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Parenting- My Son and The Pink Ball

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by BooksJeansTea, Aug 13, 2013.

  1. BooksJeansTea

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    I'd like to get your thoughts on this stuff if you don't mind reading. :slight_smile:

    My son is 2.5 and he went on a shopping trip with his Nana (my mother) and I. He was being so good and I wanted to reward him so we stopped by the toy section where the bins with the inexpensive toys like bouncy balls, cars, little animals and other doodads are and I told him he could pick whatever he wanted from that section. He looked in all the bins and then decided he liked the spiky balls that light up. Everything was great until he decided that he wanted the pink one. I said, "Okay baby, hold onto it now- we can't throw it in the store" but Nana decided to intervene and said, "That's a pink ball! Pink is for girls! Don't you want a blue one?" she proceeded to take the ball from him and give him a blue one. He didn't want the blue one and got upset yelling "No- the pink one the pink one". I was angry so I gave her a rather frigid look and took the blue ball back to the bins. I told him to pick whatever ball he wanted and he picked up the pink one again. Nana got angry, "He needs to know how to act like a boy! If he doesn't learn he will be picked on in school!". He's a toddler! He isn't thinking anywhere in the ballpark of what she is thinking about.
    I know it's just a ball, but it's bigger than that in what it represents. I respect her as my mother but ultimately, he is my son. I want him to be comfortable being himself as he grows up. but I don't want him to get picked on in school. Am I wrong to not guide him as my mother suggests? Am I making him a target by not teaching him what is "acceptable"? I'm sure the world will make sure that he learns gender roles. Should I just suggest toys instead of giving him choices? If I am doing the right thing what happens next time if he picks something even more "girly"? How do I deal with explaining these things to my mother who definitely means well but just.. :rolle:.

    Thoughts anyone? :eusa_doh:
     
  2. Just Jess

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    I wouldn't worry too much about it just due to his age. Having some gender mismatch myself I've looked into this a little. There have been many studies and the American Psychiatric Association believes that gender identity in most people is formed between the ages of 3 and 7. Your child is a little young on average to even understand the differences.

    One of the best studies recently if you're still interested was an investigation into how girls and boys approach learning math differently, "Gender differences in mathematics: An integrative psychological approach.", by Cambridge University.

    But yeah, it's my entirely unprofessional opinion that your mother is just being a worrywart. If your son likes the pink ball, he likes the pink ball. Pink used to be for boys about 80 years ago believe it or not.
     
  3. Gen

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    No, you are allowing him to be himself and not let pointless stigmas cloud his life. Children often pick on each other about miniscule things; this is why the majority of the power that comes from child bullying is based on the victims reaction. If you are always there to instill in him that he should always be himself, not pay attention to the nonsense of others, and choose the things that truthfully make him comfortable. He shouldn't have any problems. (*hug*)
     
  4. suninthesky

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    You're right. Letting your son have that freedom could save a lot of angst in the long run. Stick to your guns.
     
  5. BooksJeansTea

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    Cassie- Right.. all he cares about is what strikes his fancy at the moment like every other kid his age. :slight_smile: I just don't want him thinking that he can't like this and he is supposed to like that.. but at the same time I don't want him to be a target for other kids because I failed him in some way.

    Gen- Thank you.. you're right kids will find something no matter what. I guess he is better protected by having confidence regardless of what others are doing.

    Sun- :slight_smile: Thanks.
     
    #5 BooksJeansTea, Aug 13, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2013
  6. Cassie is right, pink was considered a boy color 80 years ago-something about being closer to the strong color of red, while blue, considered more delicate, was a girl's color. But I digress...

    I definitely think this is nothing to worry about. Most boys his age like to put on their mom's heels (I did) and such, and girls his age probably also like playing with 'boyish' things. It's a normal toddler thing to do. Your mom, being older, has a bit of an old-fashioned mindset likely, but it is also nice that she's concerned about him being teased. However, it is kind of early to worry about that, and today's society is getting more accepting-I think society will be even more accepting by the time your son is in high school. I think you're doing the right thing letting your son express himself. You are also just being a good parent by worrying if he will get teased or not when older, and have a right to be. I think it's a good idea to sit your mom down and have a talk with her. Let her know that your kid may be teased for anything, not just gender identity or sexual orientation, and let her know that you appreciate her concern. However, ask for her respect with how you parent your child and let her know that times are changing. As for your kid, well, I can see the pickle you're in. Why not do both of what you suggested above? Pick some toys out for him sometimes as a surprise. Maybe buy him racecars or action figures, but also let him pick his own toys sometimes. Let him decide what he likes playing with, and take it from there. Good luck.
     
