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I do not understand myself... (Warning: Long and quite possibly a waste of time)

Discussion in 'Gender Identity and Expression' started by Rainbow Lantern, Aug 23, 2016.

  1. Rainbow Lantern

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    I feel like I should just make all of my thread titles this because half of the threads I start are me being confused... anyways, when it comes to gender I am confused. Half the time I have myself convinced I must be genderqueer and the other half I feel like I'm being ridiculous and I'm just a masculine presenting female.


    Personally I like being referred to as manly, masculine, etc (and hate being reffered to as "girly") and I feel really happy and myself when I am wearing men's clothes and my hair short. I recently went to the mall with my sister and wanted to go to the men's section because I only have one pair of pants I am comfortable in. She said we'll just walk by it so I can scan it because she is uncomfortable in the male's section without a male present. This made me kind of sad that she didn't think of me as man enough to make her feel not awkward in the male's section. I also sometimes feel emasculated by guys especially if they are muscular/athletic. I wish I was more muscular (mostly my arms but it would be cool to have abs) and my skinny arms freak me out and make me feel like there is no way people could mistake me as male. And I quite enjoy it when people mistake me for male (not that it's happened but still).


    When I was a kid I had an equal number of male and female friends. However I always wanted to fit in with the guys and I tried to, calling other guys dude, and using a weird more manly voice while saying it (so it was more like duuuude, also I'm pretty sure I got that from TMNT). I was really happy when others called me dude back. But when another girl tried to get in on it, the easily emasculated little kid I was said “but she's a girl, so shouldn't she be dudette?” (Which was rude of me, I know that now.) And then she pointed out that it should be the same for me since I was a girl too and I got pretty mad and said "I'm dude, not dudette" or "I'm a dude" or something like that.

    I also remember when my boobs started growing in I refused to acknowledge them and the fact that I needed to wear a training bra. By the time (or around the time) I finally agreed to start wearing one my mom told me I needed a real bra and I was very upset. When I finally tried it on I was unhappy with what I saw in the mirror and said “but mom they make my boobs look bigger!!!!” Nowadays they are just kind of there and I don't really care as much unless I am trying to present in a more masculine way which I have been doing lately (in that case I try to hunch over, wear a sports bra, and try to hide them).


    But at the same time, when it comes to cosplaying and dance recitals I don't mind wearing female clothes (it is playing a role after all – however in ballet when we partner up or at school during skits I usually want to play the boys role). And when I am working out or in dance class I don't mind wearing the leotard, or a sports bra and leggings (when I am working out I mean) and sometimes actually prefer them because I overheat very quickly (and plus sometimes they make me feel powerful like wonder woman for some weird reason).


    And for the record, I don't think I would mind having male parts too much but I don't have any desire for them (except sometimes the flat chest). And I don't think pronouns make much of a difference for me. Although sometimes I feel like male pronouns feel better over female and vice versa (but it isn't a big deal).


    But when it comes to other gendered words like dude, bro, king/queen (I always used to think of myself as the "king of so and so" instead of queen when it came to that sort of conversation), actor/actress I prefer the male (although I don't know if I would prefer being called son or daughter, uncle or aunt etc but I do enjoy when my sister calls me bro). Which reminds me of I when I was younger I had always wanted to be a cowboy and was offended when my dad or others would say "wouldn't you be a cowgirl?". I also think it would be cool if people called me Devan sometimes but I feel like I would miss my current name. Also for the record, I don't mind being feminine occasionally like in jazz class for example.


    Also, lately when I've been presenting the way I want I've been kind of uncomfortable in the women's washroom – as if I shouldn't be there (I don't know if I am worried someone will think I don't belong there or what but I barely even use public washrooms so I don't know if it is because I have been presenting more masculine lately) but it also wouldn't feel right being in the men's room (mostly because I think I would get called out for it).


