LGBT News Gay marriage bill: Lords debate 'wrecking amendment'

Things are getting really tense now. They're voting on the bill at 19:00 GMT

Peers have spent several hours debating whether to "wreck" the government's plans to bring in same sex-marriage, ahead of a crucial vote on Tuesday.

The bill, covering England and Wales, was backed by the Commons with a 205 majority, despite 161 MPs opposing it.

Ex-chief constable Lord Dear, who has tabled the amendment aimed at stopping it proceeding any further, called the proposals "ill-considered".

But the government said everyone should have the right to marry.

The Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Bill for England and Wales would allow couples who can currently form civil partnerships to marry.

The debate started early on Monday afternoon and is due to continue on Tuesday, with a vote expected at about 1900 BST.

'Deep concern'

If the bill passes, religious organisations would have to "opt in" to offering weddings, with the Church of England and Church in Wales being banned in law from doing so.

It is backed by Prime Minister David Cameron, his Liberal Democrat deputy Nick Clegg and Labour leader Ed Miliband - 366 MPs voted in favour in the free vote in the Commons.


The bill, which has been criticised by Conservative activists, is expected to face a tough passage through the Lords. If crossbench peer Lord Dear's amendment, aimed at preventing the legislation getting a second reading, were passed, it would effectively kill it.

The former chief constable of West Midlands Police told peers the bill was "ill-considered" and sought to "overturn centuries of tradition".

It was "blind to the laws of unintended consequences", he added, calling homosexuals "a very small minority".

Lord Dear also said: "The concept should be sent back to the drawing board. This is too serious a matter to be hurried through on a whim and in a cavalier fashion."

But equalities minister Baroness Stowell of Beeston said: "For gay and lesbian couples this matters. It matters because it means the final acceptance of who they are."

She added that discrimination against homosexuals was "wrong" and that "no religion or faith would be required to change its beliefs or doctrines" as a result of the bill.

Same-sex marriage was "new and different" but would "not affect the nature of existing marriage", Lady Beeston said.

Baroness Royall, Labour's leader in the Lords, said she understood the bill had caused "anguish" for some people of faith, but she did not understand the argument that gay marriage could "harm marriage between a man and a woman".

'Not discrimination'

But the Archbishop of Canterbury, the Most Rev Justin Welby, told the Lords the plans would "weaken" existing marriage, adding that ministers were confusing "equality" with "uniformity".

He added: "I and many of my colleagues retain considerable hesitations about this bill."

Conservative former cabinet minister Lord Tebbit: "This bill is promoted as a measure to end discrimination against homosexuals, but the present law of marriage does not discriminate against homosexuals.

"The rights of a homosexual man are identical to mine. Subject to the laws on incest and bigamy, we are both free to marry a woman. Neither he nor I may marry another man. Our positions are identical."

And Labour's Lord Anderson of Swansea challenged Mr Cameron to hold a referendum on the issue, saying: "Surely this proposed change is far more fundamental to our society than any transfer of power to Brussels."

He said the prime minister "and his friends can put their case", but added that "many of us - Conservatives, Labour and crossbenchers - will be on the other side. Let the people decide."

Some 86 peers are expected to speak in the debate with a final vote due on Tuesday evening.

The Conservative Grassroots group has called on peers to reject the bill, but Mr Cameron hopes it will become law soon and that the first ceremonies can take place by next summer.

The Scottish government has confirmed it will introduce a bill shortly to allow same-sex marriage.

 

They didn't want to be associated with same sex marriage, and if the government forced them to do it, then they said they would split from the government. Effectively this meant we won't have much in one of out government houses, the house of lords. This is where the C of E are heavily active, hence why things are tense, and have a possibility to go down the plughole so to speak.

---------- Post added 4th Jun 2013 at 03:39 PM ----------

I should know this haha, but I'm not too sure. I think it needs royal assent and some other minor things before coming into law, but that wouldn't take long I'm sorry, maybe someone more educated in this field could help you out with answering that one.

 

Hmmm, try telling that to some of the people in the house of Lords though. It's stupid really, they just don't seem to get it. It's like they are just putting their views into this whole thing without considering anybody else's. I mean, personally, I think that David Cameron should have put the entire thing up for a referendum.

On another note, I'm still rather sceptical about the whole bill and whether it will pass or not. Look at Illinois (even though they aren't really comparable, but hold with me) everyone thought that one was going to pass, but then nothing happened. Everyone has high hopes, and if this law does get 'struck down (even know it's apparently exceedingly rare) then I'll be very upset, and I will know that somewhere in the USA, NOM will be laughing and partying, and that makes me angry...

 

It's not really the UK that's the problem (Maybe Northern Ireland) when it comes to this issue. The majority want the bill to be passed. It's the religious heads in the political system who are causing all of the trouble.

And I hope that DOMA is struck down! The desicion must be soon now? This month isn't it?