  7. BooksJeansTea

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    haha- yea. You know.. I think she has forgotten that her own son borrowed my barbie car quite frequently, and pretended to walk in high heels by putting golfballs in the heel of his socks and I was often found nicking his toys and outside making trails and forts with a machete. Granted, I guess I don't count in this conversation because I'm gay but.. the thought just struck me when I saw your post this morning.
     
  8. Runnerrunner

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    I have four kids from 16-21, and the one piece of advice that I wish I gotten as a new parent would be that we must parent the children we have and not the ones we wish or think we have. My point is that we really need to understand, as best we can what makes each of our little individuals tick and work to help that little person be his/her best. NOT force them to fit some preconceived notion of who we think they must become.

    My parents did hat and fucked me all up, and sadly I've parented in that way to some degree too. We tend to parent ideals instead of kids.

    Your mom sees good and bad in color, how screwed up is that?
     
  9. Sayu

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    You did well by letting your son choose what he wants! :slight_smile:
     
  10. Adi

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    I'd say that kids who would "target" a boy for having a pink ball are the ones who were failed.
     
  11. Choirboy

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    A kid that age really isn't seeing a color in terms of anything other that "pretty" or "not pretty". He wouldn't be capable of any kind of value judgement or association with another concept. Nana should back off a bit!

    Question--are you out to her? Is it possible that in her mind this is really about you (or suspicions about you) more than about your son? You'll probably have to keep an eye on some of her behavior to make sure you stop anything that you feel could have a negative effect on him OR you. My parents tolerated a lot of my quirky behavior that practically screamed "gay child here!", but I still ended up feeling that being gay wasn't really a viable choice. I'm still not sure if there was some undercurrent of theirs that I picked up on, or if I just set a bunch of unreal standards and expectations for my life which didn't include being gay as one of the choices. Either way, I'm mighty late coming out, but I learned enough from the experience that my two daughters are extremely gay-friendly although both are straight (my 12-year-old almost alarmingly so!). My 15-year-old posted some pro-gay messages on Facebook and took some heat for them from a few people, but she stood firm. If my bad experiences made them more open, and maybe cause them to help someone else, I guess they were worth it.
     
  12. Joanne

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    You did well to stick up for your son to be free to choose what he wants, keep at it.

    Feeling comfortable to be himself at home is vital for healthy development and growth, the most damaging thing this society tries to do is to attempt to beat the natural curiosity out of people, and its surely the cause of so much suffering in this world
     
  13. bipossible

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    ARGH! You have hit upon one of my push button issues. I am a pre-k teacher and do a lot of work around gender stereotypes and gender identity. It pushes my buttons because I am frustrated by the slowness of the progress we make on these issues, but that is my work. Anyway, I want to first congratulate you on standing up to your mother. She is operating under some outdated and, although well intentioned, misguided notions of what constitutes masculine and feminine. Cassie29 is right, pink used to be a boy color and in fact the blue and pink designations didn't come into play until the 1950s. It is all part of our market driven culture. Companies like Pottery Barn Kids and Target all want to package and market products so that you will buy more and more and more. It there were just green balls in the world and you had a boy and a girl you would just consume one ball for the family; however, if you are fed the notion that your boy has to have a blue one and your girl has to have a pink one you will buy two. Kaching!

    The pink vs. blue phenomenon is also driven by our deep seated homophobia in this country. As a culture we have constructed very rigid boxes defining what it is to be masculine (and feminine) and we want everyone to conform to that. This thus creates a culture of shame. Brené Brown has down some amazing research into this. I will share briefly the part about men. For men the message is that you can be and do anything you want just as long as you are not perceived as being weak. So if marketing has taught is that pink is a girl color and our culture has defined things related to girls as being weak and if homosexuality is also perceived as being feminine (because gay men are assumed to be in the passive role sexually) and weak, then the logical conclusion is that if a boy selects a pink ball he is being weak so thus he should be shamed back into the male box (bullied). Can you see how sick and twisted all this is?

    What you did by standing up to your mother is help change the flow of this distorted way of thinking. You were not only helping to curb the perpetuation of male stereotypes, but you were also helping to do women's work as well. Because if the above statements are held in place then we are also reinforcing that all things associated with femininity are to be presumed weak and inferior. It all helps to keep men on top. And BTW if you will notice by my profile I identify as male. I believe in order for the third generation feminist movement to move forward it will need to do so arm in arm with the men's movement.

    So BRAVO and thanks. Now as for the future playground issues, as a teacher and parent I would simple advise you to continue to help your son develop a positive sense of self and arm him with the courage and knowledge to be his authentic self.

