Firstly, there is no structure to this, just paragraphs of my thoughts as I was writing, so I apologise in advance if it's hard to read or doesn't make a particular amount of sense. Hi, I'm not exactly sure where to start. Basically I'm pretty sure I'm gay. I've always been more attracted to guys than girls, but I do find girls attractive. I've had intimate occasions with both sexes, both were good! I feel like I want a relationship with a guy, but I'm not sure if I want to be married to a guy when I'm older. I like the idea of having a family. I'm not sure if my attraction to females is actual attraction or that of the societal norm. I've come out to a few people as unsure but basically bi. I feel like it's too hard to come out to my parents as unsure, so I feel like I fit into the 'gay' stereotype. Even though I'm extremely straight acting and the people I've told have been surprised, but supportive none the less. In my head, the reason I feel worried about coming out is for the fact some people won't like me. I know this sounds a bit obvious and silly, but I thrive in life by being very approachable and having a diverse wide friend group. I can honestly say I know of no one that hates me or particularly dislikes me. I can't stand it if someone has a problem or doesn't like me, so I will try my absolute best to make friends with them. I know it sounds a bit needy and weird but that's how I enjoy life, sort of being friends with everyone and enemies with no one. My demeanour is that of being extremely positive, so no one really knows I'm a bit depressed. I feel like I can't talk to anyone with my problems, I feel like I'm being selfish by telling them my problems. I'd rather help them with theirs and make sure they are happy. I hate it when I show weakness is the best way to put it I guess. I feel like being gay is a weakness in way, because in the environment I work in (military) is accepting but slightly homophobic. Mainly as 'gay' is a derogatory term with an ambiguous use. I'm not really making that much sense, but basically, I feel like anything I do if I come out will be because I'm gay. i.e. Anything I can't do that other lads can will be because I'm 'gay', whilst now, if I make a mistake or can't do something it's a laugh. I feel like I'm being almost homophobic about myself, but not of any other lgbt person. I drink too much to cope, not like getting smashed every night, but I pretty much drink every night. Most of the time it is with other people and not by myself. I know I need to tell my parents, but I'm not even sure myself, I feel like I've labelled myself as bi when coming out to a couple of people to make me seem more normal I guess. I feel like being camp is being gay, which is viewed as weak in the society that I'm in. Basically I don't want to be viewed like that. I know that sounds a bit homophobic, I mean I find camp people funny but irritating, I don't however have a problem with someone being camp at all. I also don't particularly like male gay affection in public where there are straight people if that makes sense. It's not that I don't like seeing it, it's just I feel uncomfortable because I know it will make other people uncomfortable. To summarise all this randomness, I think ultimately I am gay, but scared to be fully gay because of the hetero-normative societial views. I basically feel it will make me weaker than my peers. If I do something that someone doesn't agree with, it will be because I'm gay and put a negative connotation on the gay label. I know I haven't really asked any questions, but I just feel like I need advice.
I'm gonna tackle this paragraph by paragraph, I hope that's okay It makes plenty of sense! Very articulate, if you ask me. It can be incredibly confusing trying to figure it all out. The good news is, you don't really need to conform to a particular label (although there a plenty to choose from, if you wish). Also, if the idea of having a family is a big issue for you, remember that it is possible to have a family with another guy, whether through adoption or surrogacy. I'm glad that you've been met with supportive responses, that's awesome! Like I said before, there are a bunch of different labels and whatnot. If you're, say, emotionally attracted to both men and women, but only sexually attracted to men (for example), then you could call yourself gay and biromantic. Honestly, the terminology doesn't matter. There are so many terms that it gets kinda confusing at times (at least for me). Honestly, I can understand this. I have dealt with this fear before, because I have always been the kind of person that wants to get along with absolutely everyone. Unfortunately, we all have to accept that we can't please everyone--there will always be people with whom we don't quite mesh, if that makes any sense. You don't have to be straight to be approachable, though Also, you don't sound needy or weird...it's pretty common to want to be liked. Your desire to help others