Nonbinary identities

If you don't feel like a man, then maybe you aren't one? Or perhaps you simply don't like the traditional image of masculinity? Still... there are plenty of feminine transmen, but a common trend seems to be establishing themselves as men before expressing femininity in ways that wouldn't have them pegged as women. This is assuming gender is related to gender expression, though, when that's not always the case.

Are you sure you're not letting the thoughts and actions of others influence you? The whole genderqueer label and movements are relatively new, so of course you're going to have more young people who identify as such, along with less information out there, like there might be for transmen and women. Just like there are a lot of those who will outright deny the existence of bisexuality, there will be those who cannot, will not, see that gender is a lot more complicated than simply man or woman. Even sex is a lot more complicated than simply XY vs XX, or penis vs vagina.

Is it imperative you come to a conclusion right here and now? I'm fine wandering across the world, not knowing where I'll land, but also not really caring, and trying to live each day for itself. Plenty of transfolk make a choice, go back, put something off, question, observe, research, etc. There are plenty of valid reasons for feeling the way you do, but being put down by others should never be one of them. If I did just that, I'd constantly be pulled in many directions at once and suffer another nervous breakdown. In the end, the label matters less than feeling comfortable with yourself.

 

Huh, that's funny, because I've had a similar situation: identifying as a feminine man vs genderqueer. I'm pretty sure at this point, I could condition myself into becoming comfortable with either, but the point is to go with what feels most natural, and like you, that would be genderqueer.

The difference is that you'd be a male, but willing to challenge gender stereotypes. You'd still see yourself as male at the end of the day, just... not a traditional one. I went that route for years, and it felt more like bargaining than anything else, only strengthened by the fact that I don't want to go back to the frustration, the confusion, and the isolation. It could be the same for you, or maybe not, but when you feel that sigh of relief sensation, that could only be a step in the right direction.

When you say you're androgynous, do you mean as presentation, personality, identity? It has nothing to do with masculinity or femininity: look how many feminine gay men are out there, and how many masculine transwomen exist. They're still comfortable with their gender, regardless of whether or not they fit into pre-defined ideas of what makes a "real" man or woman. I only look like an average guy, perhaps a bit sensitive and quiet, but that doesn't change a thing. A lot of people probably see me as some "other" anyway, as "different". Definitely not one of the guys, but neither one of the girls... it's like having your own niche. You're simply... Oddish, in your case.

We define ourselves, basically. I try to take a bit of positive traits from both genders, but this has more to do with my own philosophy and world view, made more possible by my lack of attachment to any one gender in particular. It's almost like being caught in the stands of some rowdy game, with opposing teams on opposite sides. Yeah, I just so happened to find myself on the "male" side, but that doesn't mean I'm a part of the male team, or rooting for them. I'm still trying to figure out just how this game works, and what the appeal of it is!

That probably made less sense than I had hoped...

 

Just, yes. Yes to all that has been said here. Its ironic that both of you have claimed that what you are saying probably doesn't make sense, and it likely doesn't, but I completely understand the not making sense. I believe that we are all on the same page that I have been sitting on for ages now.

Its interesting because I most commonly describe myself as androgynous, yet truthfully my psychological mindset in regards to gender seems as though it would better be described as ambiguous. It isn't simply a matter of not fitting in to gender archetypes, rather, when I honestly think about it, I don't believe I truly comprehend the idea of forming thought under them. The idea of gender essentially feels meaningless in regards to myself. If we take away the fact that I don't prefer to refer to myself as a "Man" because of social connotations and expectations, it still feels empty.

I suppose I can relate it too a family name. You accept and assert your last name because it is simply something that you do. Though, unless you are someone who takes great pride in your family name, its just a name. Its just something that you relay is someone asks. I don't look at myself in the mirror and think "Hey, I'm a Connors. I'm a Johnson. That's who I am. That's me!". I don't actually feel personally connected; it only feels like a social convection.

Likewise with gender, regardless of whether I name myself as a man, woman, androgyne, genderqueer, agender, it all ultimately feels empty when it actually leaves my lips because, to most, it means something; however, to me, it means nothing. I've never experienced that feeling of stumbling across a classification or gender perspective and 'feeling right'. The only reason I accept terms to describe my gender is for the sake of others.

 

I know, right? It's complicated.

For me... I get particularly annoyed when transsexuals say that transitioners or detransitioners who identify as genderqueer, bigender, genderfluid, etc., are either transsexuals in denial or cisgender people who've been misdiagnosed, because it sounds, to me, an awful lot like what the LGBT community, at large, does to the transgender community, which is marginalizing sub-communities simply because they constitute a smaller minority and don't fall into easy binaries (or, in a warped view, somehow detract from their community's legitimacy by being grouped in the same category). To me, that's the most hypocritical form of bigotry there is..

Cause, for me...honestly? Going into transition, I DID want to be female. I wasn't a misdiagnosed cis person...I was soo sure I was 100% trans. But then, after being in transition, I realized I didn't feel 100% female. And it wasn't about self hatred (I don't give a FUCK what society thinks) or not passing (umm, not to toot my own horn, but, yeahh, that was no prob), or any of that bullshit. It was simply that conforming to a female identity felt wrong, to me.

I guess I'm somewhat bigender, but there are lots of parts about gender roles I hate, altogether. I feel like in my idealized view of myself, I see myself as female, but in practice, this (along with female name, pronouns, etc) feels out of place and incongruent with my trueself. Then as male, I don't mind my boy name or male pronouns, but strict male gender roles are graating to me...if someone says "act like a man" or expects me to act a particular way it's like nails on a chalkboard.


What I'm coming to realize, for myself, is that more than anything, I'm just bigender/genderfluid and sorta float between the two. I've also realized I prefer a fixed, male presentation (I've done androgynous/non-binary and it was the hardest on me, of all) but I prefer to reject certain male gender roles as much as possible cause they seem to aggravate the female aspects of my identity.

At the end of the day, the easiest thing for me is just being a gay guy cause that's how I was born, and choosing not to think about the rest or gender in general...genders too complicated and it's hogged up ENOUGH of my fucking life, haha.

Sorry for rambling, just thought I'd share my experience/opinion. I think what you need to do is experiment a bit with your presentation and see what works for you. Don't lock yourself into one identity, cause none of them are tailor made for YOU and who YOU are...mix and match, find what works for you, and wear it, proud!