    In case that wasn't enough info and because I don't know how to condense these are a few other situations:


    When I was in elementary school I used to tell this one guy “you're such a girl!” (I know it was rude and offensive I and that that was not a good way for me to feel more dominant/masculine, even if I did do it in a teasing manner and even though neither of us took it seriously) to which he would respond: “oh yeah, well – you're such a guy! Oh wait you aren't offended by that...” Then he would get the bright idea to tease me in the same way I teased him and call me a girl and then I would be kind of offended. Basically what I'm saying is even back then I took it as a compliment when people reffered to me as a guy and I liked it, but I hate when people call me a girl or girly (but I still feel okay about being and being perceived as female even though I like being perceived as male).


    More recently my sister had us switch shirts while we were at my dad's so I was stuck in a pink and girly crop top. This made me really uncomfortable... like to a weird extent. Even though it's not like I had to go outside in it I still felt awful in it and was very melodramatic about it (except I was totally serious about how trapped I felt in it) to a point where I actually just tore it off so I was just in my sports bra.


    Sometimes I get jealous of other girls' looks (mainly when they talk about how they have bigger boobs than me and things like that) and others I get jealous of other guys' looks (mostly how they pass as guys better than me and how they become more muscular easier). I still feel very womanly (if that's a word) somtimes but at other times I feel very masculine but I usually feel like a mix of both. I really don't know... Maybe it is just my gender expression that makes me feel that way or because of how much I hated stereotypes about girls and gender roles growing up? I haven't a clue.


    Okay, so if any poor soul read through that whole monstrosity I commend you and apologize for that whopper. What gender does this sound like I could be to you? Or do you think I am trying to convince myself I am something I am not/am just a butch female? I realize no one can tell me my gender but me but I would really appreciate others' input on the matter.


    I apologize for wasting people's time. Also I'm worried I will feel differently about all this again tomorrow (since like I said sometimes I think one thing about my identity with conviction sometimes another)...
     
  2. Synesthesia

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    Yeah I relate to this a lot:

    I do now avoid looking at them in the mirror though, or when I do there's still some discomfort, but I don't mind their shape so much in clothes as long as I'm not wearing this one bra I have that's padded a bit and makes them look bigger D:

    Yes I've gotten that too a few times definitely. I have social anxiety so it's hard to say for sure, but I was at a concert recently and I felt terribly uncomfortable in there because it was very crowded and all women. I don't even present in a way that passes for male btw, I dress androgynously but I can't pass because I'm petite, I like having longish hair, and my face is too feminine (minus my eyebrows.)

    I'm very rarely envious of how other women look, I especially don't want bigger breasts but at the same time I don't find myself wanting to look like masculine men ever, and sometimes find myself wanting to look more like physically androgynous women.

    Hmm... I do relate to quite a bit of what you've said though there are some differences as well. I think you could be bi-gender or somehow non-binary but I suppose the question is how much is the male identity important to you? How you want others to see you/how you want to live and also how you feel about yourself.

    I think tbh your decision should be mostly formed around feeling comfortable with yourself. I don't want to sound overly cynical but society in the west really isn't at the stage where it can handle people who see their identity as mixed.
     
    #2 Synesthesia, Aug 24, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2016
  3. SkyWinter

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    You don't sound entirely uncomfortable as a girl. Perhaps you just don't conform to gender stereotypes for women? Perhaps you are bigender?

    You mentioned how the pink shirt made you feel uncomfortable so you ripped it off. But then you were presenting to people in a sports bra. In a sense you stripped away a layer of clothing that was covering your breasts which identify you as biologically female. Why would revealing more of your biological body make you more comfortable?
     
  4. Rainbow Lantern

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    Thanks for the replies!

    Yeah I'm not usually jealous of them other nor do I actually want bigger breasts, I just tend to be self-critical so when people point out my "flaws" to me I tend to feel bad (so basically putting that in to me original post was probably pointless).

