Hello, thank you for checking out my post. Warning though, I'll probably rant making it long, poorly punctuated and full of typos. So I came out to my parents at the end of last year. Things have been pretty tense between my parents and I. The end I last year I also was Hospitalized twice for attempting suicide which also shook up my parents, causing even more tension. I also started self-harming which had also caused a nice amount of tension.. And on a personal note, looking into science and philosophy I just no longer believe in God. I use to, he REALLY mattered to me and I wish I were still religious. I just honestly can't believe in that stuff anymore. I'm also 17 which is a difficult time for any teenager. Basically, I went from being 1 of 6 kids who was rarely noticed to the gay 1 who's cranking up medical bills and dealing with mild depression. Yeah, kinda accidentally screwed up the hole family dynamic... Everyday things are just rough for myriad of reasons. On a depression note, I've in general been doing better. I stopped self-harming (I don't necessarily feel comfortable enough to say "quit" yet) and would say things are looking better. I feel better about not having a afterlife and having importance simply be whatever we assign importance too. (If you don't agree with me please just don't bash me on this thread..) Anyhow today I felt real sad. I just lost hope in things getting better. My parents noticed I was extra sad today and my Dad came to my bedroom to talk with me. I was mostly feeling down about schooling because I feel really overwhelmed by my workload. But my Dad came in and asked me the amazing question "Are you sure you're gay?". Don't get me wrong it wasn't like a rude "Ugh! You done with your phase yet?!" kinda thing. It was him kinda just finalizing for himself that I'm being serious. From there I spoke to him about a few of my problems. The conversation somehow turned into me saying it hurts me that they won't allow me to come out to my little brother.(9yo) My dad said something about how if they told him about guys dating guys and girls dating girls than they'd have to explain sexuality and sex to them. I told him talking about a same-sex couple doesn't result in children who don't know what sex is asking about sex. He than told me about how he couldn't handle it at this age. (Because 2 dudes dating is like rocket science?) I told him that if he expects his 9 yo to combat him with questions like "How would 2 guys have sex anyhow?" that hes way overthinking. Ain't no little kid going to make everything sex based like my parents apparently do. LOL He got on about procreation and what would they tell him about where they get their baby's. I told him he's 9 years old and doesn't know where baby's come from altogether. Like seriously this kid is homeschooled by my extremely conservative parents he doesn't know where tf a child comes from. He certainly isn't going to ask sex/procreation questions. My dad than said It's to much to tell him about that kinda thing. He's 9 he only needs to know about the natural way. (The part I get mad when I shouldn't have because I'm an idiot who needs to keep it together) I than asked him what he just said LOL He referred to straight as the "Natural Way" again and I asked him why he would say something like that. He said gayness isn't the natural way, it can't procreate. I than go on for about 15 mins on homosexuality IS natural rant. My rant went all over the place. LOL Starting with animals can be gay, ending with rocks are natural even though they can't procreate and everything in between. He told me a man and a woman are the natural way again. I than asked him if I'm not natural what am I. He than kinda just said I'm not saying you're unnatural, just homosexuals. which made me ask him if he thought I was born this way or if something unnatural happened to me to make this way. He said he doesn't know. I told him to take it from me, I do know it's natural. He than went on this rant on how he'll respect me and believe me when I say it's something you're born with- But still insisted that it's unnatural. The hole conversation really upset me and left me in a worse mood than before. I know I shouldn't have gotten myself so caught up in the word natural. But I lost it, I wasn't going to settle for him telling me I'm unnatural or something. Sorry this post is big and boring. Thank you to anyone who read the hole thing! You're awesome LOL
ugh...avoiding talking about sex with your children is exactly how they have accidents...your dad is going to have that talk someday, like it or not. And you're right, too - kids won't just start asking how two people do it. I understand you're upset. Your dad chose some very poor words to have with you. But you know what, you said it yourself - he's quite conservative, and I'm guessing religious? I know you probably feel like he's had plenty of time to come to terms with your coming out, but time is weird, and everyone goes through these things in their own time. He's only on the tail end of the first stages of acceptance now, from the sound of it. You have every right to be upset, and I'd never tell you otherwise. And now comes the hard part - standing your ground and slowly blowing holes in your dad's perceptions of gay people while remaining the strong one! Use tact. Don't blow up in his face. Give him more time. And don't be afraid to vocalise why things hurt you when they do, like you did about not being able to talk to your brother. That talk didn't go anywhere this time, but sooner or later he'll have to realise that you're not going to wake up one day and decide you're hetero. Good luck and hang in there, and remember - however many days it's been now since you've harmed yourself, you're that much stronger, that much closer to being in control of your impulses. I used to hurt myself, so I know what it's like to deal with that. It gets easier over time.