is quite admirable, first of all. It's understandable that you might feel selfish sharing your problems (I feel that way a lot, myself), but remember--everyone has problems, and we all need help sometimes. None of us need to be in this alone. Even if you don't wish to speak to those in your life about your feelings, hopefully you can be comfortable asking for advice on these forums It's a supportive place (and I say this having only joined 2 weeks ago). I'm not sure what to say about this bit, although I have heard similar anecdotes about the military. It's a shame that there's still so much homophobia in that environment. I wish I could say something helpful here... This is a surprisingly common feeling. Many people who are questioning or deciding whether or not to come out experience this. Hell, plenty of people who are already out experience this. It's much easier to judge yourself than others (usually), and that goes for just about everyone. I know it sounds silly, but try to have a bit of compassion for yourself, even in small amounts. It might be difficult at first, but it's quite possible (this is coming from someone who beats herself up on a regular basis for everything). I can relate to this one, too. On one hand, it's good that you aren't drinking alone. On the other hand, I implore you to be careful. Drinking can help you feel better temporarily, but in the long run, it's just going to hurt you (but you probably know that already). That doesn't sound homophobic, honestly. It sounds wary, and that's a normal reaction to your sort of situation. I'm assuming, also, that "camp" means rather effeminate? I might be wrong, so correct me if so. I'm sorry that you have to deal with such narrow-mindedness...it sucks, I know. As for your uncertainty, remember, you don't really have to have a label (though I can understand wanting one...if you look beneath my user name, you will see that I use a label, myself). Do and say what makes you comfortable for now, and try not to let anyone pressure you to fit a specific stereotype (easier said than done, I realize). It would be easy to jump on this part and say "Oh, if it makes you uncomfortable, maybe you're straight?"...but I can't say that, to be quite honest. There was a point where I was a bit uncomfortable seeing women together in public, even though I knew that I was attracted to women myself. I think may be your own, and it's simply being projected. That's just a possibility however...I can't say for sure. Any mistakes you make have nothing to do with your sexuality, I can assure you of that. They have to do with the fact that you are a human being, and every last one of us screws up from time to time. Your sexual orientation does not make you weak, no matter what people might tell you. There will always be close-minded people out there, and that sucks...but there are so many who are accepting to balance it out. Society has a long way to go as far as escaping heteronormativity, but I think we're getting there (slowly but surely). I hope I helped a tiny bit. I tried, anyway Good luck with everything, and send me a message if you ever need to talk! (Sometimes it helps to vent to a stranger, believe me)
I was very much like you at your age and didn't come fully out until I was 30. I had all the same reservations you describe. I've always been really solid on the outside, someone you could really depend on. I never complained and with the exception of my closest friends, I never seemed to have any problems at all (that was far from the truth). I was less tolerant of "gay acting" people than you are (I love them dearly now) because I grew up on military bases and shared the same homophobic attitudes of the culture I was surrounded by. I was not at all gay acting and in general felt very out of place with myself for a long time. I am predominately gay but somewhat bisexual and capable of loving and enjoying sex with women, but I guess I've always known I could never bond with a woman to the level I can with a man. When I fell in love with my male roommate (he was most likely gay as well but we were both closeted to each other, long story) I knew I had to accept this as who I am come out all the way. When I did I amazed myself by how quickly and forcefully I became a gay activist. I saw the damage that being closeted was doing to others like me and had to try and stop it. I turned all my strength toward being a role model and advocate for them. So, as a caregiver yourself, give at least some consideration to what you can do for other gays while you make your decision about coming out all the way. It may get tougher for you, especially in the beginning, but you will help so many people who are just like you, just by being out. Many more than you will ever know. But what matters most now is what you think. Do you think you would feel better about yourself in the long run if you came out all the way? Would all you would be able to accomplish by being out make it worth it?
