Gender Identity Female--Would Love Your Input

I've missed you Zoe!

As a child of the 70s, I was raised more gender neutrally than kids are now. My blocks etc. were not pink. My parents bought me a dollhouse, barbies, remote control cars, racetracks, science kits, a little of everything. And I played with it all. I had a play group from age 2 on with boys and girls.

As I got older, I was interested in fashion and makeup. When I was first experimenting withy sexuality, I thought I had to deny my femininity and be more butch. Well that did not feel authentic at all. I don't wear dresses, etc, to get a man AND I don't think a woman had to dress like I do to be a real woman. Far from it. I'm just happy that I don't have to prove anything by the way I dress or express myself.

I'm really glad that I was raised the way I was - and didn't think that certain toys were for boys. I'm trying to raise my daughter the same way. The girl v boy stuff starts way earlier than I expected. Feel free to ask any follow up questions!

 

Hi Zoe. I don't think my views of "traditional gender roles" were affected nearly as much by consumerism as they were by my mother. She was the typical 50's housewife and to this day maintains that same perspective. She's probably the most sexist person I know.

So when I was a girl and climbed a tree, she'd tell me to get down. When I'd straddle a chair she'd tell me to sit the right way and cross my legs. When I was in High School and asked for chapstick she'd hand me lipstick and tell me it worked just as well. The reason she thought I should go to college was so I could be a better educated, more imformed mother for those future children I had always sworn to her that I was never going to have. She impressed upon me that I could be anything I wanted to be, as long as that included being a wife and mother. Ever since I got married, she sends my mail to Mrs. Husband's First Name, Surname.

I told her I was getting a divorce, so she called my soon-to-be ex to convince him that we are perfect for each other, that he is the best possible husband for me. Can't imagine what her reaction would be finding out that the best possible husband for me is a wife!!!

But to answer the second part of your question, I do believe that there is slowly a new definition forming out there, and I do believe it's a positive one - even though it seems our patriarchal society isn't happy with the implications of it. More and more women are choosing not to marry. And among those who do marry, a larger number than ever are consciously choosing not to procreate. I think the young women of today ARE redefining the archaic gender role by feeling quite comfortable in creating their own definitions - as unique as each woman is herself. And I think it's absolutely awesome!

 

Hi Zoe! Glad to see you back!

What an interesting question! I'm raising a daughter and she has done quite a few "girly" things like ballet, etc. Her mother does have an enormous influence on her.

I see you have "met" our dear Dragonbait, she is very entertaining and a wonderful poster. I look forward to the intellectual sparkle between you two!

For example:

Unbelievable! People still do that???!!!

Dragonbait, you might as well have some oxygen and maybe a syringe dose of epinephrine at the ready when you tell her about having a wife!

 

Oh Greatwhale, no surprise you're posting an answer to a question posed to "women and anyone who identifies as female". Told you that you were Such. A. Girl. (oops, am I now the one perpetuating outdated gender roles?)

Anyway. I'm not sure if "People" still do that, but my mother sure as hell does! (And she's more demon than real person.)

And no, if I ever decide to tell her about my potential future wife, I'll just have the casket lined up to catch her, because total heart failure is pretty much the only possible outcome if I were to do that. :dead:

Oh, and p.s., thanks for the lovely compliments!

 

I am a child of the sixties and I grew up with five brothers and no sisters. I was given girly things as a child but preferred the toys that my brothers played with. By the time I was about ten my mom had given up on bringing me up as girly.

In junior high I played the flute in band. We were to wear a black skirt and white blouse to our fall concert. I refused. I showed up in pants. My mom was totally fine with it.

I remember wearing boyish type stuff at that age too. I remember being called a dyke but I did not know what that meant at the time.

I don't know if I was influenced by anybody. I do know that the fight for female equality was pretty important to my mom so maybe she did have some influence by letting me be who I wanted to be and dress the way I wanted to dress. I look back at my high school yearbook pictures (I was on the yearbook staff) and I'm in plaid flannel and hiking boots all the time. It was the style though.

I went through a phase where I wore dresses because I was influenced by my fundamentalist church. I NEVER felt comfortable and for obvious reasons.

So, who influenced me? Probably my family if anybody.

 

That's kinda how I came out to my step (forever) Mom. Told her I had never wanted a husband. That I had always wanted a wife. (Since '87) but it wasn't a possibility back then. She said you should tell your Dad. I did. They were supportive. No issues. A few minutes later we were laughing on another topic. The sad-funny here is They have always been LGBT supportive. I was raised thousands of miles away by homophobic psycho bitch mother.....
I was told if you did not like girly clothes/make up/shopping...up blah blah blah you wanted to be a man/lesbian roflmao::tears I could only wear clothes she bought. Ick! I actually got sent home in 6th grade for a shirt that was inappropriate for school. Yes even at that age she tried to make me a "sex object". At 12 she found out I was a lesbian- Don't remember a conversation or event . (Probably forgot due to getting the gay knocked out of my head)
And I used to get those Mrs. Name of ex addressed mail. Was also taught you never say no to your husband.....gee maybe that's why I didn't date until 30....and got myself into a very fucked up marriage that I only recently started to realized the extent of its fuckedupedness.