    One final note: what I often share with my students when this issues comes up (and believe me it comes up every year) is I ask them, "Do colors have penises? If not, how can there be boy colors and girls colors. They are just colors. It's OK to like one color over another, but there are no special colors for certain types of people."

    You also might think about having a conversation with your mom about the whole homophobic chain I listed above. You are never to old to learn something new and useful.
     
  14. greatwhale

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    It starts even earlier than this, newborn boys are nearly always wrapped in blue blankets, or the little sign at the top of the cradle is blue, and girls are in pink.

    You absolutely did the right thing by letting your son choose what he likes, and it is not an unimportant event, it really shows the child that what he likes is validated, and respected.

    I wish that what I liked, simply what my preferences are, were respected when I was younger. Don't let others teach your child to deny himself, this absolutely has long-term consequences.
     
  15. BooksJeansTea

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    Thank you, everyone for your posts and support. After sleeping on it last night and reading some more this morning things are a lot clearer. It's easy to doubt myself because I am young if you haven't noticed and a single mom. I get a lot of judgment on that alone without adding to it my sometimes unorthodox parenting methods. He is a good kid though. He's two and says please and thank you. He is almost completely potty trained and he knows how to be gentle and kind to animals. He does pretty well for his age listening the first time and yet he has never been spanked. We use the naughty stool instead. I feel really bad actually about even considering trying to teach him to be "a boy" even though it was just to protect him. He was so sweet this morning when I got him ready and dropped him off at school and I wouldn't change a thing about him. It would hurt him so much more for his own mother to try to change him than any number of strangers. I remember the countless "makeovers" and trips to the cosmetics department. The string of diets I was put on in middle school... all with "good intentions", but "The road to hell is paved with good intentions".




    I never thought about that. No, I'm not out to her. That gives me a lot to think about. Thank you :slight_smile:

    :slight_smile: Congrats for having such great kids. I work in a high school and the few kids that stand strong like that are so rare. You must be a great parent. :thumbsup:


    Never thought about the market helping keep these stereotypes alive, but that makes sense.

    Yes, I can. It's really astounding isn't it that something as harmless as a pink ball can create such fear in people?

    Yes. :eusa_clap

    I was just protecting my son. Thank YOU for your well thought out and informative post. I would never want him to be anything that he is not and fully intend to support him no matter what. Straight, gay, trans, gators fan, or mathlete it makes no difference to me as long as he is happy.
    HAHA, "Do colors have penises?". Love it. :eusa_clap

    Yes. I do need to have a conversation with her about all of it. I think that if I could get her to understand the harm that it could cause she would back off. I also need to speak with her about boundaries in general. She is so used to being in the mother role that she is missing an opportunity to just sit back and be the loving grandparent that gets to spoil her grandson.
     
  16. biAnnika

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    You were SO right, and I'm so happy you were strong enough to stand up to your mom! The whole "color propriety" thing is rubbish...entirely constructed by society. The whole "teach him how to act like a boy" thing is rubbish. Teach him how to be himself: if he's a boy, he'll pick up on society's rules for boys on his own at the right ages...and decide for himself whether he wants to obey them...and learn the consequences of conforming or not conforming. He loves pink now (at least in that ball)...he may love pink for the rest of his life, or he may love pink for a couple years or a couple weeks.

    Sure if he gets to school and takes pink toys, *some* kids will tease him (or at least comment)...and he'll have an early opportunity to learn to stand up for himself, to set the ignorant straight (there are no such things as boy/girl colors), to gain some integrity. And you'll be in a position to help him with that...it sounds like you're off to a great start already! *hugs*
     
  17. PeteNJ

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    Its a pink ball. Not gay porn.

    You did right. Nana, while well meaning, needs to get with the times.

    Used to run into this with my mother, and honestly, she was too ingrained to get it. Pick your fights/battles.
     
  18. BooksJeansTea

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    Thank you all. I hope she is not too ingrained. :/
     
  19. Emberblaze

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    I saw about 14 straight guys wearing pink shirts today, one of them being a married teacher with a baby on the way.

    I'm a gay male, and I own approximately 2 pink shirts (i know this for certain because my closet is color coordinated).

    So ma'am, no, you aren't wrong for letting him pick a color he wants. It's a color. No offense, but your mom took one small frivolous possibility and stretched it into a contorted improbability. You're son'll be fine, just let him grow up being who he wishes to be (and, of course, still be a parent in the areas where it matters!)
     
  20. Californiacoast

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    More than the color is the awesome gift of choice you were giving your son. Good for you for protecting it. Oh too quickly we have to learn to blend in to society constructs. The innocence of a child is a precious thing. I saw recently where a Dad wore a dress because his elementary school son wanted to wear one. Now that takes guts! Father of the year status if you ask me.