Guff, your parents have very conservative beliefs that are shaped to a great extent by their interpretation of the Bible and what the leadership of their church tells them. Unless they are prepared to countenance a different way of thinking about religion (which is possible), it's always going to be the case that they regard heterosexuality as the highest standard in human relationships -- or as your father crudely put it, "natural". To them, sex is a vehicle to procreation and creating happy families. I'm not asking you to accept their ideas or even remain silent when you are so affronted by what they say, but they have been conditioned into thinking as they do over a lifetime and it's very hard to shake those beliefs or moderate their thinking when somebody in a position of power and influence is preaching a different message to them every Sunday. By all means speak your mind and say how you totally disagree, but please try to avoid arguments. When you argue with conservative parents about your sexuality they don't see it as their fault at all. Instead they transfer the blame onto your sexuality -- they don't appreciate that it's their attitude and ignorance that is causing the problem. In their mind, your sadness, self harming and suicide attempts will be a direct manifestation of homosexuality and that's why your Dad asked if you are sure you are gay. He and your mom believe this is the causative issue. I don't know if you have read about the parent/family stages of grief in the resources area, but here is a link to it Empty Closets - Parent and Family Stages of Grief Your parents are completely stuck in this process Guff and to that extent they are struggling too. Not making excuses for them, but trying to help you to understand and realise how futile it is to argue. Helpful resources are available for parents, if they wish to put in the effort and reach out for support, but it's a decision they must make. I don't think they are there just yet. It's more likely that they are attempting to find support from within their comfort zone, i.e. the church. Tell me, why is it important to you to tell your 9 y/o brother? How would it change things for you if he were to know now?
There is a scene in one of my favorite movies from the 80's, Parenthood, that your comment about upsetting the family dynamics reminds me of. By way of backdrop, if you have not seen the movie, it is about family dynamics, the interrelationship between family members, the perception of dysfunction within the family, but where everyone still loves one another. In one of the scenes, everyone is at the dinner table and the patriarch of the family (Gil), is talking about how complicated family life is (as their family is dealing with multiple competing complexities at the same time). At the table is grandma whom reacts to Gil: Grandma: You know, when I was nineteen, Grandpa took me on a roller coaster. Gil: Oh? Grandma: Up, down, up, down. Oh, what a ride! Gil: What a great story. Grandma: I always wanted to go again. You know, it was just so interesting to me that a ride could make me so frightened, so scared, so sick, so excited, and so thrilled all together! Some didn't like it. They went on the merry-go-round. That just goes around. Nothing. I like the roller coaster. You get more out of it. After Grandmas speech about the rollercoaster, Gil's wife responds how much she likes grandma and how smart she is. The point being, you might think your disrupting the family dynamics, but in actuality, family dynamics are always complicated and are always disruptive. Just like a rollercoaster. And parents understand this, it is the part of being a parent. Putting your parents religious beliefs aside, it does seem like your parents love you and want to understand you. While your father might not be using a good choice of words, he is taking the time to sit and talk with you which shows more love than you might realize.
Looking back I did do a crummy job on saying this, I totally regret arguing with my dad over something so stupid. Had my dad said "The normal way", "The real way" or "right way" I probably would have held it together which I totally believe I should have. But something about "Natural" really got me. And I regret letting it. It was a bad move on my part. The reason I was talking about my little brother is because on a usual night my other little brother 15yo and my 9yo brother are together in our basement, Playing video games or something. I came out to my 15yo brother. (The 1st person I ever came out too) It was hard and he took a bit before he started hanging out with me again. But now were back on good terms. The main objective I me having had come out to him was so that our late at night video game conversations could be a place where I didn't have to "hide it". I could feel like I'm open. But my 9yo brothers new bedtime changing from 10 to 11:30 has taken that away from me. Though I don't really care to come out to him, I was just telling my dad 1 of the things I found saddening in hopes he'd understand. Instead I turned it into an argument like the genius that I am. I really should have let it pass.
We do a lot of things in our daily lives that are unnatural. Like driving a car, just because something is seen as "unnatural" that doesn't make it a bad thing. I'm not saying homosexuality is unnatural, but it shouldn't be looked down on even if it were.
I'm sorry Guff. I came out to someone I thought would be supportive, but if I ever bring up sexuality it gets quickly derailed into some other topic. At first they were considerate, but now they just won't hear me out and say I am confused. Well, I was at first. I'm pretty comfortable with myself now. But sometimes you just want an ally to talk to. I hope things get patched up between you and your Dad. I know how it is. I want to come out to my siblings too, but I can't. Sebby
Sorry to hear about all that's going on, Guff. I've got a lot going on too. I hope things get better for you.
I can definitely relate to the religious aspect. I've been surrounded by a very religious Christian church and it has scarred me deeply to the point where I don't know if I believe in God anymore. When I questioned God, they told me they'd pray for me since the Devil was "getting into my mind". I get it and it's really rough to be told that who you are is wrong and sinful. I am also 17 so I know the pressure of being a teenager and the school work, it's insane. I know this isn't really advice, but I'm here to give consolation that there are so many people here listening.