 

Cont: The odd thing is that I was allowed to have matchbox cars at 5 or 6..skateboard later on. But at 10 though knew it was essential for my survival to read "Tiger Beat" and pick a crush...

 

Hi, Zoe. I'd say that my parents had the biggest external influence on my development, each in their own way. My mother was VERY nontraditional--my dad was her third husband, she worked as a bush pilot in between husbands, and she lived in Europe for a while. Based on her interests and history, I grew up thinking that girls could do anything they wanted. In fact, I really enjoyed being at home with my family, and thought a desire to be at home was wrong--I thought I needed to move to a far-away city to really be an adult.

My dad was very traditional. His family modeled traditional gender roles and the belief that men are intelligent and interesting, in contrast to women. I am very much like my dad in interests and the way our minds work, so I ended up really identifying with him and being very confused about how I fit in as a girl--I am absolutely nothing like his very traditional mother or my stepmother. My mother had a lot of issues, but I am very glad that I had her influence. If I had been raised with the traditional women in my dad's family, I think I would have been very unhappy. I lived with my dad and stepmother for a while in high school, and felt a lot of pressure from my stepmother to dress better and start wearing make-up. I did not feel any acceptance from her of who I am.

As far as consumer items went, my brother and I were both given toys we wanted, which included typically 'male' toys like bb guns, science kits, and microscopes. My favorite color has always been blue, so my first scooter and bike were both blue. Even in pictures from very early childhood, I was never dressed in pink, although some outfits were clearly intended for girls, with ruffles or smocking.

 

I'm also a child of the 70s. As I remember products weren't divided in pink and blue as they are now. I grew up in a communist country and the truth is that one was lucky to even buy the product one wanted.
To be honest, I wouldn't say that toys influenced me. My parents bought me both "boy" and "girl" toys but I just always enjoyed myself more playing with "toys for boys".
And I was very creative. My parents gave me a doll buggy, I took a hacksaw and rebuilt it into some kind of a skateboard. I played with dolls as well, but the truth is I used them as a target more. I made myself a crossbow from wooden clothes pegs and a bow from a tree branch and a string. I had a "normal" bicycle but I gave it a BMX look. :icon_wink
Oh, and, what I hated, we were forced to wear prescribed clothes for PT class at the elementary school but it was white t-shirts and blue briefs-like shorts for girls and white undershirts and red shorts for boys so absolutely "gender opposite" colours. Haha.

 

I grew up in a gender stereotype family, very overbearing father who was damn sure certain that I wouldn't be queer. He only allowed me boy type games and toys. He wanted me to play football and to wrestle. I joined the wrestling team because it was fun to have so much physical contact with other boys. It was my way of saying fuck you to him. He thought I was doing it to be macho. I laughed about it all the way through high school. I had realized that I was gay by age seven and took every chance to wear feminine clothing whenever possible.

 

hi ZOE...
whopper of a question,eh. The answer is so personal, in each person, that I flee from any notion I should have anything useful to add. That being said; I guess it is heavy on peer pressure ( their interpretations of meaningplaced on gender labels. We learn from others what to think ( we we are passively inactive in our ownership of our thoughts)..we accept the uniformity of meanings..so-called 'values' and assign certain color-coding to each new person, place or thing. Are they 'gay', are they girl-based, butch-based, etc. I s the pink a girl? Does 'Bubba' wear black 'cause he iz a real man?...on and on..
This very subject is so central to a lot of folks searching for themselves..their place amongst the banners/labels/ head-trips. Am I a gay guy, am I a girl in a male body, am I a this..that. The list rolls on...and that is before I even put my hands on that cute little number in the closet ( which is not male )
parents...friends...peers...bullies...yow!!!!!! what a strained mess that causes us to think & react as we do. Some less than others, for sure..but we are all deeply affected by every darn thing in our lives from day one!:tears::eek:

 

The whole butch:femme thing seems both anachronistic & off putting to me and yet I still find it interesting as related to your topic Zoe.

I'll think about it and come back!

 

I remember being a kid in the 90s when McDonald's were doing their Barbie v Hot Wheels happy meals thing, and being laughed at and mocked by my friends mum for asking for the Hot Wheels one. I think McDonald's did that a few times in the 90s and I hated it. I always felt embarrassed for not wanting the 'girl toy'.

(I just remembered the whole Barbie V Hot Wheels thing when reading the op, man hot wheels cars were/are cool!)

 

Wow, those are some long forgotten memories! One friend and I would get together to "play barbies" and would spend hours building an entire apartment complex, or mansion from whatever we could lay hands on, then once it was constructed to our absolute satisfaction, we'd look at the dolls, then at each other and decide that we'd played quietly inside long enough and it was now time to go run in the woods! She ended up becoming a forest ranger!