First thing to say, it all made perfect sense. It might have seemed random as you typed it out, but I followed it without any problems. Might not be able to say the same about my response though It sounds like you have pretty much accepted in your own mind that you are gay, but societal pressures, personal tastes, wants and needs are holding you back from embracing the idea fully. It's totally okay if you are not ready to go that far yet, in fact it's far better to not heap pressure on yourself and pick a label until you are sure. You'll just box yourself in and end up feeling trapped. The fact that you still find the opposite sex attractive is not beyond the realms of possibility, even if you identify as gay. Being gay doesn't switch off your ability to see beauty in the opposite sex, but it will determine how you respond to it. For example, I could look at women (as a gay man) and tell you if they are pretty/attractive, but I'd have no urge to follow that up with anything romantic or sexual. On the other hand, if I see an attractive or fit guy, my responses are very different (except I'm in a relationship, so can only look). :icon_bigg You said you can't imagine yourself being married to another guy and that's fair enough. There are many gay men who would have no wish to marry, even though they can now. Bear in mind also, that adoption and fostering services are crying out for gay parents, but even having your own kids shouldn't be ruled out entirely. It is possible, if you really want it. We live in a society where the gay stereotypes are still quite strong, even though really strong and masculine guys are coming out in greater numbers. Some people still retain the idea that all gay men like shopping for clothes and cosmetics, walk down the street with a 'mince' and speak with a hint of campness. It's all crap. Everyday, you'll walk down the street and pass other gay men without giving them a second glance because they'll look just like any other man. Think of the Welsh Rugby player, Gareth Thomas. I totally understand that coming out is a risk and some people may dislike you for it, but if they're not disliking you for being gay, they'll find some other reason. I know you say you try hard to make everyone like you, but life isn't like that. It's human nature for people to pick fault with others, even if they're not doing it to your face. Personally, I gained more from coming out than I ever lost. So, yes, the term "gay", "poof", "queer" does get used, but the gay community has largely taken ownership of those words now and they don't carry the level of offence that they might have done a few years ago. Many of us identify as "queer" without getting too hung up on the meaning of the word. You can easily take ownership of words and turn them around to put straight friends or colleagues in their place. Take your time with this and don't heap too much pressure on yourself. Don't bottle up your feelings either, you can always post on here and say what's on your mind and get some support.
Firstly, thank you Undertow for taking the time to read each paragraph indepently and tackling the issues one by one. I understand that labelling yourself can be the wrong idea to do. However, to be able to come out with any certainty in others, I feel like they need to be able to label me to understand. If I come out as bi, I will be seen as gay but scared to admit it. I especially don't want to be one of the bi now gay later people, as I'm confident that bisexuality is a true thing! As in reality, I see myself as gay but scared to admit it in all honesty! I feel like creating a family with a guy is possible and something to think about. Again, I need to just speak to people about my problems, these responses have helped an enormous amount as it's the first time I've been fully truthful to anyone! It is a weird environment, there is an openly gay man that I work with, but I don't see him as that approachable with my confusion. I feel like hopefully I would surprise people with coming out, thus breaking down the 'every gay is camp and likes shopping' view people have. It good to know that I'm not the only one that has felt this way! I do understand the dangers all to well! It's just an easy solution as I don't really think about it if I'm with other people and especially when drinking. By camp, I do mean effeminate, just the stereotypical 'gay' really. As I said earlier, I feel like I need to label myself to come out. It just seems easier! I think I am gay, just scared to admit it to myself in a way. I personally find it great when I see same sex affection, it's just that if your standard guy saw two lads being affectionate with each other, then he would be uncomfortable, which makes me uncomfortable, as I know it could be me being with another lad I guess. As I said earlier, I don't like to make anyone cringe or be weirded out, because I would like to be liked by everyone. I think deep down I do know this. Sexuality doesn't define your person, just whom you are attracted to. I should be stronger with myself about sexuality, I should know it doesn't make people weak, but I guess that's what's been drilled into my head by my peers. If they actually knew, I doubt they would actually be anywhere near as offensive.. At least I hope! You certainly did help, quite a lot! Thanks very much!
Thanks for the response Monraffe I guess it's comforting to know that I'm not/wasn't the only one still in the closet beyond my teenage years. Especially as I feel like I've left it late! Again, it's comforting to know I'm not the only one that felt this way, almost excluded by both the straight and gay community. It's not a brilliant culture to be in, but I feel like they may be more reserved if they learned of my sexuality.. Hopefully. I feel like I need to be in a relationship, not just sexually, with a guy before I can actually know whether or not I actually like women, if that make sense? I'm glad that you've made an enormous effort to help others that were in your position at some point in their life, thus, making it easier for me to come out. I wish everyone had the same morales as you! This is one of the reasons I want to come out. I hope that if people know I'm gay, it will break the normal 'gay' stereotypes that people expect. Especially as there is few gays from my local town, all of whom could be seen as stereotypical. So I guess, how can we blame them for having that view of the gay community? I mean look at any tv show, the gay people are almost always camp. It's not exactly doing wonders to break the stereotypes and almost gain respect for the wider gay community, as they only know what they see. I guess this frustrates me a little bit, as I said, I feel like that stereotype is viewed negatively and weak. Which I don't really want to be associated with at the moment! I guess my views will change when I come out! The other main reason is that of my personal well-being. It gets a bit complex. Basically, I have my work colleagues and friends, none of which know. Then I have my friends and family from home, a couple of them know, most don't. Both these groups are completely separate. I then have a small group of gay friends, all of whom know. These again are a separate group. Pretty much no one knows anyone from each group. So all the truth, lies and all in between is different in each group. So I have to be so careful what I say depending on whom I'm with at the time. If I go out with the gay group, I have to lie to both the other groups, but not to people that know... Saying to one that I went out with friends from home, then to the other group that I went out with friends from work. I'm surprised I've never slipped up, even whilst drunk! It's scares me how much of a good liar I am! I hope that coming out won't hamper my efforts with progressing in life. Like you say, I will probably be able to help a few others by doing so. But ultimately I need to come out for me I guess, the crazy web of lies and leading several different lives is taking up a lot of my energy, and it only keeps getting worse the longer I leave it! Thanks!
