this November's going to be an eventful year in politics. I just hope LGBT rights are brought up more in the debates

 

This is great I just hope it will work out...

 

I'm surprised the House requested this, considering it's got a Republican majority. The courts have backed marriage equality overwhelmingly, so why would they risk it in Supreme Court that DOMA could be thrown out? Or does it have nothing to do with the Republicans at all? I'm a bit fuzzy on that.

 

Because if they don't appeal to SCOTUS then it is thrown out. This is their last chance to have it upheld.

 

Interesting. Arcus do you mind explaining why that is though? Is it because of the being held in the courts? Sorry, just curious. And I apologize to my American friends on here asking you all to explain stuff to me, but I find the whole American government confusing (though I find the Canadian Parliament confusing too...)

 

It's been a while since Civics/etc... but if the Supreme Court rules DOMA/Prop 8 Unconstitutional, won't all laws in any state be thrown out that ban same-sex marriage?

As from what I remember, a state law cannot go against a Supreme Court decision or a federal law... though I may be wrong, it has been a while.

 

It depends on how broad the ruling is. They could issue a narrow ruling that would strike down prop 8 while leaving the other states laws in place. I think it important for people to understand that the Prop 8 and DOMA cases are different and it’s possible they’ll go different ways IE: they’ll uphold prop 8 and strike down DOMA.

---------- Post added 30th Jun 2012 at 04:33 PM ----------

It would only be upheld in the 1st circuit (although there’s another case in 9th circuit) it would still be valid law in the rest of country. I a circuit split developed then the Supreme Court would have no choice but to take the case.

 

Trust me; most people here don't understand it any better. So when you take something like DOMA to federal court there are three levels you go through. The first is the district court. There are about a hundred of these and they're regions don't cross state lines. Then if you don't like the ruling there you take it to the court of appeals which are broken down into 11 circuits that encompass several states. If you want to appeal that ruling, you take the case to the Supreme Court which covers the whole nation. Their ruling is final and the only thing that can overturn it is another Supreme Court case (so not likely as the justices have lifetime appointments and choose which cases to hear).

A ruling by any of the courts only affects their jurisdiction (except where the law is about the federal government as obviously if the federal government has to make a change that change affects everyone). But as the Supreme Court gets thousands of cases a year and only chooses to hear about a hundred a year, most federal cases end in the court of appeals. Generally, those rulings stand as precedent for cases in other districts. So if DOMA were not to go to the Supreme Court, someone could sue in another district, point to the ruling in the 1st circuit, and the case will usually be quick. (The normal rationale being that the Supreme Court chose not to hear the case so they must think there wasn't anything substantive worth reviewing beyond the circuit ruling.) But that lawsuit would have to be filed in each of the districts/circuits first whereas a Supreme Court ruling affects everyone immediately.
(That’s a very simple and fast explanation, there are many exceptions and minor details left out, but that covers the basics.)

It depends on what exactly is being argued. For instance, in this DOMA case, only the provision declaring the federal government will only recognize opposite-sex marriage is being decided. The provision stating that state’s can ignore other state’s same-sex marriages would be left intact. The Prop 8 case is actually narrow enough that same-sex marriage may be limited to only the 9th circuit or even just California. But the Supreme Court could issue a broader ruling in either of these cases striking down all of DOMA or declaring same-sex marriage a constitutional right. Those outcome are extremely unlikely though as the court rarely exercises its power so broadly.

As far as the hierarchy of laws goes it’s Constitution > Federal Law > State Law > County Law > Local Law. Supreme Court decisions are based on the constitutionality so they trump all rulings and laws other than another Supreme Court decision.

 

OMG am I nervous about this. The Supreme Court today is unlike anything we've seen today. They've been all over the map on "state's rights" issues and Gay Rights at this point in time is seen as a state's rights issue by the opposition. This is going to be a nail biter.

 

The "state's rights" issue is actually the easiest way to strike down DOMA. It goes out of it's way to meddle in marriage which has always been in the state's domain and not federal. It lets the federal government ignore what a state has done and stops states from playing nice with one another. DOMA is a fairly safe case as there are good arguments on both the right and left for why it's a bad law.

 

But the whole point of Section 2 of DOMA is that the power is reserved to the states to make decisions on if they'll even recognize same-sex marriage. You don't think that state sovereignty is going to be the main weapon of the opposition?

Also, I don't trust the conservatives on the court at all. Alito, Roberts, Thomas, and Scalia scare me, honestly. They have a history of not supporting gay rights in the court and have a history of politicising cases.

Anthony Kennedy is our strongest ally in the court right now along with Breyer. Kagan and Sotomayor I haven't seen enough of to form a strong opinion but Sotomayor seems to be a solid Justice who comes out on the liberal side of things. I have a feeling on how Ginsburg would rule, but I'm just not that sure.

I dunno... this is going to be a close one. A 5/4 for sure... but the question is which way?

 

The States shouldn't have the right to dictate. Gay rights honestly should be made on a nationwide level, not Statewide. Other topics? Sure. Human rights? No

 

I don't like it when gay gets compared to black, but this really is similar to the issue of interracial marriage in the US. Loving v. Virginia (the case that legalized interracial relationships nationwide, for you non-Americans) was decided by the Supreme Court, and overrode state law to make it legal. If the Supreme Court had said that it's up to the states, the South (among other places) might still ban interracial relationships. It's really ridiculous that basic rights are managed on a local level- the government needs to intervene.

 

Ah, I forgot the distinction. I thought Section 2 was getting challenged. That's the meat of it. I mean, Section 3 of DOMA is just making sure any federal legislative language pertaining to marriage defines marriage as opposite sex only. Now I'm not as excited :/

I mean, it's still important. It'll start the ball rolling towards true equal rights, which is wonderful. I guess my eyes are bigger than my stomach

 

^ Not only that, but if Section 3 is ruled unconstitutional then it will affect A LOT of binational couples. That alone would make my day in a BIG way.