Hi, I am want to ask those married, kids and 40+ something.... No offence to others but I see it as a different situation. I have always known I was gay but I rejected the gay stereotypes of the 70's. There were no gay role models beyond transvestites and flamboyant, effeminate personalities in the public eye. I was neither of those things and only had my own limited experience to go by. I am sure most of you can relate. I wanted from life a job, a home, and a stable relationship. In my experience and the culture of the time it was next to impossible for a openly gay man who rejected the gay scene because it was not relatable. So after a number of failed relationships with closeted men I gave up and married a woman. In my experience closeted men loved and protected their closet above all other things. So for obvious reasons the marriage failed but I hung in enough years to raise my kids. So I am 50+, finally out, and gay culture has not changed. Few healthy venues to meet, hook-ups and casual, open relations the rule, with few 50+ gay men who have anything to offer beyond what gay culture of the 60-70's trained them to seek. I know there are guys like me out there but they are invisible as they too reject gay culture, or they give up and dive into hook-ups, and open, casual relationships. So is this the norm for those of us over 40, married, kids and finally out? Tom
Hi Tom I haven't gotten out there yet, but I hope its not the norm. My biggest fear is that I go through all this and never find any meaningful relationship. I don't think I would really be interested in the hook up scene.
Hi, I have the same hopes but I have only seen gay men who share my views in committed, stable relationships [gay marriages] (over ten years usually) in gay accepting churches or related venues. My other experience is lateral discrimination by gay men my age for abandoning the gay cause and marrying a woman. I did attend a Meetup group of much older gay men (70-75+) who accept the married paradigm but part of me says; when you are elderly, have a cane, a stoop, and hearing aids and find yourself gay and alone you will say/accept anything for companionship. Horrible thought. I never want to be that elderly gay man. Also... Online dating, bars are super unhealthy places in my experience. If you do use online dating always look at "longest relationship" and for the 40+ gay on the sites it is usually <2 years. Most of us married gays have been able to maintain even a married/gay, severely adverse relationship for much longer than that. We do have relationship skills not found in the gay community generally. We know there is no perfect relationship and work on them versus abandoning them in under 2 years. I see most gays seeking shallow perfection and never find it as it is an oxymoron and these gays keep moving on treating partners like Kleenex. Just my experience and observations since May 2013. I am sure there are good partners out there, just rare 40+. Tom
This is something that terrifies me. At the moment I am at home with my wife and kids - life could be bearable in that, I could try marriage counselling to see if I can rekindle the sexual desire for my wife that has disappeared since the epiphany I had with the guy I met. She is loving, kind and loves me completely. I love my kids. We are financially comfortable (at the moment) and I live in a good area. I often think to myself - is what I am about to do going to be worth it? Am I condemning myself and my wife/kids to a few years of financial difficulty, pain and sadness that we are all living apart and for me not to find a meaningful relationship with another man? Maybe I'm being to 'hetero' in my view of relationships? Talking to the guy I was with he seemed to believe the consensus out there that 3 years was a long time to be in a same sex relationship. I don't want to lurch from one guy to another as, at 41 and still relatively fit (and not bad looking either ) I might find age turns against me as I get older. I already see posts on various sites requesting only guys aged 25 - 35 get in touch. Some of the 40+ ones describe themselves as 'ancient'...! It's all pretty depressing as I look to start out at the age I'm at. I suppose I should have a bit of faith in myself.
Hey, It can be rough at times. I faced the same decision as you have now and I left the marriage. Even though things are tough when my sister suggests "go back to your wife" the thought of that is worse. I am gay I could not live the lie anymore. Do I share a lot of values with the gay scene, no but there is one guy out there, maybe more and I will find him. I am also convinced to look for him amongst gay men who were married. They have uncommon relationship skills hard to find in the gay world. They have skills and turned to open honesty. Can you ask for more? There is hope, don't let the stereotypes thwart you. Tom
Skiff - I empathise so much with your dilemnia. I don't have kids and not married - but in the past only had hetero relationships even altho I knew I was gay along. I have now come out to everyone (2 years ago) and now 50 years old. The whole decision to come out has been the right one, for one simple reason... I am now being totally honest with myself and the world. However, I also am (to be very honest) pretty cautious/terrified of the whole gay scene. I have begun to make friends with other gay men (in their 30s to 60s) through a local walking group and through a gay mens therapy group, but I know I have been avoiding looking for relationships (of both the casual or long term type). My initial perception was that many gay men in their 40s and 50s who came out in their youth do seem to fit many of the stereotypes I always feared. However, I have begun to realise that i have been doing an odd thing... When i went on my first walks with my gay walking group all I seemed to see were slightly camp men who seemed to be over-sexed and fitting all my worse stereotypes. So much so I almost ran straight back into the closet, but I stuck with the group (ditto with my therapy group) and now those same men turn out to be as mixed a bunch of people as you could meet anywhere (or any sexuality), some are single and not in relationships, some get involved in the gay scene, some are in long term stable gay relationships. My internal homophobia was so strong when I first came out that I couldn't see this variety. Have you found this too? I guess what I am saying is that 'coming out' is a massive decision and can impact massively on people (esp if you are married with kids), but I guess will all do it because our own integrity and authenticity is paramount? I am now trying to continue to show integrity and authenticity as an openly gay man. I am not interested in many of the gay stereotypes. I want an committed relationship with a man, not one night stands or emotionally unbalanced flings and so that is what I am looking for. It is hard because there are less of us (gay men as a whole and gay men who are looking for similar things) but they/we are out there. Also I am beginning to realise that many gay men who have lived for years on the gay scene - although they habitually might still take part in it - are also looking for something different. I guess all we can do is stay true and be patient Good luck in your own journey
Hi, Yes, non gay venues attract a variety of gay people. While dating sites and bars are the worst places. I have attended Meetup groups with diverse ages and sensibitities. It is kind of weird in one regard... In blending in with straight guys certain elements always drooled and panted over woman. Annoyed me even as I could not appreciate what they were drooling over. Gay groups do the same thing but at least I can appreciate it.
So i did it. I joined a meetup group and they have a meeting in a week or so. I just cant sit around anymore wondering how i will meet people for friends or otherwise. I have to start somewhere. I emailed the organizer and she said the group is small but good group of people. So i will start there and see where it takes me. Im not the most outgoing person so maybe a small group to start will be good. I was thinking of joing a dating site but ive heard so many horror stories.
Skiff, Dude, I'm with you. I've often thought that gays are a whole separate species, and now I'm wondering if the formally-married gay is a species within the species. It's funny to think that I have long-term relationship skills from being married for so long and hiding in the closet and that those skills make me a kind of gay anomaly (as far as stereotypes go, that is). I think you're right that a lot of "us" are hard to meet because we're not out there. My plan at this point is to just have patience and to wait until he appears. The guy that prompted me to leave the closet appeared just that way. I just happened to sit at his table at a work thing. My life forever changed. I DID meet someone wonderful in an online dating site. He had been in a long term (gay) relationship, so he has those LTR skills. I know that he's only one example, but I proved that they're out there. I just wasn't ready. In fact, I met a few guys that were interested in long term relationships. We're all in this shitfest together!
You know the difference between chimpanzees and bonobos? Both species live in the Congo separated by a river. Chimpanzees are male dominated and physically aggressive. Bonobos are female dominated and settle conflicts with sex. It is reported most bonobos are bisexual. Not a bad analogy to gays and straight humans. http://spacecollective.org/Feroze/2283/Bonobo