    Oh I probably should have been more clear with that too. I wasn't actually near anyone except my sister and we weren't really in a public area. That was kind of my way of going topless because I preffered that to the shirt - it's just I can't really go topless, so... Personally I saw the sports bra as less feminine - it is something people work out in (because they can't really go topless and sports bras tend to compress breasts more than regular bras) for convenience/out of necessity whereas crop tops are more of a style/fashion choice.

    Again, thanks for the responses :slight_smile:! It really does help me when I have others' opinions!
     
  5. SkyWinter

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    You're welcome. :slight_smile:

    Okay, well why did you feel so uncomfortable in the pink shirt around your sister? I think you said it felt like crossdressing to you? I assume she would accept you even if you were crossdressing right?

    Why do you consider a sports bra less feminine? Even if it smashes down your breasts for working out it also highlights that you are a woman. I'm bigender and when I present as female part of that is putting on a bra. It instantly makes me look more female.
     
  6. Rainbow Lantern

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    Yeah, but I think I would've felt uncomfortable in that shirt even if I had been by myself. It just makes me feel a lot more feminine than I'm comfortable with whereas sports bras are pretty comfortable so I don't always even notice them. I also don't know if this was a factor but I am used to wearing clothes like that when I'm at dance or working out and I actually was wearing it for a costume for a dance show with my school (I mean it wasn't just that but it was there). Bras are kind of a necessity since I like to do a lot of running and jumps and things whereas crop tops are like fashion statements (which feels like a costume to me - like I was forced to play dress-up in an embarassing costume or something).
     
  7. Orchidea123

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    You said a lot, and very interesting - not a monstrosity like you mentioned :slight_smile:

    I have not much to say since I have not experienced similar situation.
    However, lately I've started to hate regular bras.

    IF I had to be without a shirt, there would be 3 choices: regular bra, sports bra, no bra. Sports bra is the only choice that would make me feel stronger, more masculine. And, I would prefer that.
     
  8. Rainbow Lantern

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    Really? I don't usually think my experiences are that interesting. I wish my teachers would put up with all of my writing and extra things I add in (even when I don't need to) like you do :lol:!

    Yeah I haven't been liking regular bras much lately either. I find sports bras much better. I agree with you.
     
  9. SkyWinter

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    Okay, that's fair enough. So where do you think you fall then? Do you think you are a gender non-conformist? Bigender or gender fluid? Something else?
     
  10. Rainbow Lantern

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    Well I'm still not entirely sure (I mean that's why I made this post - to try and get my thoughts down) and I'm still going to try and think about it more. But lately I've been leaning towards bigender (usually the definition where it is a mix but sometimes it alternates a little - although my gender expression typically stays the same even when I feel more feminine). I'm just not entirely sure because I don't really get dysphoric about my body - at the most mild discomfort (more so when I was a kid). But when I am presenting a certain way I do get that "this is right" feeling.
     
  11. Matto_Corvo

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    Not all transgender people feel dysphoria. There are many, me included, who feel gender euphoria more.

    Just some food for thought.
     
  12. Rainbow Lantern

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    Thanks :slight_smile:. It's helpful to hear others feel this way because I've seen a lot of comments of people saying you can't be trans or genderqueer without dysphoria. Which is ridiculous because they're basically calling some people not trans enough but it still gets to me sometimes.
     
  13. Matto_Corvo

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    Google Sam Dylan Finch. He is a non-binary trans man that writes a lot about these topics. He has always been a great help for me.

    Sadly there is a lot of policing in the trans community, and we are split between those who think you have to have dysphoria , and those who don't. I think it is mostly fear that drives some people to invalidate other. The main thing to know is that there is no one way to be trans. Everyone has a difference experience and will have a different outcome.
     
  14. SkyWinter

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    That's a good point. I'm more prone to gender euphoria than dysphoria.
     
  15. Rainbow Lantern

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    Wow, thanks! I just looked some of his articles up - they're really good.

    Yeah, that's true. Thanks for all the help :slight_smile:

    ---------- Post added 25th Aug 2016 at 09:37 PM ----------

    Agreed.
     
    #15 Rainbow Lantern, Aug 25, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2016