Christian(Especially Catholic): LGBT...advice?

“The day is not far off when we will have to answer to these people who through the years have been humiliated, whose rights have been ignored, whose human dignity has been offended, their identity denied and their liberty oppressed. What is more we will have to answer to the God who created them”

It's widely known that these comments were made to an audience of Cardinals at the Vatican by none other than future Pope John Paul I. He made the comments with the permission of Pope Paul VI, while he was Patriarch of Venice.

Fast forward to 2014 and you can see some remarkable similarities in tone and leadership from the current Pope Francis, who, it seems to me is looking at unfinished business from 1978.

I'm an Anglican and you may know that opinions about sexuality are very divisive within my Church. In the USA/Canada the Episcopal Church is largely tolerant and accepting, in the UK the Church of England tries to sit on the fence and please everyone and no-one but in many parts of Africa the Anglican Church is wildly homophobic and intolerant. So how do I, as a practising Anglican, square this? Well, I look to the former Archbishop of Capetown, Desmond Tutu for inspiration. He said:

"I would refuse to go to a homophobic heaven. No, I would say sorry, I mean I would much rather go to the other place...
"I would not worship a God who is homophobic and that is how deeply I feel about this...
"I am as passionate about this campaign as I ever was about apartheid. For me, it is at the same level."

So, if a beloved Pope of your Church and a deeply revered leader of my Church reach pretty the same conclusion, I'm happy.

I have searched my conscience about this issue many times over and I cannot accept that my sexual orientation is sinful or wicked in the eyes of God. I will not allow people to quote a few passages of scripture (out of their original context, meaning or language) to disrespect me or try to separate me from the God who loves me and I love in return. For if God is love, then what do I have to fear? My relationship with my partner is monogamous and founded on love above anything else.

So when I hear any poisonous opinions from people who call themselves Christian, I go back to the words of John Paul I and Desmond Tutu and my mind is settled.

I hope yours will be too.

 

I'm not sure if I should respond...

I'm not a Catholic, though a Christian (still, I am not sure for how long I will remain so) and I don't think I should give you any relationship advice as I am terribly inexperienced.

But I do get your struggle. The past months, and still continuing, I'm trying to find a way to reconcile my faith with my being gay. I'm not sure if I can or should, or even still want to ...

A part of me wants to toss my faith away as far as I can, because of all the hurt attached to it, and if I decide to come out, loads more to come (or so I expect). But another part of me feels that I don't want to do so and that I shouldn't have to either!
That there should be a way to have/do both; to have a same sex relationship and be a Christian.

Of course, there are plenty of churches that are inclusive and that are able to reconcile the two: if I stay religious I will probably join one of them. I realize that that may not (yet?) be an option for you. So all I can do is share a few resources that might help you.

They might not all be Catholic resources but they do address the issue of being gay/acting on it/being Christian:

(for one thing: apparently there have been gay marriages in the church in the 8th century!)

Transcript - Matthew Vines

Ancient Christian Church Performed Gay Marriages? Historian's Claims Spark Controversy

Did The Catholic Church Ordain Gay Weddings?

Would Jesus Discriminate? - Jesus affirmed a gay couple

Would Jesus Discriminate? - Jesus said some are born gay

Would Jesus Discriminate? - The early church welcomed a gay man

Books:

God and the Gay Christian: The Biblical Case in Support of Same-Sex Relationship
Torn: Rescuing the Gospel from the Gays-vs.-Christians Debate

I have to be honest about not having read the books myself but have read about them. However, the listed websites have been a help for me to see a possibility of being both a practicing gay and a Christian. I have always heard about having to live in celibacy if you're gay and, frankly, I don't want to.

I think it is an easy opinion to have for straight Christians (which I considered myself to be for a long time) and a hurtful one at that. As it pretty easily glosses over all the hurt and loneliness that comes with that (not freely chosen) celibacy. Because priests choose it willingly, but gays don't: it is a rule that is imposed on them and feels like a cruel one.

So, for me, if I can find a way to reconcile the two, and I would really like that, it would make me quite happy. However, I've been pretty miserable with parts of my faith for too long and so I'm not entirely sure if I want to or should hold onto it.

Forgive me if this comment is too honest or maybe crude: it is simply my own opinion and struggle.

 

I'm a Christian and I have to admit that this is one area where I still struggle, but I believe its because of what "the church" (any Christian/Catholic church) has said about being gay, not what I think God thinks of it.

In studying history one of the most consistent themes I have encountered is the interpretation of the bible being used as a tool to control certain groups of people.

I HIGHLY recommend reading the new testament without commentary from other people. I'd also recommend the KJV as most other more contemporary translations have had the word malakoi translated as "homosexual" within the last 40ish years.

As you read discard what you have been taught in church (I know this may be somewhat a struggle for a Catholic... I was considering converting and still am considering it, to be honest) and try to get the overarching theme of the new testament. In fact, I would just read all 4 gospels and leave out the epistles to the churches for now. As you read, ask yourself what the message is.

 

Aspen, I kind of know how you feel. Thanks for posting. I'm completely new to this blog. I've always been a devout Catholic. In recent years, I have been struggling with finding out if God really exists. Because of that, I now consider myself agnostic. I still go to Mass because I find comfort there.
I tell myself I am bi, but wonder if I'm really just gay. I have not come out to anyone yet.
I recently met a guy, who is the most incredible person I've ever met. He is gay and the kindest person I have ever met. We both like each other very much. I have never dated a guy before, but every time I see him, I gain the courage to want to come out. Maybe that's what love is.
I don't have the answer for you, but maybe we can journey this together. I have never had depression, and I am a very optimistic person. I just joined this forum because I feel so depressed and lonely lately. Most of my friends are also devout Catholics. Resu, thank you for your link on that particular priest. It was comforting.

 

I am a Christian and I know how you feel. I struggle with religion alot. One thing I know is that God dosent make mistakes. God is love he loves us all. If you love someone go for it. God wants to see us all happy. Dont forget, there was once a time when African Americans were considered "ungodly" and were not allowed in churches. It may take time but maybe people will start to see that there is nothing wrong with being who you are. God loves you dont forget that. I wish you the best and know that you are in my prayers. Best of Luck

 

First to the OP, although I am not Catholic, my mom's side is all Catholic. I moderated one of the biggest Christian websites and served on a "unity panel" between Catholics and Protestants. I love my Catholic brothers and sisters very much.

Like Melanie, I thought of converting, seriously pondering RCIA classes and the whole 9. Most churches, Protestant and Catholic, believe that temptation for lust is not sin as you have pointed out, OP. The trick is to dig deeper and do a word study from the original text.

Sidenote: Pope Francis is trying to get the ball rolling. There is a lot to be done, all while he continues to bridge the gap between the poor and the rest of society. He has a lot on his plate.

As has pointed out, whether we use the RSV, KJV, or the New American Bible as the Church does, it is important to look at the Greek root words and the language in context with the culture itself. It is not that the Bible is full of errors, but items get lost in translation and original intent. The practice of pedophilia and male prostitution was rampant in the time of the New Testament. Romans had baths and sex slaves on every corner. This is what the Bible was referring to during the time of Jesus and later the apostles. It was not talking about committed, monogamous relationships.

This is the problem with many Catholics and Protestants. They don't dig deep enough and look at context.

I understand that Catholics want to believe everything to the letter of what the Vatican teaches as do Protestants with our statements of faith, but I doubt you will find anyone(even the Pope albeit he would never say it publicly) that agrees 100% with the Holy See. Peace be with you.