Thanks for the reply Linco! After reading your replies, and replying to them myself, I do feel as if ultimately I am actually gay. But in reality I am scared of being fully gay because of the environment I live in. I guess this will come in time. I do feel as though I find women attractive, but not anywhere near as guys. So this is where I get confused to whether or not I feel the need to be attracted to women to be normal. Or if it is real attraction. I see the beauty none the less. I feel the need to conform to a label of being gay, to enable me to come out. To then be able to have a more than sexual relationship with a guy. This would then let me know if my attraction to women is real or just if it's what I think I should be feeling. It's more that I can't see myself not being married in the future, but they do seem like very good options! I feel this is one of the reasons I'm scared to be fully gay. I do not embrace stereotypes, but the only part of the lgbt community they see it's what's obvious to them, for gay men, it's camp gays that conform to the stereotypes. Television does nothing to help this either. So I guess it's hard to blame the wider community when they know almost nothing different, unless specifically they have been involved in a situation to know better. This is what I feel has held me back a bit in coming out earlier, or actually even being sure about myself if I am gay. I think I just need to learn that the world isn't the perfect place we hope it will be! It's filled with negativity, debasement and hypocrites. I just need to convince myself to be stronger in myself almost. I hope I will gain an enormous amount from coming out. If for no one else, myself. As I explained in my reply to Monraffe, my situation is perhaps a little bit more complex than some peoples. I have created an complex web of lies, living different lives, to keep everyone 'happy' as I did see it. By 'happy' I mean me being 'straight'. It's so mentally draining I don't think I could explain it to anyone outside they lgbt community. I've surprised myself that I can cope with so many things going on at once and still be able to be seen as a happy, outgoing, active guy. After thinking about this, I guess I should take that as a positive to use when I get all the trouble (difficulty understanding, hurtful questions/words, etc..) that comes with coming out, knowing that if I can deal with what's been going on for the last few years, I can deal with people's stupidity, ignorance and arrogance. Being in the military, I'm fairly used to all of what would probably be seen by bullying by many, but it's just how the military works, it's not spiteful! So I don't think it would trouble me that much on that front! I feel like I've left it too late to come out already, as everyday my web of lies gets larger, becoming more difficult to keep going, which piles self pressure to come out and label myself. However, I do bottle all of this up. So I guess it's not that healthy for me. That's why I'm so happy that people have replied, as it feels like a massive weight off my shoulders being truthful.. For once! Thanks again!
@BrenUK I was older than you when I eventually came out for the first time and I'd done a pretty good job weaving my own web of lies. I was evasive and secretive and at times I just had to tell blatant lies to cover my tracks. Why did I do it? For most of the reasons you've been doing it. Coming out means telling the truth about ourselves and we can only do that by destroying the web of lies. It can be very hard to climb down from a position of deceit to telling the whole truth though, but we need to do it. In telling the truth about ourselves, we need to explain to people why we lied for all that time so they fully understand what we've been going through. People need to understand why it's so damn hard to just say "I'm gay/bi...". Let's face it, nobody in their right mind would choose to live a lie, but so many GLBT do that every single day. If you read this forum, you can see how and why it happens and realise you are not the only one. Many of us are coming out much later in life. We even have a dedicated section on the forum for people who are coming out at a much later stage. It's heavy going and really stressful, but it's never too late.
